S-XPS 1645 Throttling Info. and Updates

This behavior was fixed in A07 for the 1645 when the engineers discovered a problem with the BIOS algorithm that did not allow the CPU to recover from induced C and P states. I will make sure to call out the same behavior exists on 1647 when we meet next week. Thanks for the heads up.

 

Are you sure this isn't just normal intel power managment? When you first start up the multiplier should be high because the computer is working hard right then, but then the multiplier should go down by a lot as the processor idles (even on AC). The only time you should see the full multiplier is when the system is under heavy load.
For instance, my 2ghz C2D 7300 loves to idle around 800 or 1200, I almost never see it go up to the full 2000. Throttling is only abnormal when there's a heavy load.
Edit: I guess I should ask, does it stay low after the gaming session no matter what you do, even something like prime 95?

 

Thank you Bill.
I'll PM you right now (if I have minimum posts).

 

@Bill: OK, thanks..

@emetchar: At first I thought that, but no. I confirmed this by stressing only the cpu (no gpu) which would theoretically increase the frequency because of the demand, but this wasnt the behaviour, its just stuck there

 

The only way to demonstrate you are suffering from CPU throttling is to run those tests with and without ThrottleStop operating. If you see no difference between the two then you know your looking at a performance bottle neck probably linked to the mid range GPU.

The tests I posted yesterday suggested no difference between AC (with or without TS) or battery power. This was with both Crysis and Dirt 2 which are both about as demanding as you can get. Bill himself has mentioned that dirt 2 still throttles but strangely I found no evidence of that

My feeling is that the laptop now operates as it should in real world scenario's with the currently available software. What the future holds though I could not say....

 

Thats what I did. There's no difference b/w the 2 logs.(observe multipliers from the end).
Hence at 1080p, the 4670 will be the bottleneck in the future.

Conclusion
GTA 4 is cpu intensive at 720p and gpu intensive at 1080p. All games are.
But GTA 4 is not a good game to benchmark since it performs just like Microsoft FSX(mediocre fps no matter what).

 

I have to thank you Bill for A07 and the 130 watt adapters. But if you could convince your Indian counterparts so we can retain our 90w adapters, that would be great.
The 1645 doesnt seem to throttle while gaming but the screen blocking exhaust does provide a performance drop during gaming and will ruin the beautiful WLED slowly.

 

Sorry for posting this again but I think its important

Can people run a prime and furmark again with killawatt and state your configuration to see if we can pin down this "magic number"?

From siphen we have the magic number at:

A07- 110W AC max allowed. - ~79.2W DC Side

which is well below 90W DC.


To perform as advertised,

this laptop needs around 100W DC instead of what A07 gives us which is around 80W DC.


Or another way to look at it from the a/c side of things at the wall outlet,

this laptops needs around 138W AC instead of what A07 gives us which is around 110W AC


The reason Dell doint want us to know how many watts A07 delivers could be that it would show that the laptop still underperforms

Kill-A-Watt is showing 110W MAX allowed wattage draw from the wall with BIOS A07, this is 5-10more W draw allowed,

A03- 90W AC max allowed ~64.8W DC Side
A06- 100W AC max allowed ~72.0W DC Side
A07- 110W AC max allowed. - ~79.2W DC Side

This does not take into account the voltage modification that was made between A03-A06

A07 - TS enabled - 138W max draw AC . ~99.36W DC Side

Tests were done with prime95 and furmark.

So, - to sum up, TS allows 20 more Watts DC Side to be used by the system if its needed, A07 doesnt.

 

The adapters should have >=87% efficiency based on the V rating. That makes it higher than 90W DC.

http://www.energystar.gov/ia/partne...International_Efficiency_Marking_Protocol.pdf

 

Very interesting. I look forward to find out what this means.

 

@Bill, you keep talking about the P and C-states. Yes, they have been made better and this can be proven today because the system still throttles. Throttling cycle is much faster but this alone already proves that there is artifical Dell throttling still happening not related to temps or P and C states.

I'm at Sydney and it's summer. This is as hot my laptop will ever get and I reach 72 CPU temps at max. The throttling that still happens is not temp related. The multiplier should not go below 12, yet it does.

If you answer the question that you say the techs won't allow you, how much of the 130W adapter are we using (numbers have been provided by kill-a-watt already), it would explain it.

It's not a conspiracy theory, it's reality.

I haven't even touched the subject of GPU being artificially throttled by Dell at 83/84 degrees. This has been proven by many people and on other Dell laptops running a lower GPU (which subsequently received a fix).

GPU throttling happens by dropping the 1.2V to 0.9V which anyone can monitor (level 1). As soon as it goes below the temp threshold, it rises back to 1.2V and normal 3D clocks are back (level 2)

This is why people can over-write via Rivatuner. It does not allow Dell to drop it to Level 1 (drop Volts and clocks).

The CPU throttling is there and is related to how much power we are allowed via 130W adapter. The GPU throttling is there and is related to your thermal setting being too low to induce this throttling via dropping the volts and consequently the clocks.

 

Hi Bill,

Honestly, you can consider the Throttle issue is solved, and the others can keep on arguing forever. Well, I don't feel that I have enough computer knowledge to judge on this point. However, what I do know is that the system is hot!!! and I am truely afraid that in a year and half, the screen will be melted by the heat from the vent everyday. However, by then, all our warranty will be expired, and we will need to pay like $700 fix a problem that was not caused by us. Do you agree? It is the same thing with the RGB screen issue. You mentioned that you will do something for the RGB users. I guess this will be allowing couple more watts of power consumption. But like all of us, I have a feeling that they system was not designed for 130w at all, and by allowing more and more power consumption, we are only risking the lifespan of the system. And if this is true, who can help us when the system dies in 15 month when we have no more warranty left. Do you agree?


Finally, if the heat or vent issues indeed will be looked into, do you have a rough ETA? are we talking about weeks or months?

Thank you for being here helping us.

 

Here's a tip that might be useful for some.

1. Click on "User CP" near the top left corner of the forums page.
2. Click on Buddy / Ignore Lists
3. Add " quietCat" to the Ignore List, press Enter and click on Save List.
4. Enjoy your Forum Experience.

How wonderful that I won't be able to see his response to this. If any.

 

@error

As someone who has to wrap their laptop up in blankets and roast it for an hour because the video card keeps de-soldering itself, I'm not terribly phased by thermal throttling. I don't see 85* as something unreasonable to stop the video card at. I mean, my desktop 8800gtx doesn't even go above 87 on furmark.

 

I really don't think we need to care about how much power the laptop is pulling or allowed to pull. We just need solutions.

I think there are two main problems now. When CPU and GPU are pushed to 100% we see throttling. Other laptops with similar specs are able to be pushed to 100% without seeing the issue. I have to say that I have not experienced CPU throttling while gaming.

The other problem is gpu temp. When around 83-84C the gpu clocks down until temp drops. Is that temp arbitrary or is it a point at which there will be harm done to the laptop.

There seem like there are a lot of reports of poor performance but no one is stating if they are logging clock modulation or if temps are high and gpu throttling or if they are expecting to run at max resolution with max quality and max AA.

I can say that if I run some games at max resolution and max quality that performance is horrible. Nothing to do with throttling. The 4670 has limits that is why ati and nvidia release new chips every year.

Seems like all of the 1645 threads are going downhill really fast. If you want things fixed, state the config and the problem.

 

I agree with each and every one of your points in their entirety.

People are buldozing their way onto this thread claiming they are suffering from throttling during gaming without any proof to back up their statements.

Listen people, the only way to prove you a suffering from CPU throttling is to run those benchmarking tests with or without TS to see whether you see variation in your FPS results between the two. If not then your 'lagging' is due to the limitations of the GPU, which lets remember once again, is just a decent mid range card.

I (some might say stupidly) booted up crysis while the laptop was on my lap last night and I definitely suffered from GPU throttling. I was getting my FPS dropping from 30 to around 10 for periods of around 5 seconds every minute while the GPU throttled back and then jumped back into life again. This cycled for a considerable period of time like this. If you're suffering from GPU throttling due to excess temperatures your going to know about it, the signs are obvious. If its a constantly low FPS your suffering from, then I would point back to the previous paragraph and suggest that for the game/settings/resolution you are running, the 4670 simply isn't up to the job.

 

This is beyond everything, coworker of mine called in DELL today to inquire about 130w power adapter replacement and was told latest bios A07 does not require larger power adapter than 90w. He spoke with regular rep then got transferred to his superior and have gotten the same response. He was trying to convince and mentioned that he read in forums that Bios A07 must be used with conjunction 130w adapter but even so he was rejected replacement. Eventually the manager or whoever he spoke to told him that there other problems associated with 130w power adapter so it does not serve it's purpose. DELL might send replacement at its own discretion but there more tests needed to be done.

Dell-Bill can you comment of any known side effects of using bios a07 with 130w power adapter?

This is getting interesting day by day but then in the end this might just explain all the delays with releasing A07 bios.

Link below with video of DELL XPS throttling
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CoLw-DkEqnQ

I urge everyone to create video(s) and post them to show that the problem still exists even with the latest A07 bios. This way people with higher credential at DELL become convinced and resolve this issue once for all!

 

The max my GPU hit was 86C, I never saw it go higher than that, this is with Riva Tuner working its magic and the card running at max spec for 4 hours strait.

If the engineers configured the GPU to throttle at 88C or higher I wouldn’t have to run Riva Tuner.

Bill, can you add that to the next conf call with the engineers, the GPU Thermal Limit? Would really appreciate the look into it.

 

That was my biggest problem, It started to throttle at 84. Problem is when it drops to 300mhz that's one hell of a drop.

Quiet Cat, It may be time to lay this argument down to rest. I'm not even sure what the point is anymore. But please lets let facts speak for themselves. Needless speculation doesn't help anything.

I'm also afraid that Dell probably isn't going to do much more about this problem. I hope they fix the GPU thing because that really is a deal breaker IMHO. Which brings us full around. System still throttles when only playing a game and cuts performance to too low a level.

 

The last comment I made about P and C states was in response to an issue where the 1647 CPU does not recover as it should, just like you saw on the 1645 before A07. I don't think I "keep talking about P and C states." I think I was explaining about a known issue with 1647 and telling that user I would make sure to bring it up next week when the engineers come back from holdiay.
I will say this about the killawatt findings. Based on what people are concluding the total watt draw to be on the DC side using killawatt readings, it's not accurate and hence has no bearing on the total DC draw. Notice I said "based on what people are concluding." Someone may come in and actually do the math the right way and post the number (whatever the right way is. I'm nowhere near qualified to figure that out), so I will not be commenting on the DC draw any further. I am simply not authorized to. I need my job, so I'm just simply not going to do it.
When I have made reference to conspiracy theories, it was strictly aimed at the preposterous idea that we shaved off wattage to bolster our Green portfolio. Please, read the context of the post before you assume I'm calling throttling itself a conspiracy theory. That idea is just ludicrous, and I find it hard to believe any reasonable person would lend credence to it, but life is a mystery, right?
GPU clocking is a different issue than the topic of this thread, right? Correct me if I'm wrong. I was just thinking this was a discussion about CPU throttling, but I guess the title does say "Throttling" without specifying. Either way, it's a valid concern, and one I will take to the engineers next week.
Just to be sure, you are saying you are on A07+130W and your CPU throttles in games, right?

So, I am kind of confused, and sorry if I come off as rude. I don't mean to be, but you said in the top half of your post that you were concerned with the vent blowing on your screen. Yet later you acknowledge that I have already said I will take that issue to the engineers. I have stated several times on this thread that I would expect a fix based on prior experience with the same issue on the 1340. So, assuming it gets fixed, I think your screen is safe with regard to the vent discoloring it. If you feel cumulative damage has already occurred that will need attention at some point after your warranty expires, my advice would be to call tech support and report the screen discoloration you see a month or two before your warranty runs out. I would think the ETA for the vent would be something I might be able to get you after at least one conversation with the engineers, which again, will not take place until after they return from holiday. The system never hits 130W power draw, so design elements at that power level are a moot point.

There are no known side effects of using a 130W adapter with A07. I am not sure if there may be some side effects to using A07+TS+130 just in case anyone is thinking of or currently doing that. As far as your co-worker's story goes, there will always be technicians in any company that has upwards of 10,000 of them who don't read policy alerts as they should. There is no excuse for that, and it's even worse when a person in a supervisory role is as ill-informed. Tell your friend I apologize for the frustration, and if you PM me his service tag and shipping address, I will personally make sure he gets his adapter, and that manager, tech and their site lead get an email requesting that they read and follow current policy as is incumbent on anyone in their position. Trust me, I pull no punches when someone treats a customer like that. It's kind of my thing.

This is excellent feedback, and I will take this to the engineers. I may reach out to you via PM and request some information at that time, if you don't mind. Thanks for the input. I can definitely work with the fact that you never see >86 with Rivatuner running.

 

I deleted a large number of posts (over three pages worth) of senseless bickering/arguing.

Let's continue with the topic at hand . . . thanks.

 

Thank you for the guidance, Charles. For my part and inconsiderate conduct, I accept responsibility and apologize to the NBR staff and community members. Won't happen again.

 

Yay!!!!

Back to our original thread!

 

It's nothing major at this point. I would not get too excited. But then again, in the end it will probably change 21 times. I probably should have just left it alone. Sorry for any undue excitement.

 

Well it is a sad day. After months of waiting and reading every last post on this thread and the previous one (man has that been a time consuming process!), I have at last made the final decision to return my and two other 1645's that we own and order the latest HP Envy's.

I own a small-medium sized business (70 staff) and have personally used Dell laptops for 5+ years and we have used Dell gear throughout the company (laptops, desktops and servers). Prior to this laptop I absolutely swore by Dell and recommended them to all my friends. Every bit of Dell kit throughout the company to date has functioned pretty much flawlessly.

We ordered three of these machines for senior management, waited for ages for them to turn up and then waited another few months hoping desperately for a full fix for all the issues (cpu & now gpu throttling, regular crashing, screen problems, problems with the heat vent etc). But unfortunately today I decided its time to swallow my pride and go the HP Envy route.

When I stand back and look at the big picture I cannot get away from the feeling that this laptop is inherently flawed in a number of different ways. There is no doubt that many good people at Dell are trying desperately to complete various tweaks and fixes so that the machine functions at a half decent level of performance. But there are just too many indicators that this laptop in the long-term is going to be a lemon. atlstang nailed it when he said (paraphrasing) - it seems the 1645 was designed around a 90w power supply and this will most likely be the crutch that haunts the 1645 for as long as its out.

To Bill, atlstang, unclewebb and all the people on this thread who have spent so much time testing, writing software and lobbying Dell people - many thanks for all your efforts. I have had some bad experiences with HP kit in the past so fingers crossed that I don't swap one nightmare for another!

Will we still buy Dell gear? - absolutely. Every manufacturer seems to have its screw-ups - we have had our fair share with other manufacturers - HP and Acer to name just two. But my confidence in Dell has definitely been dented somewhat by this experience.

 

Bill,

We all appreciate your assistance and involvement with the 1645, I almost wish at times I could talk with the engineers directly, but that’s just me. I would like to request that you please don’t get yourself stressed and over exerted with this forum, I’m sure your family has to deal with the fact that your distracted with it and that for sure is seen with the amount of posts you do daily after hours.

I’d hate to see problems in the family get caused from working "too hard" and then it start affecting your work. We would hate to lose you as your one of the only contacts that keeps in touch with us as much as you do!

Just my 2c

BTW, I’ll provide any testing details you might need from me so feel free to message me with any requests what so ever.

 

@sv0rd,

Totally understand where you're coming from, and on behalf of Dell, I apologize for the frustration. Please feel free to hit me up on Twitter (@BillatDell) or via PM here if there is anything I can ever help with.

@Siphen,

Thanks a lot for the kind words. I'll be coming at you in PM some time soon. I have this idea that I'd like to run by you and some other folks here. I need to get my ducks in a row first.

 

@Dell-Bill

Thanks heaps - it means a lot. Your handling of this situation has been nothing short of exemplary. Just yesterday I was talking with my customer service manager here and using you as an example of doing an amazing job of managing a crisis situation and going the extra mile for your customers. (He is one of the other managers with a 1645!)

My hat is definitely off to you and if you were in my employment you would definitely be receiving a bonus and a bucket load of respect.

 

I just received my 130W adapter (only took a week- amazing for Dell - thank you). It is a PA-4E Family, DA130PE1-00 Dell P/N JU012. They sent it with a Dell P/N FX429 cord adapter. The power supply is 1x3x6 inches. Problem is the cord adapter won't clear the edge of the supply. Anyone else having this problem. I guess I could trim the edge or force the cord in. Is anyone else having this issue. I would like to start running some tests, but I need some simple advice on the cord.

 

Just out of curiosity, does anyone know for sure at what level Rivatuner works when overclocking ATI cards? Like, does it work at the driver level or somehow get down to the BIOS? Google wasn't terribly helpful.

 

Hi Bill,
Even I am going with the same frustration. I did say that the games are working good but I will say Throttling is 99% Fixed.

My first concern is the awful customer service we in India were provided. I am telling you, It felt like those techs work for dell for the sake of it. They treated us the worst they can and kept arguing and Active Listening was missing. THEY JUST KEPT INTERRUPTING! Alas my 90W Adapter is gone and its a hell to move along with the laptop now. I would really appreciate if you can look at this issue and can we by any chance get our 90W Adapters back.

The other thing I want to say to this Community of XPS owners are that we all know now, This laptop aint Alienware so we have to balance the graphics settings to play it smoothly. If we really wanted games to run at Max settings and 1080p then we should have got Alienware m15x. The laptop aint that bad but the bottleneck is its ATI 4670 1GB Graphics Card. If it had a ATI 5000 series with a better cooling system. It could have been one of the best gaming laptops.

Bill for all the extra effort you have done for us by over-timing and listening to our queries, I Bow Down To You, You simply Rock!

 

Just a FYI, the Sony F has many issues as well. Keyboard noise, flex around the keyboard, microphone noise, poor Premium screens (not being able to view it from angles on the US version), etc. I just RMAd mine back to Sony for a refund as I work with photos and can't stand the screen when my MacBook Pro and netbooks at work look 10x better than it did. I now have a XPS 16 on it's way and can't wait.

 

I just hope my new XPS 16 won't have too many issues. This thread is scaring me after having a Sony F with issues. The HP Envy is just a bit over priced with the same features or I would have gone that route.

 

ThrottleStop url does not seem to be working. Just hangs, and timesout. Any other link?

 

If you got your AC adapter through me, I know what the problem is and can fix it up for you. If you got it via tech support, you can PM me your service tag and I will get you the right power cord. Sorry for the inconvenience.

Thanks for the kind words. I really appreciate the sentiment. If you want me to, I can pass feedback along to India tech support management. Just PM me your email address, and we'll pick it up from there. Sorry for the frustration.

 

@BILL

A07 eliminates CPU throttling. Good job!
But we still need to take into consideration GPU throttling.
Running 3 consecutive benchmarks(approx 40 seconds each) of GTA 4 saw the GPU temperature reach a peak of 78 degrees celsius.
At 1080p, games are more GPU intensive than at 720p. Hence GPU usage is more. You can check my benchmarks I posted yesterday for this.
Hence the GPU is most likely to throttle when gaming.
Just imagine, for 2-3 mins of gaming, peak gpu temp is 78 degrees
People game for 2-3 hours straight, obviously there will be a threshold on the GPU temperature causing it to throttle.

Also in A07, the fan kicks in late. The fan kicked in only midway through the 2nd benchmark.

 

Heres the gpu-z file log

 

bipul_fx whats your specs please. As its one of your logs that shows a bit of cpu throttling still that you posted earlier here. Curious if that is still happening to you.

 

GPU throttling has been in place for ALL and I mean ALL Dell notebooks ever since my first Inspiron(I have 8 laptops from Dell). When it passes the thermal threshold thats what happens... There are 3 things to do to prevent it or delay it:
1) replace the thermal paste and put AS5 thermal compound.
2) Get a freaking notebook cooler if you're going to game, I recommend NC2000 Zalman
3) Which has always worked for me is to lock the clocks(or even overclock *evil grin*) with Rivatuner it may reduce the lifetime of your video card but I think its worth the performance.

You aren't going to get anything from Dell regarding this matter, if they do it I would TRULY be surprised! They fail in this department bad and have always failed in it but I came to terms with it.

 

GPU downclocking is on my list. First I've heard on the late fan. I'll put that on my list as well. All the engineers are on holiday this week, so we will not hear more until next week.

A post a few pages back indicated the GPU never got over 86 with Rivatuner working. I think without Rivatuner it's clocking down at 84 or so. I think I can work with the fact that it seems not to exceed 86. Can you confirm your max GPU temp with Rivatuner working, XmDXtReMeK? I promise I won't call warranty abuse on you if you tell me.

 

ThrottleStop 1.93
http://www.sendspace.com/file/dtjos2

The FileDen site craps out once in a while so it should also be available here.

 

Hey EMAIL REMOVED BY MOD - USE PM NEXT TIME thats my email id and I am from India too.
Please pass a feedback to India Tech Support. I dont get why should Indian customers return their adapters when Others dont.
Also can u or someone please tell me which one is recommended the brick one or slim one with 1645. The bulk is not an issue with me. I dont carry my laptop often.

Thanks for the good work done by Dell/Bill.
I bought Dell and will buy again cause I believed that Dell support(warranty cover) is best in India, I think I am not disappointed but I still think that the tech-support team should be a lil more conisderate. I talked to 2 of them the one who shipped me the adapter was fine. but thats when I didnt argue about anything as I know its useless to argue with someone who himself is less knowledgeable about the issues than the customer. lol.

I really think that for people who have seen a troubled laptop(which might have reduced the health of the system) something shud be done for the warranty cover.

thnkx.

also jus like the throttling issue. teck support wont even acknowledge tht the heat vent is an issue. and says that it was designed that way cause its meant to be that way. lol.

I think we shud at least be guided to some one who is counterpart to bill in india.

 

I've seen temps on my GPU closer to 90C without any modifications (rivatuner etc...) but I'm playing more intense games longer perhaps?

 

Bill its late night right now, I use a laptop cooler now(nc2000), I smartened up after my experience with my Inspiron 1520(used rivatuner solution) so I don't have gpu throttling problem. But I can run tests for you tomorrow if you like and post the results...

 

Hmmm, but isn't your GPU downclocking before it hits 90? I guess they will tell me the spec temp for downclocking. Just bear in mind they likely have a case for why they pick a certain temp to downclock on the GPU. It has a lot to do with the thermal solution, and there's not much you can do but use Rivatuner and a good cooling pad.

 

Sure thanx. Its The core I7 720qm wid WLED Display and 4GB Ram and 500GB HDD.

 

That'd be cool. I'd like to see a second user verify they see downclocking at 84 without Rivatuner. Not so much concerned what it's doing with Rivatuner enabled.

 

Sure not a problem. Ill verify if there is any gpu downclocking(I recall having an fps dip once after 4-5 hours of gaming with my cooling pad but that can be anything) tomorrow and if there is ill check what temp it is(without cooling pad).I will also use rivatuner and stress the system a bit and see how far up the temps go and verify the peak temp(if it goes too high ill stop).

 

Well guys, it must be Friday!!! I got a call from Dell today and left a message informing me that they had sent out the wrong power supply. I could not decipher the return phone number and ended up calling the general number and waiting for 20 minute with some God awful musics churching around my head. Then my mobile rang and to my amazement it was Dell calling back to explain that she was sending me out the correct power supply by 5pm next Monday Eastern Australian time. I rang off and then my son came in with a packgage from Dell. I opened it and was greeted by a return sache and note telling me to send back my old power supply or I will charged forthwith! Mmmmmm. I carefully pointed DELL support to this group and then patiently understood that, even though it was clear that the solution was a 130w power supply, I had to wait until it was sanctioned by the DELL God's above (I was talking to Angel!). Then all was GO GO GO! and a new 130W adapter was on its way. Two days later it was confirmed that it would be delivered to my home by 5pm Thursday. No package came. In fact it was delivered to another location and the specific address information was ignored! Mmmmmmmm. So I was looking forward to finally getting down to using this notebook at its best (or nearly best!) only to be again dissappointed and wondering what is going to happen next.

You know, I really do not feel inclined to send the 90W Adapter back. I am moving house next week and I think I will just forget to inform DELL of my move. If I stuffed up as much as DELL has in its support and logistics then I would not have any clients. Someone should really write this debarcle up in a business journal as an example of how off-shore service models are destroying the reputation and good name of companies. Truly, if I had to pay a bit more to get trouble free service then I would do it. Wait a minute! Didn't I do that when I bought my DELL!!

The final part of my Friday rant. We pay for extended warranty and it seems we are mad not to because computer and notebook are very unreliable. Yet if you sell 1,000 units @$250 for extra warranty = $250,000 extra profit. I very much doubt that the failure rate is 250 in 1,000. Extended warranty simply means that it is a easy way for a company to increase profits by making customers pay for their poor design and the unreliability of cheap parts; and pocketing the remainer.

 

@Renaldostheold,

Sheesh. If a pc made me that unhappy, I'd just return it. I'm pretty sure someone made a mistake along the way somewhere. OK. Maybe a few mistakes. Sorry for the frustration. Hope it works out for you.