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    [SOLVED] Asus G51J BSoD thread - part 2

    Discussion in 'ASUS Gaming Notebook Forum' started by thalanix, Jan 10, 2010.

  1. breezer

    breezer Notebook Guru

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    New 208 bios coming :


    [​IMG]



    can't download it yet though
     
  2. Wolfpup

    Wolfpup Notebook Prophet

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    I must be confused...I thought the G60j was an upcoming model, kind of the lower resolution version of the G51jx? Or is that the G60jx or something? It's not sold yet in the U.S. at least, but I was interested in getting it...if it's stable!
     
  3. thalanix

    thalanix Notebook Deity

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    almost like a hamster on roids running in a squeaky wheel, but not quite. i've found different drivers make different squeal patterns and loudness, usually without much change in performance.

    groceries has direct links a page back
     
  4. ALLurGroceries

    ALLurGroceries  Vegan Vermin Super Moderator

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    I was using glxgears since php 5.3 broke my phoronix test suite... so if I run two instances it goes away. Makes sense though, it must be just enough load to get it to squeal, then a bit more gets it past that vibration.

    About 'squeaky' glxgears somebody said get some glxoil... :laugh:

    Anyway, it still throttles the same as far as I can tell. I added a pic to the wiki because I got an email requesting an actual pic. I'll be interested to hear if windows users have luck with 208... and here's that link again: http://dlsvr04.asus.com/pub/ASUS/nb/G60JAS208.zip
    or
    http://dlsvr.asus.com/pub/ASUS/nb/G60JAS208.zip This one was slower for me, but who knows ASUS has server load issues. The squeaky hamsters might be powering their servers, after all.
     
  5. thalanix

    thalanix Notebook Deity

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    it's only fair that the older hamsters get retired into their notebooks. never had a problem with their servers serving up a 1 or 2MB BIOS'. actual drivers are better/newer from the oem regardless.
     
  6. Sirhcz0r

    Sirhcz0r Notebook Deity

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    Thanks for the links! I hope this one solves rather than lessens the bsod issue.
     
  7. ALLurGroceries

    ALLurGroceries  Vegan Vermin Super Moderator

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    MMmm, lessens you say sir? You've had 0x124s on 207.T10? The GenTech bios? Positive? Double checked and whatnot? Triple confirmed?

    I don't think anyone has reported an 0x124 with 207.T10 from GenTech. There have been a couple of false alarms, maybe I have missed something in the past week while I wasn't lurking?
     
  8. Sirhcz0r

    Sirhcz0r Notebook Deity

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    Maybe it wasn't that bsod, but it happened playing the same game that was the most problematic previously.
     
  9. ALLurGroceries

    ALLurGroceries  Vegan Vermin Super Moderator

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    Well check the event logs, it should still be there and you can see what the code is that was thrown. Also make extra sure it's the GenTech BIOS linked from the first post on this thread, not to be pedestrian about it, but you'd be the first reporter of a BSOD with the new bios.

    I do hope 208 is a fix too, I have no idea right now, and my windows are broken like an abandoned building (I'm happy to be "stuck" in linux tho ;))
     
  10. Sirhcz0r

    Sirhcz0r Notebook Deity

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    I'll check whenever I can, but I can't right now because it's not my G51J.

    On a separate note, how hot does your G51J get? The 207 bios seemed to help heat but I haven't been able to do much testing.
     
  11. ALLurGroceries

    ALLurGroceries  Vegan Vermin Super Moderator

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    I can get the cpu to 90C and the gpu to 95ish if I slam it although it's one or the other due to throttling. It tends to idle around 50C for the cpu and 57C for the gpu. Ambient temp is about 16C or 60F. Over the course of owning it I haven't noticed any changes in temps... dunno.
     
  12. thalanix

    thalanix Notebook Deity

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    besides that one report of a BSoD on the jx, the jx also has similar the throttling. so the only change between them is slightly lower temps, and a GPU with half the rendering backend (but similar synthetic performance). the g51vx folks are lucky they can oc >600+.

    mine chokes at 595 from throttling and artifacting. furmark peaks at 93 (fan) -> 92c on those clocks, 93 -> 88c max on asus and nvidia clocks, idles around the same as groceries'. i have a feeling some G51J's are undervolted, which is why we have nicer temps.

    edit: i forgot who asked about pcsx2, but it runs FFX and FFX-2 @ 100% in 720p. i'll try 1080 once i figure out how to map the 360 -> ps2 input. unfortunately those are the only 2 games i managed to make an image before giving it away.

    edit2: 1080 works at 100% as well, though the widescreen modes seem stretched. gl plugin has flickering textures and polgons, but also 8x AA... dx has no glitches but no aa...
     
  13. MOORI

    MOORI Newbie

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    Hi to all.

    First of all, thanks for the very helpful information to fix the BSOD!!

    I had the same trouble with the BSOD in Borderlands.
    My notebook;
    Asus G60J with core I7, Nvidia GTX260, WIN7 64bit

    I tryed the update from the ASUS global page with the BIOS version 208
    (publication Feb. 08th 2010) and it worked for me. No problems with BSOD!
    Played about 2hours, bsod was after 5 to 10 minutes before.
    This BIOS is only in the global and US download area, i am from germany and in the european area they don´t have this version only the 207 !?!?
    Anyway, just for the people to know. Ofiicial BIOS 208 for G60J is running fine.
     
  14. VZX

    VZX Notebook Evangelist

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    I missed this. Where did one mention it ?
    So you say G51Vx is _practically_ the better gaming machine for now?
     
  15. thalanix

    thalanix Notebook Deity

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    i thought i saw someone say it in the g51jx thread, but i could be wrong. not the crysis one, but furmark+prime95.
    for oc'ing, the g51vx with a p8700/t9400+ is most likely the better gaming machine.
     
  16. hollow_tree

    hollow_tree Notebook Enthusiast

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    ASUS has already released a new BIOS for G60J?
    What ever happened to the M60J?... I'm still getting those darn BSOD's; it's SOOOO ANNOYING!!!!!!!! :mad:
     
  17. VZX

    VZX Notebook Evangelist

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    Does G51Vx confirmed not to have this throttling issue? or just people yet to do furmark+prime95 test on it yet?
     
  18. paperbag846

    paperbag846 Notebook Consultant

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    It is technically, in the short term.

    With a quad core, internal temps are higher, and the GPU simply cannot be pushed as hard. I would say overclocking ANY laptop isn't really worth it, but you CAN overclock the vx's 260m higher than the j.

    That said, realize that some games are beginning to take advantage of multiple cores (Operation Flashpoint, Metro 2024) etc., The next gen-titles that pushes our systems like STALKER did in 2007 may require more of a balance between GPU power and CPU power.

    It's a toss up. I play at 1280 * 720 to help with temps (and because I'm so used to playing at 800*480 on my old computer that this looks AMAZING to me), but for a little extra money, id say the quad will last you maybe a year longer, AND will be better for non-gaming applications (film editing, photo processing, number crunching).

    The VX is a good buy for current generation games (the xbox 360 era). The J is a more all-purpose machine with fairly similar real-world GPU preformance.

    -------------------------------------------

    As for another issue I hear alot of people complaining about, throttling.

    LETS ALL BE THANKFUL OUR COMPUTER GOT THE 208 BIOS (G60j motherboard). Our computers now work as advertised.

    Throttling is not a problem, its a feature. Without it, Crysis would turn your laptop into a paperweight pretty quickly.

    This computer is a very good deal but it OBVIOUSLY is pushing the heat limits.

    YOU NEVER NEED YOUR GPU AND CPU TO RUN AT 100% AT THE SAME TIME.

    I cant think of one real world application where this would happen. Crysis is not going to CONSTANTLY run all of your cores at 100%. Photoshop, Lightroom, Final Cut or Matlab is not going to CONSTANTLY need 100% of your GPU.

    If you somehow manage to use both at 100%, in real life (not these useless fumark tests which just upset nerds.. NB: when you are designing a product, fumark scores mean NOTHING when it comes to the successful marketing and launch of a product), and the computer DIDNT throttle, your internal temps would go over 100 Celsius and ruin your $1500 investment.

    Use your heads people. Stop trying to squeeze all this preformance out of your computer. Start playng and working. WE CAN NOW PLAY WITHOUT BSOD!!! THATS ALL WE NEED! This is the best price/preformance laptop out there for GPU intensive applications... don't forget that.

    And if you prevent your throttles --> don't get mad when you have to spend your next paycheque on a brand new computer.

    Just don't blame ASUS. It's not their fault you don't understand technology.
     
  19. thalanix

    thalanix Notebook Deity

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    that is a perfect contradiction.

    you've just answered yourself why it is NOT a feature. i don't care if it doesn't use all cores at all times. when it uses even 2 to the max along with 70% GPU, it slows down to a crawl. this SHOULD NOT HAPPEN IN A GAMING LAPTOP (neither should the BSoDs, which was completely unacceptable).

    perfectly good you're limited to a small set of game/development applications, but i have a few that use both simultaneously. check out Dolphin emu (gc/wii emulator) and pcxs2 (ps2 emulator). the gtx260m HAS THE POWER to run games in 8xAA. the i7 HAS THE POWER to run them at full speed, 1080p. but because of the throttling something has to be turned down.

    if my $1500 investment is going to die from regular usage, that makes it a pretty crappy investment.

    when it dies from regular use, that's what the warranty is for. i could care less what asus does. asus made the awful choice of reusing an inefficient cooling system, and now they will have to deal with the returns. an analogy to this, is if you bought a new car and could only use the AC/heating or power steering but not both, even though they are both part of that investment.

    what technology is there to understand? application X requires heavy CPU and GPU usage. application X can only get one of those. application X runs like crap. there is no technology here.

    if you mean that in the sense of i don't know about heat, do you even have a desktop? what is your 8800/gtx260 hitting now? has ANY part ever died on you? the only people that complain are those that are unlucky. statistics DON'T show people like me who run their old 8800 at 90c+ at times for 2 solid years. even the e8400 in there now lived a year @ 70c because there was too little paste. there's a reason nvidia set the limit at 105c. whether the thermal cycling goes from 20 to 90 or 20 to 100, in the long run it really won't matter.

    it's fairly obvious that asus chose 2 pieces that will not fit. that was their mistake, and like any reputable business they should admit to it and fix it, even if it costs them. what's the point in getting a ferrari if you're only allowed to use it on residential streets?
     
  20. bennyg

    bennyg Notebook Virtuoso

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    http://g51jbsod.wikia.com/wiki/CPU_throttling

    Read it top to bottom.

    If you BOTHERED to read anything on the throttling issue at all before your rant, you didn't understand it.

    Thalanix said it - throttled on 2 core + 70% GPU. This is FAR FROM 100%.

    I got throttling even on 1 thread Prime95 (1 core 100%) + GPU 100% (synthetic).
    I got throttling with 2 thread Prime95 (2 cores 100%) so long as the GPU clocks were above 300/600.

    Our concern is pretty damn simple.
    If it can't take synthetic torture tests around 50-70% of simultaneous CPU and GPU use,
    HOW LONG WILL IT BE UNTIL A GAME DOES THIS
    AND RENDERS OUR $1500 (well my AUD$2000) INVESTMENT USELESS.

    I am certainly not stupid enough to overclock as far as I can other than to test the limits. Sustained 93C on the GPU does worry, but a 2 year warranty gives me piece of mind to some extent. I tried to underclock it but NVidia's control panel and system works is giving me the *&$s to no end, and we don't have a GPU BIOS to modify in order to try an undervolt. And the CPU's self-management is so opaque there's no tools to manage it other than disabling i7m's best feature, Turboboost (I might as well have bought something with a Q9000 in that case)

    I knew the G51J ran hot because I bought a couple of months after introduction. When I get around to it I will perhaps do a couple of mods, but warranty is of course the preference.
     
  21. thalanix

    thalanix Notebook Deity

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    i've edited the BSOD wiki to fixed with 207.T10 and possible 208. if anyone is against, PM me.

    +1 (when it lets me).
     
  22. Sirhcz0r

    Sirhcz0r Notebook Deity

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    The temperatures I reported that were lower than usual were just a fluke, it could have been the operating environment. In any case, newer bios did nothing for heat, but whilst using the G51J today, I didn't get any blue screens while stressing it with furmark. I'm still annoyed at how the fans only go their fastest when the gpu is already well past eighty degrees Celsius. That should be a very easy thing to change with future bios though. Honestly, I'd take a fan that's always at it's fastest speed over something that might overheat. If anybody knows a program to undervolt an i7 mobile quad I'd be very interested.
     
  23. MFHomeybone

    MFHomeybone Notebook Enthusiast

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    Anybody have any BSODs with BIOS v208?
     
  24. paperbag846

    paperbag846 Notebook Consultant

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    Not yet, it is bioshock 2 MP and COD6 MP proof so far.

    A question regarding my earlier rant: from the wiki:

    "...the closest we have are Crysis and Supreme Commander and only in some scenes. that is why the throttling does not affect games on stock clocks without overclocking. when the trend does move to multithreaded games, this machine will be outdated because the multithreading will end in throttling."

    Will multithreading in any instance end in throttling, or only if the GPU is being pushed to 100%?

    My thinking is that the "poor-man's" (lazy) solution would be to run a multithreaded game like that at 1280 * 720.

    Not saying thats the best solution, but curious as to what you folks think.

    Sorry about the earlier post it was a wee bit excessive.
     
  25. thalanix

    thalanix Notebook Deity

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    not every multithreaded game/app. i started a small table below that,
    so we can have some idea of what the power limit is and ways to get to it (and eventually use that as a reason for sending it in. 3x with the same problem and some states/provinces have a lemon law).
    when games like that come out, we'll have to limit them to 1 or 2 cores (affinity) and maybe underclock the gpu even more. how much will depend on what kind of balance the game needs. hopefully asus will remove/increase the throttle limit by then but i'm not holding my breath. better chance of getting a replacement.
    also, the problem is not hardware. it would've crashed after connecting too many devices, but it didn't.

    continue the throttling discussion @ http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=452784
     
  26. bennyg

    bennyg Notebook Virtuoso

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    No worries.

    I didn't buy a gaming laptop with a Full HD 1080p screen to run stuff blurry in 720p! If I wanted that I would have bought a G60J with the same hardware - and as it turns out, the same problems... - but with a 1366x768 screen.

    If Asus advertise a i7 720qm and a GTX260M, fair enough, that's whats in the thing, but they certainly didnt let it be known the power circuitry couldnt run both components to anywhere near full capacity.

    *** Asus would have tested the hardware in this notebook. They know all about this throttling issue. It is a reproducible, "stable" fault. I am 101% certain they knew this all along. They released the notebook for sale. They failed to make it known. They misled buyers into buying a gimped unit. ***

    I presume that is why they have been completely and utterly silent on the matter. Not even the meaningless "we are looking into the issue" post like we got early on in the BSOD thread. However the question is what happens from here:-
    - BIOS or other update to remedy the situation.
    - Mass recall / fix / refund.
    - Asus stay silent, deny the issue, let it blow over, hope not too much publicity arises about it, let the odd person who cares enough to bother returning the unit 3 times or whatever clause in whatever consumer protection / "lemon" laws in order to get a refund/replacement.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 8, 2015
  27. thalanix

    thalanix Notebook Deity

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    why write 20k+ almost identical lines in dsdt and probably a similar amount for the actual BIOS when you can "borrow" from a similar notebook (M60J). i only managed to get around 50 done for regular coding before giving in and borrowing from hcitool...

    it wouldn't be surprising if the M60 has a 90W power brick and is the original source of the BSOD.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 8, 2015
  28. DCMAKER

    DCMAKER Notebook Deity

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    Go to the throttling thread. I showed the links showing that the M60j has a 90w adapter. Also nice rant. Also thalanix what do you mean 50 lines of code and then giving up and borrowing some. You lost me with bios and codes lol. <---lol I try to sound intelligent but I am not lol


    EDIT:has anyone talked to GENTECH for some more help. Also has the ASUS Rep on here came back form his 2 week long vacation...well it would be like 6 weeks now if he hasn't logged in.
     
  29. thalanix

    thalanix Notebook Deity

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    a comparison between what i know as a programmer and what they have to do.

    the BIOS will probably end up being close to 30-40 thousand lines, which are probably 95% copied from similar notebooks. anyone who doesn't want to go insane will go the easy way and reuse as much as they can. unfortunately, if even 3 or 4 of those are the throttle limits, then those are copied too.
     
  30. DCMAKER

    DCMAKER Notebook Deity

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    If you know what your doing...is it easy to find the throttling lines? or is it eny meny miny mo this one?
     
  31. thalanix

    thalanix Notebook Deity

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    we don't have the source ;)

    ctrl+f -> 90 -> '140 matches for search [regular int, 90]' -> right click, edit value, 120 -> save -> "cmon G51j don't die on me now!!11"
     
  32. DCMAKER

    DCMAKER Notebook Deity

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    BRICK! lol but how do they even make or fix something like this if they didn't write it?...is this why asus has ignored it because they don't want to try to edit it?
     
  33. thalanix

    thalanix Notebook Deity

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    they did write it. the lazy engineer who took the M60 stuff might've forgot to change it. of course it's all speculation for now.

    asus has the source, all they have to do is make a one sure edit and it's good. they might not want to for heat issues.
     
  34. Sirhcz0r

    Sirhcz0r Notebook Deity

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    Which is why the edit should have the fan on full power before 84 degrees Celsius lol. They have a lot of work to do.
     
  35. DCMAKER

    DCMAKER Notebook Deity

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    Also someone here and on newegg said that they modded the case so that air went through the bottom. On newegg the guy said you can buy a replacement part for 15 bucks. Does anyone know how to get that part? Do we just call asus and ask for a new bottom piece? Also on the throttling page i mentioned can we get a how to guide for putting artic silver 5 on the heatsink? The reason why ask is because someone said it helped and that their's had little thermal paste.
     
  36. Lanaya

    Lanaya Templar Assassin

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    http://estore.asus.com/shop/item.asp?itemid=5250&catid=708

    bottom panel.
     
  37. DCMAKER

    DCMAKER Notebook Deity

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    sweet thx. Also anyone have a good idea how to fix my newb mistake -_- I wasn't paying attention and put the thick screw in the K> spot where the thin long one goes and it just spins and wont come out :/
     
  38. Sirhcz0r

    Sirhcz0r Notebook Deity

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    The G51J I use will probably get that real back panel at some point, but for now, taking it off and drilling lots of small holes is good enough, there wasn't much to it other than patience.

    Element, is there anywhere that I can see a picture of what the link refers to? I just would like to avoid buying another fake air vent. :(

    Thanks for the link!
     
  39. Sirhcz0r

    Sirhcz0r Notebook Deity

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    Is it even threaded? Try taking the entire back panel off and report back. That isn't just you who does things like that, so don't worry. I borrowed someones laptop once and messed up with putting the screws back lol. Eventually (hours later) I had it sorted out. :rolleyes:
     
  40. DCMAKER

    DCMAKER Notebook Deity

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    BTW i fixed my newb mistake ^^ I used a bent/cut paper clip to go under and catch the screw. I am quite proud of my ingenuity ^^ Anyways where is allurgrocies with a fix ^^
     
  41. ALLurGroceries

    ALLurGroceries  Vegan Vermin Super Moderator

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    A fix for the throttling issue is a long ways off, I just found tools to decompress the BIOS yesterday. There are no cute tools for this bios, everything has to be done by hand. thalanix and I have been digging thru this stuff but I haven't seen anything promising yet. I've just gotten IDA installed a few minutes ago. ;)

    Edit: I would encourage anyone with assembly/reversing knowledge to join in, see: http://g51jbsod.wikia.com/wiki/BIOS_disassembly
     
  42. DCx

    DCx Banned!

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  43. godandallthingsto

    godandallthingsto Notebook Enthusiast

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    Should I apply the bios update to the G51J - 3D model ?

    The product code is G51J-IX098V

    Thx
     
  44. thalanix

    thalanix Notebook Deity

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    yes.
    10char
     
  45. Birmania

    Birmania Newbie

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    Hello everybody !

    First, I want to say that I am really sorry for my bad english but I am french and not perfect in english...

    So I explain for which reason I am here. I have many BSOD on my computer and I search the reason. Now it make several hour that I search and I was so busy when I go on your forum.

    You are for me my holy god to have find a solution to all this BSOD !

    But I keep have a problem...

    Indeed, I don't know how to run the T10 file that you give at this link :
    http://g51jbsod.wikia.com/wiki/ASUS_G51J-A1_0x124_BSOD

    Thanks a lot for all your work ! Without you, I was going to shut me down... :3

    EDIT : I find WinFlash on my computer which allow to modify the bios. Do I must use this program ?

    P.S : Which bios must I install If I have a G51J-IX098V between the Official BIOS 208 for the G51J/G60J and the Gentech version ?
     
  46. Sirhcz0r

    Sirhcz0r Notebook Deity

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    Boot into Windows and find where you put the new bios. Make sure it's not in a rar. Reboot and go into bios settings. There's a way to choose the directory that it is, select and flash it.

    I'm not familiar with all the G51J models, so I'm not sure whether the GenTech or Official or better for you; hopefully somebody else can help.
     
  47. MFHomeybone

    MFHomeybone Notebook Enthusiast

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    I've got BIOS 208 and got a Kernel Power error just like before in Fallout 3 within 10 mins.
     
  48. chardoc89

    chardoc89 Newbie

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    I purchased a plain old G51J laptop. I have been getting the 0x124 BSOD while playing BF bad company 2. Sometimes I can play for 5 hours sometimes, I can only play for seconds.

    If anyone has the patience to answer a few questions... please continue.

    Why does Asus not have a BIOS with a fix up on their main website?

    Which version of the BIOS should I use? (Gentechpc or the one buried deep within Asus's website... http://dlsvr04.asus.com/pub/ASUS/nb/G60JAS208.zip)

    I can still return this laptop, should I?
     
  49. ryzeki

    ryzeki Super Moderator Super Moderator

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    Why return it for something that has been fixed? unless you want another notebook.

    Download gentechpc BIOS, altho in theory the official bios would be 208. I use gentech one and I havent had issues anymore.

    Get the new bios and enjoy your machine!

    Oh also be sure to uninstall all creative sound software and Sound Audigy software/drivers, as those cause freezing.
     
  50. Vanez

    Vanez Notebook Enthusiast

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    Hai there, I want to ask...
    With new BIOS, G51J do not have any BSOD problem, is that right ?
    has anyone played games like prototype, COD MW2 Multi and GTA4 ??
    Does it still cause BSOD ??

    Because I'm afraid that BSOD G51J is not completely solved.
    I'm using G51Jx now, and I know it has no fix BIOS yet. But if G51J do not have the complete fix yet, so do the G51Jx.

    Poor my G51Jx, I hope you all can give me a good new :)
     
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