I must be getting old, I like my m18x better than the m18

Don't be hatin too much on Apple. Design wise they are pretty much the elite. Have you guys seen the newest Mac Pro? Pretty bold move, but original.

Yup that is a computer....

 

Probably they're going to say that it looks like a garbage-bin or a black cylinder of nothingness.

No, that's more than a computer: that's innovation and great performance you're looking at

 

I agree with that. If everyone felt they were as boring to look at as I do, nobody would own them. I'm not criticizing anyone for having an opinion that MacBooks are attractive laptops. We don't need to agree on everything.

 

I agree

 

Some people felt that a photograph of a jar filled with urine and a crucifix was "art" too. I thought it was sacrilegious nonsense that was overrated.

Looks like a black cylinder of nothingness to me. Good call on that one. My garbage bins have a bit more character than that design. I wonder why they chose to make it look so goofy? Publicity stunt? Or, maybe a glossy monochrome sphere would take too much effort?

 

People are often afraid of what they don't understand; it makes them feel threatened in their own comfort zone. In history several generations have failed to appreciate genius and innovation that was way ahead of their times when they met it. You mention an extreme case of sacrilegious art, but what about Galileo's claims and Darwin's theories? What about Leonardo Da Vinci and Van Gogh's art? At some point they were all met with scorn and mockery, and in same cases accused of being sacrilegious too. There is bad and good art. Some art is an aesthetic effort in itself (a means to its end-art for art's sake) while other is loaded with meaning that goes beyond its immediate appearance. Some art, on purpose, tries to be shocking and irreverent, often bashing against religious symbols in order to get media attention and convey its protesting message. In such cases, usually audience is not asked to agree with how the piece of art is put together and its questionable objects (urine, feces, and vomit as it's unfortunately seen in some disgusting cases)--it's more a wake-up call (right or wrong) that the artist wants to make in order to speak his mind. Sacrilege is not in what they may present us with, but it's in the way we want to interpret and view reality according to our subjective and not-at-all universal beliefs. For example, the idea of people eating cow and pork is considered sacrilegious to some religion; still, we eat and promote consuming such meats conscious that our action is blasphemous to some culture. Do we stop it? nope, because it's all about points of views. A dogmatic understanding of life never benefits anyone.

Back to the "black cylinder of nothingness," Apple desktop is to me both innovating and changing the way we understand desktop. Considering some derogatory comments I often read in this forum about Apple, I have to say that history, repeating itself as usual, shows that many understand the world according to certain milestones each set in their lives: "this" is acceptable, "that" cannot be. Change is painful it seems. For decades desktops simply looked like plain drawers, then like white anonymous towers. Eventually, things started changing; change that at first was met with great resistance by the old-fashion defenders of what was considered acceptable, mind you. Still, people cannot fault Apple for trying to change the status quo. No wait... they still do, go figure

 

we're on to mac's now?

hmmmmmm, if it weren't for their OS which seems to hate me being all over the place and flat out wrong in my opinion i'd be getting an air for my run about. many people in the graphic arts industry use it and i use macs alot and it's not all bad. it's just a bit too... clinical.

oh and nice post of R2D2 version 1.0 up there. me guesses lucus arts and apple will be a good partnership for more starwars merchantdise

 

Yeah, it should be successful, in fact. At least as much as making a notebook look like a jukebox has been

 

Even though some may want them to, there are certain things cannot and will not change, forever; because they are timeless absolutes that exist in perpetuity without any need for social validation, knowledge, faith or acceptance. When a concept or idea is presented that is at enmity with those timeless absolutes, we can safely dismiss the individuals that espouse them as heretics and idiots. In the extreme cases of aberrant behavior, unacceptable views, and tendencies that cause harm, we can regard them as diabolical.

Everything else in life (including computer brand or design trend preferences) is a free-for-all, and matters very little in the grand scheme of things. Everything that is not a timeless absolute is open to unique interpretations and individual preferences, and subject to change. New ideas are sometimes difficult to sell, especially if there is no perception of need or value in the change. When the value can be demonstrated, acceptance generally follows. The "birds of a feather flock together" cliche action helps regardless of the pet brand name. Some go with what their friends like without giving it any special thought because social acceptance is more important to them than critical thinking. And, then there are those that are willing call the balls and strikes, tell their closest friends how stupid they are, and boldly inform the emperor that he is wearing no clothing. I try to stay in the latter camp as often as possible. I still think it looks like a "black cylinder of nothingness" but the moment I see Apple do something that I think is cool, I promise that I will say so. I won't be out looking for an example of coolness from them though, because it is clear from the black cylinder that the people in charge at Apple have a different view of coolness than I do.

 

1) Instead I do think that everything is bound to change, as in the universe everything changes constantly--only mankind has always considered himself and his beliefs above that simple fact. Yet, as it's been demonstrated, man is not in the center of everything, and so is not whatever he may uphold as unquestionable and unchangeable truth. Everything will keep changing, no matter how much we resist it. I see diabolical and scary man's attempts to resist and even fight change; look what they did during the Inquisition in the name of "certain things [that] cannot and will not change, forever." Thinking otherwise was simply called heresy. Thankfully, those times are over and in spite of so much resistance, thoughts, ideas, and views do change, slowly demolishing the unquestionable truth that dogmas still think they posses and that feed their subjective understanding or reality.

2) Fortunately there is as much availability of products as there are different tastes and understanding of what's cool. So, there are red flashy and over-clockable jukeboxes, and highly performing black cylinders of nothingness ready for those who want to embrace them

 

We agree on #2. And, it doesn't matter on #1 since there are absolutes that don't require validation.

 

Suuuuure

Just remember: "Nothing is absolute, with the exceptions of this statement and death."

- John Ralston Saul -

 

Lol I show this to my girlfriend and she said: "That's ridiculous, I want a desktop not a cylinder that looks like a trash can" but back to topic. I still don't see the need for the new 18 for just the CPU, it will be just a little faster than the fastest one that the R2 can handle. We can still use some 780 sli so I will keep preferring my R2.

 

I happen to really like this Mac Pro design. Its form after function, I'd like to know what it costs.

 

As someone here already said: "haters are gonna hate," no matter the brand, I'd add

Yes, you might install 2 780m SLI in your M18x and I'm sure they'll just work great, but to some that's not enough; they consider the new look, new CPU, and new inner design and cooling to be more than enough reasons to switch, change, get a new one.

 

It all depends.... For most people a fully loaded m18x r2 with an addon with a 780M sometime in the future can keep them going until the next refresh but for others... The new look or the cooling or just having the latest and greatest or in a few cases actually needing the extra processing power or cooling can be reason enough or even a hobby...... So to each his own...... If you want the new look go for it else if you love the old look... Make it as powerful as you can but remember you have a depreciating asset with not complete support for new technology (like older processors) ... Sooner or later you would have to bite the bullet to get a new one

Sent from my LG-E980 using Tapatalk 2

 

not quiet convinced, i'd love to read a responce from the designers about it, is it more efficient or higher in performance for being aranged in four planes within a cylinder? cause if it isn't i'm afraid it may not even be worth exhibiting in an art gallery. form and function.... I don't see the real purposefull function of this form being any better as apposed to what has been the usuall tower with "flours" of hardware. if the design ventelated heat better or allowed greater storage space in the given dimentions as apposed to a more traditional design using the same dimentions then i'd say well done lads on your innovative enginerring. for now, albeit in my ignorance, I can not see the point of this uninspiring clinical look.

nice! i like a free world, we should all be able to point out how we feel about things but to demand how people should make decisions is the start of an oppressive society.

keep buying the good and the bad and keep nerd bashing the good and the bad. balance is life!

Touché, well played sir :thumbsup:

And jukeboxes rule…

 

Oops. Seems like I opened up a can of worms regarding Apple, sorry guys - was not my intention to belittle anyone who owns one, they are just not my cup of tea, as I mentioned on my somewhat controversial post.

Of course, there are Apple owners who buy high-end specification MacBook's for high-end applications and for their work - they obviously have a place for those people, but the majority of owners simply grab an 'off the shelf' Mac from a retailer without considering specification, just because it is an Apple. That's their choice at the end of the day. Even at a stock retail configuration, I still maintain that they are grossly overpriced for what you get. Here's one from PC World, where the average Joe might shop for a computer: APPLE 15" MacBook Pro MD103B/A Laptop Deals | Pcworld

£1500?? - I7 3615qm 2.3 up to 3.3) / 4gb / 500gb HDD - you're kiddin', right? - that's Apple mark-up for brand ownership. Personally, if I were looking for something that had similar aesthetics to the Apple, I'd probably look at something like this for the same money: ASUS Zenbook U500VZ-CM051H 15.6" Touchscreen Laptop - Silver Deals | Pcworld - faster cpu, more ram, 256gb SSD

Of course, once you buy into Apple, you also have to buy into their proprietory accessories, which aslo carry a stupidly high premium for being Apple. Once you are 'on board' they certainly know how to milk their customers LOL

I imagine the 'dustbin desktop' will also command a stupid price for being Apple design. Of course, same could be said about Alienware, too. It's just 'different strokes for different folks' I guess. Just to inject a bit of humour here, in the UK when I was a kid, we had a TV gameshow called 3,2,1. The Apple desktop reminds me of 'Dusty Bin' - he was the 'booby prize' and he's even got what could be described as an 'Apple' for a nose - great marketing logo! :



Whilst I agree that their designs are innovative, it tends to be constant monotony in my eyes. I guess it appeals to a lot of people, as they are very popular, but I think that they are so popular because they ARE deemed to be 'a yuppie fashion icon'. I'd imagine if you ask the average Apple owner (possibly Estate agents, lawyers, bankers, city businesspeople etc) what cpu and gpu they have, they would look at you as if you were talking a foreign language. So, Apple have got that 'yuppie' market pretty well sewn up. (again, not decrying such people for owning Apple, it just happens to be more true than it is not).

Regarding Apple's 'innovation' - I just don't get why everything that they churn out has to be so bland looking. Sure, it's innovative to have a round desktop cylinder...I guess. Is it a timeless classic design? - who knows. I appreciate innovative - my speakers (pictured in the spoiler below) are of an innovative design - they are even in New York's museum of modern art for their innovative design...however, they actually have SOME degree of interest to them...something that sparks the imagination. I feel that Apple lack that. There designs are what I would call 'one trick pony' style....everything has the same look.

Spoiler

However, I do respect everyone's right to their own opinion - this is just mine. Right or wrong, it's just an opinion.

 

The new design did get them a new customer here. The less flashy look,AC plug on the side and PLS screen played a big factor in my purchase.

 

This is not a new design from apple. It in scaled down mimicry of the Cray line.



and Cray did it in RED!!!

The cylindrical design was to facilitate short bus lengths, heat dissipation and expansion. They added segments to add components.

Since Apple is so eager for law suits Cray should sue. <laughs> There was a toy Cray made that was a cylinder, perhaps Apple wanted to imitate that .. humm a poser Cray toy .. fits somehow.

 

That new Mac Pro looks horrible. Seriously.

 

First, you are comparing Apple with oranges (pun intended). It is obvious that you struggled much trying to Google a computer that remotely could look like the up-coming Apple black cylinder that you ended up mentioning Cray, which only builds supercomputers. According to your wrong assumption we could rightfully compare a red city car and a Ferrari and claim the city car manufacturer should sue Ferrari because both look like cars. Or maybe every computer brand should just sue each other because they use liquid cooling and fans that look so much alike. Ahhh! plagiarism!! ...please. Computers, more or less will look like computers, cars like cars and so on--each, even through innovation, must base their design and accessibility upon well-established standards.

Second, the modular built of Cray or the cylindrical built of Apple have not much in common. Cray built the computer in such a way because it had lots of components (BIG computers mind you, check pictures below) that needed to be easily accessible. The upcoming Apple desktop uses a fan that pushes the heat out from its top, while "Cray's system was power-hungry enough to require a 3M-developed liquid, Flourinert, just to stay cool."

You're trying to force a comparison that does not exist neither in design nor in its hardware. I appreciate your trying, though. As I said and repeat again... haters are always gonna hate, no matter what.

By the way, read this to enlighten your day: IPad 2 benches as fast as cray 2 from 1985


Oh yeah, you're right: they look sooo much alike. </laughs>

 

Um... I'm not a mod or anything like that, but shouldn't we stay on the topic: I must be getting old, I like my m18x better than the m18 one of the things that I hat about Apple is that just saying the name get to threads closed due to people fighting about amazing things or awful things about Apple. But please can we keep it on topic?

 

Haters will always hate and there is nothing we can do about them. They are fools for being haters, and most of them probably have no real basis for the hate.

That's not the same as not liking the appearance of something. I think that is very different. If I were going to buy an Apple desktop, I would not seek out one shaped like a cylinder based on my aesthetic preference. If it were demonstrated to add some kind of fantastic value-added benefit that could not be replicated in a different form, I might set aside aesthetic preference in favor of function. But, on the basis of its odd and nondescript (bland) look, I don't really like it. I do think it looks much like a garbage bin, but thinking that does not make me a hater. It is only because I am familiar with the appearance of garbage bins, and it resembles one. If they made it look like a banana, it would not appeal to me. Nor would making it look like a light bulb or a door knob, or a cuckoo clock.

I like my M18x R2 and I like the design of the new 18. But I still have a preference and I don't love one and hate the other one, LOL.

 

How funny that a paladin of topic thread pops up never when Apple is bashed but only when someone dares to defend it. We are talking about design here as well. The topic can be re-routed back any time with a new post. Ok, I'll help you on this one.

The new Aw18 design is innovative and certain choice hurt those who obviously wanted the new AW18 to look more the old one than anything else. Change is painful.

 

Lets just agree that there are no right or wrong with design huh?
As long as the components get the power and cooling they need

 

I agree. But for those who have a specific use for such a computer (those creative people we talked about yesterday who requires lots of rendering power) are more than happy to have twice as much performance in a small cylindrical factor. Finally they don't have to get a big desk so the roomy aluminum tower of the old series could fit underneath. For these professionals, and are many world wide, more than the Apple-lover-yuppies that seem to infest this country, (according to how many times they've been mentioned here), the smaller size and reduced weight is like a life-changer event.

 

Cosmetics are exactly that... in most cases, nothing more. If design does not get in the way of function and performance it doesn't matter that much and a person should buy whatever they think is most attractive, or not buy what they feel is unaesthetic, as long as the product delivers the performance they expect. It's no different than my yellow pearl paint job. Some people hate it. I like it and don't care what the haters think. The only relevant opinion on the subject is mine.

If they find a benefit in form or function that is fine. I have no problem with that. Same can be said for a lot of products. The X51 is another example of "innovation" so to speak. I don't want one, and I would much prefer a gigantic desktop tower that is more powerful, but it's a concept that some people find a great deal of value in.

 

Yes, all preference and taste about design and aesthetic are in the end subjective. I don't find a small factor cylindrical design to be ugly or in the way, just the opposite. I don't argue against who makes intelligent comments (Mr. Fox's for example) that make up for a lively discussion on technology. I rather criticize the trolling attitude of many who it seems can't wait for the next opportunity to bash Apple and whatever it may come up with. It's hypocritical crying when "haters" attack Alienware and then attacking everything that is not Alienware (or that's just Apple) for the same reason. Let's grow up people, it's time.

 

I'm all for variety. I think it's great that we ALL have the option to choose one or the other (Apple & AW) - or even sometimes both,if that's what suits. If everything that was churned out by computer vendors looked the same, it'd be a pretty drab world. Both manufacturers have their place. There is always going to be people who bash one or the other if they are that way inclined. I personally never said that Apple products were poor products, just not my cup of tea. They fit a market for those inclined to buy minimalistic-by-design computers, which is obviously a big market, otherwise they wouldn't sell so many of them. Just as many Apple owners would shriek at looking at an Alienware, I would do likewise - it's just one of those things....no point in anyone getting uppity about it, eh?

Anyway, I'm not gonna say any more on the subject. It was my bad in the first place for opening up a tin of worms.....

 

Okay a closing argument…

I had the money to purchase either the m18x r2 or the best of the new AW 18.

I choose the m18x, why?

Because many computers offer power and more power and are built solely to become ever more powerful. Also many computers are built not caring too much about a pleasing aesthetic value. Look at all creations and you can see form and function, look at successful creations and you’ll see form function and fun! The greatest craftsman is those with an emotional attachment to the tools they use, either a nod and a wink of appreciation for a brand of sprocket or all out devotion to every detail like Sir Jack and his repco brabham. An upcoming artist may be able to tell you what sizes of brush are best for what job, a master will tell you exactly which brush manufacture does the job best, how to use it and why it’s superior for particular jobs over other makes amongst the competition.

I’m no master but I know what I want to do with my laptop. I want something that invites me to use it and use it a lot, as well as being capable for the job. Many are capable but few excite and stimulate a positive response to use it and stick with it. With art tools you’re inspired by the results and the ambition of obtaining similar and applying it to your own work. For laptops it’s being able to touch type, navigate and not be held up waiting on loading and saving stuff for more than you have to… except that you’re going to spend a lot of time looking at it and feeling it as you carry it and lean on it and strip it… to improve hardware. {okay that sounds too intimate but you know what I mean}

so when I looked for a laptop amongst the Clevo Sagers, Origins and Eurocoms. the MSI, ASUS and such I was looking for something that satisfied what I was going to be doing with it a lot, looking and touching, so 18 inches of screen and the lighting said we care about this aspect more than any other brand. That’s Alienware taking on the heavy guns whilst satisfying our senses too and that’s where the new AW18 falls over, for me anyway. I’m not delighted with the barren deck and metal casing. I own an ACER Aspire V3-571G and I don’t like the mix of silver-black. Works perfectly but when I use it I feel I’m unnecessarily shackled in a suit and tie, It was a cheap emergency replacement so I hadn’t time then to sort what I really wanted out. Before then {and after 6 years I’ve still got it in working order } I used an Acer Aspire 5920 although its grey and without a numeric pad it has such a lovely design, I just loved it, and still enjoy using it. Following the power led across the top and around through the keyboard and down to the touchpad was such an artistic flair that I couldn’t resist.

Those touches makes a laptop special over others and Alienware had so much of that over other laptops that I feel sad it’s been stripped of its flair, like turning a Ferrari into a Mercedes. Both great performers but you know the difference. Others may feel it’s gained more for the metal and more subtle lighting and I hope the sales reflect that, but I will, in my subjective opinion, always prefer the artistic merit of an M18X anyday…

 

eh eh eh A+ for the effort.

 

I imagine that there are quite a few people that are 'hung up' on the new aesthetics of the 18 vs R2. I was one of them. Whilst I am still not 100% with the look of the new 18, I think we have to move forward. Yes, it is quite a departure from the previous design, but it still has that 'Alienware' look and feel, although somewhat reduced. The front grille was the biggest disappointment for me, as the previous design was sleek and sexy. Although I initially complained to myself about the absence of media buttons, in reality, I hardly ever used them. The biggest change for me comes about in the display. Many of us have dried out for the M18x to have a better panel, and here we have it. Sure, the E2E has gone, for some that was beautiful - to me it was a PITA reflective mirror covering up what otherwise would have been a great panel. (as we saw with the bezel modification to remove the covering).

So, move forward or stagnate? - it's gonna be each to their own, I guess. One thing is for sure, this new design is going to be around for quite some time to come and we will likely see it housing Maxwell and maybe even later technology enhancements. From that point, those who may be procrastinating on purchasing may be disappointed to not see any change in design. Folks, it's here to stay. Either way, I still think it is a far nicer machine to look at than some of it's so-called 'rivals'.......

 

I have got to agree with you. My recently ordered Clevo P370SM looks pretty bland comparred to the M18. However the difference in price was so big, I bought the Clevo. It seriously is. However, each has their own personal prefferences. I don't mind the "serious" look of the Clevo, it's just that I like the M18 better.

 

Amen, brother.

 

m18x looks better plus it has more features.

wow total fail with this new image attachement process.... finally got it

 

Silly boy. Don;t make it personal. I did not need to google. I actually worked on a Cray and a few other rather esoteric beasts. A few of us here have most likely forgotten more than many others think they know.

Technical Innovation was never an Apple trait once Waz left. It is a marketing firm and a damn fine one at that. They bundle standard stuff in interesting ways

I much preferred the Next and the Mach kernel, with a real distributed architecture. Funny .. at the time Jobs had to leave Apple to do that. Oh poo .. ya I was around for that too.

 

The m18x is really slick, I like the design of the new one too. I really like that they made the chassis of all the notebooks metal, or at least I think they did.

In general people seem to be disappointed with the new line of laptops, or at least that's what I seem to be picking up?

 

Im still upset about how horrendous it is

 

Whats so bad about the new ones? I haven't had time to stay up to date with notebooks to be honest. I barely have time to surf the web, let alone game or research hardware.

 

Nothing personal, son. Just a friendly discussion on technology and an exchange of opinions. I find it funny that so many seem to just take pleasure in trying to find ways to ridicule, or make sure we all know how much they dislike Apple whenever they've got a chance. But hey, no one shall dare touching their preferred brand. It's just the silly hypocrisy that soaks certain posts that I find laughable.

I disagree about Apple not being innovative. I have been around the block for a while, too, and had my share of battling under desks with immovable mammoth-like servers or buried into offices basements fighting with (in my case) archaic and proprietary systems. Sometimes just "bundling stuff" in interesting ways is already a victory in a market that more often than not it's not so interesting, if we consider the lack of imagination many brands seem to suffer when it comes to form, design, and factor. Innovation is trying to go on different routes, sometimes facing criticism during one's own times, only to find real appreciation and re-discovery in later years, as history teaches. Several here don't like Apple's minimalistic design, and its OS. Yes, we get it, don't buy it if you don't like it. Nevertheless, no one can take it away from Apple its consistency of the last years. It's less bells and whistles and more substance--I cannot say the same for other manufacturers. Not to mention that like it or not, Apple's products are often able to heavily affect and influence both market, and technological trends, triggering endless series of copy-cat gadgets from the competition. That in my book is a great achievement.

I can see why you may like Mach kernel, maybe you don't like FreeBSD's virtual file system layered up on top of the kernel as in the current Mac OS X. I do and appreciate the resulting stability of such approach. Sometimes, versatility--which is still there for those who want and know how to get it--comes at a price. Mach was no doubt an effective and alternative solution for parallel computing , but for a modern OS for everyday computing I don't mind when everything in the system is treated as a file as UNIX does. In sum, I like Mac OS.

Preferences are subjective, and there's no harm in sharing and comparing opinions of what people like or dislike and why so. However, I don't see why I cannot respond to criticism and make sure my opinion on the matter is stated as well. I believe that through civil and lively discussions both parties can always leave with something good; not so much from trolling-drenched arguments that sometimes plague this forum.

 

Just have a look at some of the pictures and see for yourself

 

That's just the looks. The corner cutting left and right is what gets me, on top of their new pricing that makes it so that if you want 780m sli you need to also get a better CPU and 16 gb of ram. Really?!

Sent from my SPH-L900 using Tapatalk 2

 

I dont think the new ones look that bad, couple of things i kind of scratched my head on. But how is bundling CPUs and better GPUs corner cutting? or are you referring to something else?

 

Smaller battery, no ExpressCard, fewer customization options, no aluminum over the ports.

People complain about the loss of the alien head power button, front grills, and media buttons too, but those might be improvements. I'm almost certain that the new Alienware keyboard is better than the old ones, but others think it looks like a Clevo keyboard. I think they need to look at Clevo keyboards again, because this one looks much easier to type on.

 

Hmm, interesting. I would be bummed about the battery, I love switching off my 6990s and surfing on battery power for several hours, and I bought the m18x for the full aluminum chassis. that is a disappointment. Never really used express card though, no loss to me. To each his own I guess.

 

Here are some quick images of the new model and the R1. In person, this is not really a "demotion" in aesthetics; rather just an evolution. Nothing revolutionary. Some things are better, some are worse. Here are some quick pics showing the evolution (better parts) of the aesthetics and a side by side of the two. The new one is a bit bigger. View attachment 98880 View attachment 98881 View attachment 98882 View attachment 98883

 

Thanks for the pictures, looks like the screen on the new one is taller, or is that due to the angle the lid is open to?

 

Nope; it's taller. The viewing angle isn't bigger however. Basically the front end looks a bit off but the back of the lid is huge and definitely an improvement over the current gen.

 

Could it be for the edges?