Acer Predator (Vega 56+Ryzen 2) Helios 500

Most laptops today have only 2 ram slots And most of those are easly to upgrade the ram sticks. Once you have open up the bottom lid... 30 sec job.

 

It's usually a head first dive into rushing to market with the best available information at the time, months later you can't go back and change things midstream that cost money, but you can do engineering changes and software fixes up to a point, before the team is put on the next project.

That's why over time things evolve toward a better and better deliverable, as long as the previous generation sold well enough and made a profit, it gets a remake, with upgraded components and design changes - within budget - which sometimes must be done in stages, a little better this generation with an eye toward even better in the next.

Until the base changes - socket, technology, etc, then you start over again.

That's why AMD's reentry is slow, and not all things are "best", as reliable and safe to sell for a good price are more important targets to hit so that they can make a successful line that they can build on.

If you like the idea, but the color isn't your favorite, buy it anyway - vote with your dollars, it should help direct money toward future upgrades, if the interest is enough to build into another generation, you can upgrade to that one - but if you don't buy / support the early builds you may not get a chance to buy an improved version.

Just because you have the worlds best mouse trap, doesn't mean it will be successful. Many many people must buy it, use it, and continue to support it over a long period of time.

So many things have to go right to move things forward, and continue moving them forward.

That's why HP Design / Engineering Meetings look for the positives and Eliminate the Negatives (Rule 5)

Simple criticism's are easy, instead work to focus on the positive's, to be positive in appreciation and uplift the recognition of benefits.

Those aren't marketing department recommendations either, that's all for the design and engineering staff.

 

I meant more I have no idea what a reseller like XOTICPC or HID would think about selling the Helios 500.

 

I wasn't talking about any specific boutique dealer, just in general about the build to order realm of laptop / desktop sales, which hundreds or even thousands of outlets worldwide do every day, and they already sell Acer laptops.

The quantity of production for many new designs are usually limited, so for now it's an academic question.

When there is a larger broader awareness of AMD CPU / GPU price performance in the buying population, and production is increased to meet the demand, with more makers building models growing the market over time, then I think any seller that wants to sell product that is in demand will step up to offer what they think their shop can sell.

 

I understand that just a little confused since it wasnt what I was pointing to lol, all good though.

 

I removed the unrelated quoted reply text, sorry if it was confusing.

 

Ah its no worries

 

This really hit me. The price went down to $1749 so I scraped around a few CC benefits/cashbacks etc (mainly to keep wife happy. I ask her to keep me in check).
I'm proud to get it at this amount, as I want to support the initiative for AMD in laptops!

 

Oh wow the price dropped 100 USD from yesterday lol

Lookin forward to trials with the Helios 500.

 

Getting this beast tomorrow Force willing.

Please let me know of any benchmarks/tests you’d like to see.

My plan is to bench stock then switch ram to 2666mhz and put my nvme 500gb ssd.

Edit: ram might be more challenging and warranty voiding for now. Perf difference doesn’t seem significant (1%-5%)

 

Laptop just landed (thank God!), raw thoughts:
+ Love the keyboard travel
+ Never going back to anything slimmer than this (closet thick laptop lover coming out!)
+ Comes with Windows 1709
+ Memory is 2400mhz (after light research, perf differences are negligible but will get in touch with Acer for some form of reimbursement or credit. Again, for the price, I won't be too butthurt if they say nay!)
+ Cool acer sound on startup.
+ On the size, I don't find it that heavy. I can easily carry it to work meetings and set the tone against usual slim laptops managers/pms lug around
+ Touchpad has Windows Precision!!!!! (awesome when having remote desktops and switching between them without minimizing window)
+ The keyboard has so much TRAVEL!!!!! Won't feel the need to use my mechanical one as much.
+ MSI GP63/GP73 power adapter fits in the power socket, but doesn't charge (it's a 180w brick). I was expecting it would at least charge it (anyone with info why please fill me in!)

 

Well I am glad that the keyboard is well liked, its a peculiar requirement I cant have checked off on a laptop lol

 

OMG Linus youtube channel is so sleezy and sensationalist. When he compares the sizes to other laptops, they are very slim and 15 inch dare i say. Here's a comparison with MSI GP73. Helios 500 is hardly bigger in terms of dimensions.

 

Just joined specifically for this. I'll be receiving mine in a week. "Please let me know of any benchmarks/tests you’d like to see." I'm interested in seeing how well of a 4k editor this turns out to be. Not sure if you use Premier Pro or Resolve, but those would be great tests/benchmarks to run.

 

I unfortunately don't have those. Is there a benchmark that shows off the capability they rely on?

 

Still learning my way around Zen/Ryzen platform. Tweaking Ryzen Master and very impressed with scores.

I'm climbing frequency and lowering voltages.

Current progress/milestone:

Then I try to reduce voltage while keeping stability to reduce temperatures. If anyone knows what I can do to push scores higher, holla back

1818 on Cinebench R15 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!THANK GOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


3d Mark (Undervolted graphics -25mV)

 

Let me know if one of these might be representative:
https://www.blender.org/download/demo-files/

 

Acer Helios 500 (Ryzen is a Beast) Great Job Acer/AMD and May The Force Bless You!!! self.Amd
Submitted 2 hours ago by Elizer0x0309
https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/9zvjnj/acer_helios_500_ryzen_is_a_beast_great_job/

 

Lol that’s me! Spreading the word

 

So, if pressing the cooling system, I'd check blender and sisoft Sandra. I usually start with CB for voltage, then move onto V-Ray by Chaos Group, Cortana, wPrime 1024 ran back to back. Then blender and sisoft.

Aside from that, start with lowering voltages and seeing a pattern for each step on multiplier. This way you get it as low as possible. Then, memory speed or timings can help with scores/performance. Don't know what is allowed on the platform.

Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk

 

I've never been one to fall for the whole 'slimmer', Starbucks-going, hipster (doofus) crowd which has been hoodwinked by Apple and others into thinking EVERY single laptop needs to be 4 mm thick or they won't use it. Give me a break... I used to love how envy would enter their eyes after I pulled the ole x7200 beastie from its bag, power it up, sit back and laugh as thick LGA based laptops would destroy their benchmarks, core counts, and FPS levels of their overpriced BGA garbage as they always try to compare.

 

Lol i can’t wait for Monday meetings where I get this baby out! What a pleasure! Finally getting the power I paid for

Also want to thank all this community for knowledge and illumination. Slapped a link in the reddits as I believe there's more learning and questions answered here. Thank You ALL!!!

 

Hey if anything were just plugging what we already know about Ryzen here so as to better tune the machine when people get their hands on it.

Anything new will basically fall unto you and other owners to share lol

 

Working to reduce temps. CPU stabilizes at ~85 Degrees on high load, Here's my config on ryzen master (MSI Afterburner has -25Mv fyi; don't know if that helps).
Cooler Boost in Predator Sense enabled (more aggressive fan curve I believe)

 

You are just shy of 4.1Ghz on all cores?

Awesome lol

 

Whenever I set 4.1 it crashes after a few seconds on CB15. The interesting thing is it crashes after temps go over 94 degrees. So I'm thinking it's a protection mechanism for the laptop....? Not complaining. Like to have safety mechanisms and I'm more than grateful anything above 1700 tbh

 

Honestly I would just set 4.0Ghz and be happy with that, quite an achievement. This is after repaste or stock paste?

 

Stock paste. I noticed that the fan curve doesn't catchup to quick rising temperatures and it would shutdown sometimes. Unfortunately Predator Sense doesn't have fan curve editing like MSI for example.

So If I know laptop will be crunching numbers, I'll set it to manual/max while the task is being done.

 

Does opening it up void the warranty? Replacing the paste might do wonders.

The spike is likely due to stock paste. This was quite common on Haswell machines when they released and as a result Liquid metal became commonplace for users with XM/MX chips. Not sure I would recommend LM right off the bat since i dont know what the heatsink is made of but replacing the paste may be a good mitigating strategy.

 

I'll check with warranty and jump on that! Good tip!

Also I noticed that the "Cool Boost" option isn't enabled on boot. Even though the toggle shows. When I bench, I noticed fans don't kick in even close to 90 degrees and it crashes. When I toggle on/off again, I definitely feel/hear them kick in at 85 degrees and machine remains stable. Will file a bug.

 

Sounds like an issue with the Fan tables.

That issue is widespread on the Alienware 17, fans kick on too late and would cause the system to crash or throttle. We got around this with Liquid Metal for the most part or modding the fan tables on the unlocked BIOS with MX chips. The last method, which is available to you already is to force max fan speed. Luckily you have this via software so no need to cut PWM wires and such.

Generally, all laptops need a repaste after purchase. Its the one and only thing all OEMs cant seem to ever get right on the assembly line.

 

honestly speaking, the fan kicking in too late dates back since forever. whats really going down is chips getting more cores and running hotter, while OEM reducing heatsink size so capacity decreases. that puny heatsink can only hold so much heat.

i recently had a good experience in tweaking one of a BGA laptop for my friend he has the aero 15. TS shows PL1 at 50w, PL2 at 70w, PL2 last 28 sec by default. having CPU at 70w for 28sec sets the CPU to around 80C, if longer (tested by setting PL1=PL2 run for 2 mins) then it'll start climbing upwards 85C so really the capacity is only that much, but the dissipation may not be powerful enough.

all in all, these OEM designed by basing off these numbers so machine is guarantee to come crippled. back in the days they'd give us thicker/bigger heatsinks and even if fans were slow to spin up, it'd be fine (which imo is a nice design due to noise, while heatsink itself without any fan does have some dissipation).

another example is my current 870TM. a burst of ~85w that lasts more than 5 sec would result my CPU temp going over 80C, fan doesnt start spinning until like 15sec later. manual fan control is great but have to deal with constant noise level, especially fan speed switching. setting manual fan sw to like 25% would deal with the burst loads.

 

Ah got it! At this point, I might set the manual profile to have 70% fan speed and that will give me a quick toggle between Auto - 70% and Max modes (there are only three options).

 

I also recently tuned an Aero 15x, on that machine you can leave it at PL2 indefinitely and temps were around 85c for 3.9Ghz but those temps were expected for such a small machine and on stock paste. Of course though, this was with CPU only tests. CPU + GPU test would very likely push it over the edge without repaste and further undervolting.

The Helios 500 looks like it has a decent heatsink for the heat it is packing. Its likely the stock paste and the current fan tables arent optimal.

 

have u tried hwinfo64? the guys who make that software can usually control Dell/alienware laptop and their fan speed. the software might allow more speeds/adjustments than what it comes by default from alienware, which is trashy.

alienware was great back in the days i was a proud owner, until they all go cheap on us, cutting here and there, then purposely getting rid of us enthusiast so theres nobody left to inform consumers about the shady stuff they do.

its one of those thing that big corporation do best you know. rid of old employees who understands value/benefits and by making packages for onetime small lumpsum payment to bait inexperienced workers to have them vote for the package.

 

yea to improve more they'd need to repaste and that would probably help another 2-3C, stock paste is such a joke really. i undervolted for the guy and set his pl2 to 65w instead of 70w for longevity and battery. hes running on average of 3.7ghz with that pl2 level. bigger the heatsink the better, wish i could get a giant heatsink in my 870tm.

if that water cooling rumor from clevo is real then i'll just grab that. CPU share heat with GPU is no problem i only got a 1070, undervolted/underclocked too. all hail for CPU 5ghz

 

We ended up taking the machine back. 4K panel had issues with any application (Scaling issues) and the replacement 144hz machine had significant backlight bleed to the point that it couldnt produce even semi-accurate colors. I tuned each of them and both did well in that regard, if he wanted to, he could've placed 10 and 13th place iirc on hwbot with it.

I rather liked the laptop, if it was as advertised. Lack of QC ruined it for him. Hes getting a used AW 13 R3 7700hq / 1060 machine.

 

oh god at this point i wouldnt recommend anyone for 4 cores laptop over a 6 core. the new 6 core runs rather efficient as long as u keep the frequency low.

 

You took the Aero 15x back, or a Clevo?

Confused, I didn't think you bought a Predator Vega 56 Ryzen 2 Helios 500, did you?

 

4 cores is perfectly adequate for a 13" laptop. Its not a daily driver, he's got his own desktop at present and plans to build a Ryzen 8+ core desktop next year. The laptop has no need to be 6 core in the slightest. Especially when 6 core laptops in that form factor overheat out of the box and require tuning + repaste to not have overheat, which is a far cry from running where I would want it. He wants a machine that will do well on the battery for a while and/or lay down on the couch or the occasional gaming at a friends.

Took the Aero 15x back. Sorry I have a bad habit of not using the quote function here as it requires an extra step.

The QC was terrible. 4K model had scaling issues and later lead to artifacting all over the screen. Resolved with a reboot but not an issue you want to see on day 1 of having the machine. Lots of ghosting as well. The 144hz 1080p panel has severe backlight bleed.

 

The 95 degrees is where I noticed it would shutdown. Confirmed in HWinfo

 

did that hwinfo64 works as a fan control software for your alienware?

 

Nope not seeing in the Helios 500

 

well figures, its acer laptop afterall

 

Unfortunately fan just doesn't kick in quick enough, so temps near 90+ and computer crashes at 95 degrees. (i really wish we could control fan curves, but not a big deal given perf gains!)

With the "MAX" fan profile you can easily hit 1830s on Cinebench r15 but can't expect for me to rely on that manual step.

Here is the config that has survived repetitive stress tests with Acer's "AUTO" fan profile (Temps remain at low 80 degrees during benching and idle at 37 degrees) (thank the force)
Cinebench R15= 1760-1795

 

Got in touch with Acer and they said that you can repaste without voiding warranty(will call later/tomorrow to confirm in case of misunderstanding)

 

So, you could create a couple OC profiles and quick switch them in Ryzen Master (I prefer bios, but...).

Meanwhile, def need to do memory tuning on that beast. 2400@CL17 17 17 is show and loose. You can gain significant performance with a ram OC. I'm running 3466@CL14 15 15 right now, IIRC.

I'd recommend getting TM5 0.12 ( http://testmem.tz.ru/testmem5.htm ), thaiphoon burner ( http://www.softnology.biz/ ), ryzen timing calculator (this is as a guide, not a be all, end all to mem OC: https://www.techpowerup.com/download/ryzen-dram-calculator/ ), ryzen timing checker ( www.techpowerup.com/download/ryzen-timing-checker/ ), HCI memtest ( https://hcidesign.com/memtest/ ), and if you want ramtest ( https://www.karhusoftware.com/ramtest/ ). This will get you closer to tighter timings or faster frequency (calc), which can import from what was read on thaiphoon burner, then at least primary timings and frequency changed in Ryzen master, checked by timing checker, tested for stability with TM5 and HCI (or ram test), then generally stability tested.

Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk

 

Hooolyyyyy! Bless you and Thank You! Will get on this, this week and report back progress and journey! Gracias

 

Decided to take a stab, It doesn't seem to apply the ram overclocking. After changing this to let's say 1333Mhz

It'll ask to restart and after restart, it stays at 1200Mhz.

 

My experience with RAM overclocking is very small. But with my m4600 you had to edit the XMP profile on all sticks for it to kick in.

Used R/W Everything to that which isnt for everyone.