XPS 15 9570 Owners Thread

That's scary. Isn't that normal use for a laptop?

Maybe the i9 processor makes things worse.

 

@BeingMoreSnufkin

That looks more like impact damage than heat damage.

Nothing else inside or outside the laptop is melted or burnt and the area you squared isn't even the one that gets more toasty during stress tests.


Are you sure your son didn't drop the laptop or inadvertently hit the screen?

 

Yes, we're sure he didn't drop the laptop or inadvertently hit the screen. There's no evidence of it being dropped or hit.
Bear in mind that the motherboard picture is not from our laptop. We haven't looked inside to see if anything else is damaged.

 

The damage seems to be where the fan blows (in the gap between the body and the display, on both sides).
Of course, this shouldn't happen in any case, and I don't recall something like this reported. Quite a few of hot bag reports, including my 9550 twice. But in most cases, hot bag may be already from the laptop mostly idling. It should get throttled down as it heats up.

 

Tell that Dell and MS. In my oppinion, Modern Standby is a total failure and dangerous on devices with that high TDP like a laptop with H CPUs and also dGPU. It is just made for phones and some tablets, but totally not for a 40-60W CPU and 70W dGPU. There is no gurantee modern standby works because it is software controlled and the software can crash/fail or just badly programmed.

Thats what I meant with the Kappa. The (current) 14nm i9 by Intel are also a total fail and dangerous inside laptops as I see it. At least in such small thin laptops like the XPS. And people are just stupid buying those laptops or just dont know better, what you can buy should work, right? And it is a total waste of money btw too.

Also does to me. I dont think a burn damage would look like that. I am not an expert though on forensic.

What do you mean "there is no evidence" ... you mean you just have your sons word. I dont want to imply that he is lying to you, but maybe... there was just a little "accident" he maybe not even noticed himself. Like a pen left inside when he closed it or something else. Thinking back when I was young, I maybe would have been afraid of telling my Dad the truth when I did something bad and broke something expensive. Maybe hes just afraid of telling. Ask him again in a friendly way and tell him it wont be his fault and there are no consequences, if he did it by accident, it was an accident.

But yes, the 9570 totally can "burn to death" if modern standby breaks, for multiple reasons.

 

The damage is over the end of a heat pipe. The laptop was turned off, closed & in a backpack. If the end of that pipe was uppermost, the heat would rise & the pipe would absorb it, making it a hotspot. It's possible, of course, that the lcd unit was faulty anyway & the heat caused it to fail.

We have spoken to our son in a friendly way. He's not as young as you seem to think, works very hard & knows that he wouldn't be "in trouble" if the damage was as a result of an accident. Accidents happen & if that was the cause of the damage we would just take a deep breath & pay to have it repaired.

 

Sadly you cannot directly link the image when it's hosted on one drive (or I'd have to look into how to do it). You can always download the images and then host them on the forums so they show up in your post.

Having said that, the screen looks damaged from being physically damaged. Maybe it's hard to tell from the pictures, but to me it looks like something that was caused by improper care and not by "melting" to me. I'm not sure Dell is going to replace that under warranty unless you have accidental damage protection.

 

I dont think they will replace this under warranty. Just seatch for a new panel on ebay and change it. Its not hard i upgraded my fhd screen to 4k this way.

 

Dell confirms that the next XPS 15 will not have the DPC latency issues of the XPS 15 9570 Notebookcheck.net | Jun 6, 2019


"Azor has promised that the upcoming XPS 15 7590 will not share the same DPC latency issues that its predecessor has" Yees, but unfortunately this does not help much for the owners of today's XPS models.

--------------------------------------------

Why use resources on EOL model's when all engineers can spend all their valuable time on upcoming models?

Dell backtracks on XPS 15 9570 S3 sleep fix

Sound familiar, anyone? Just over a month ago Dell reported that addressing the removal of S3 sleep was next on its agenda for the XPS 15 9570. Disappointingly, but perhaps unsurprisingly, the company has seemingly u-turned on this promise.

 

The good news is that nobody will waste any more time waiting for DPC latency or S2 fixes on the 9570. The downside is that plenty of 9570 users have been let down.

At least Dell had the courtesy to until the end of the 9570 sales cycle before releasing this news.​

 

Not sure if this great deal is still valid. Buy a second one and make him happy


Deal | Want to get your hands on a Dell XPS 15 (9570) Touch laptop? Save up to nearly US$900 with site discount and code

 

If the 2019 XPS 15 has working DPC, working S3, no dGPU throttle, no fan issues, someone has to sue them so 9570 owners can swap for free. This is just not acceptable.

 

It's looking like they'll have the same chassis and thermal design. We probably won't see a real refresh until the 2020 variant, if we're lucky. Knowing Dell, I'm not holding my breath. I'm expecting to see SSDs and RAM soldered on the board for the future XPS laptops. Which would be an immediate no-buy for me.

 

No worries, Dell won't be putting much effort into optimizing the 5-year old XPS platform.

Until Intel updates its 45 watt mobile CPUs, I can see why Dell keeps recycling the Skylake chassis & motherboard. As a consumer, the platform needs a full redesign; it looks stale and has some major deficiencies.

 

Hey, I've been tinkering around with my XPS 15 9570 (i7, 16GB RAM, 1050Ti) since I got it about a month ago and I've tried everything to reduce temps down to acceptable levels. Right now it's idling with 10 Firefox tabs and Spotify open at >45 degrees at ~2.5W of CPU power according to Throttlestop which, while decent, feels like is worse than some other people on here are getting (like <40 degrees on idle) and it's annoyingly warm to use like this. In comparison, when my other Core i5-7200U equipped laptop uses 2.5W of power it's nowhere near as hot, like it stays at 30-ish degrees.

Then on a full load using Prime95 I had to reduce the Turbo Short and Long Max wattages to 55 and 45 respectively for the machine not to hit 100 degrees. This is on a machine with a -130mV on Core & Cache, -50 on iGPU, nVidia dGPU disabled (gets redisabled on login because it sucks power otherwise), repasted (several times), tape mod applied and a thermal pad added to the I/O controller (because that one heats up when using an eGPU). I tried putting thermal pads on the VRMs - both with the stack and the "connect to heatsink" methods but the former made the laptop unbearable to use in my lap which I do often and the latter made increased CPU and GPU temps by ~3 degrees which isn't a sacrifice I was willing to make.

Anything else I could try to reduce temperatures?

 

That is pretty hot near idle. The watts are very rough estimates so don't pay much attention to them.

Check out the ThrottleStop Guide posts from @unclewebb regarding c-states and getting control of superfluous processes. Your core and Package c-states should be reverting to at least c7 in idle but sometimes it takes some effort to get that sorted on an XPS.

On the lead screen of ThrottleStop, you should be able to get c0% below 1% on idle.

Also, you might use SpeedShift with EPP of a high number in ThrottleStop. 0 is max performance, around 78 is average but allows max turbo speeds, 255 is lowest energy performance in theory although YMMV. The SpeedShift adjustments in Windows don't work on my 9550 & 9560 so ThrottleStop was the only reliable EPP adjuster. For more info see

http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/dell-xps-speed-shift.796891/

You can download the "Dell Command I Power Manager" to access some registers that I don't think you can otherwise adjust. In thermal management, select "cool"; that will remap fans and some other registers at the expense of performance.

 

Right. I saw the "Throttlestop guide" thread and the "Improving Battery Life on Windows [+Enabling Deeper C States]" one but I believe I've already done the things mentioned there - I've disabled a few services, set EPP to 160 on battery and 84 on AC and have disabled most startup programs. Nevertheless, this is what Throttlestop gives me for my C-states and my laptop uses a bit more than 10 watts on idle in BatteryInfoView which is more than expected:



I already have Dell Power Manager but I've set it to Cool although it doesn't seem to help much with idle temps as the fan doesn't come on until it exceeds 50 degrees.

I should probably note that I'm running a Corsair MP510 NVMe SSD in AHCI (for Linux reasons) and I couldn't find any newer AHCI driver or a different NVMe controller firmware which was mentioned as a possible culprit to bad C-states.

Maybe there are other tips on the Throttlestop thread but going through 1000 forum pages to track it down doesn't seem like a good use of my time.

 

On idle with everything off, you should see package c-states with C8 > 80%. That low % in your image indicates a lot of idle activity or driver issues, unfortunately. As your C8 package states are being used, I suspect this is related to background activity.

Look for the posts by Uncle Webb & @Vasudev from the past year regarding c0% on idle. If you are above 1% then you have some cleaning up to do. This can make a big difference and is absolutely worth the time to search if you want to drop temps & power consumption.

Are you sure your repaste is good? You may need a repaste after a year. Indication of issues are high temps vs. others here and/or all cores running at different temps (above say +/- 2*c when you run an intensive benchmark like Prime95). Do a repaste, clamp down heatsink, remove heatsink and look at thermal paste for complete, very thin and very even distribution; if your process looks good, clean up then repaste. Also, clean out your fans and blow some canned air in radiators to clear dust.

 

@Coffeeboi Revert Dell Manager settings to defaults and disable the app entirely to check battery drain along with c0%. I think Dell Manager is constantly querying EC and other sensors that reduces battery life.
I tried it on Inspiron 15 and then I uninstalled it since most options are available in Bios.

 

Right, I've done 2 repastes already in the month I've had this laptop with the second being just to test if the first one went fine and both of them produced the same results. The cores don't deviate more than 5-ish degrees under load. I could try to repaste at some point, maybe when I've got some time tomorrow. The laptop is pretty new and clean so dust is unlikely to be an issue.

And when it comes to c0%, I had a look at @Vasudev and @unclewebb 's posts and none seem to be things that could solve the problem(I have IRST disabled since I'm in AHCI but that seems unlikely to be the culprit). Speaking of @Vasudev , I just uninstalled Dell Power Manager, rebooted but still the same c7% so no dice.

I'm going to try and see if I get similar C-state percentages in Linux soon so at least I'll be able to identify if it's my hardware or just Windows screwing up.

 

On Linux the drain will be higher in nvidia dGPU mode @22W and in Intel/open source nouveau the drain miight 8-12W.
Install tlp, tuned-adm.
In terminal, type tuned-adm profile balanced or laptop-battery-powersave etc.. depending on your workloads.

 

There are a few package c-state tips and links in the first post

http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/dell-xps-speed-shift.796891/

 

Right, I knew about those beforehand and have some issues with both approaches:

- The one that recommends a "Driver Booster" program is obviously a no-go. It goes without saying.
- The other person that recommends that I update my SATA Controller... well, I don't use SATA as my SSD is NVMe so that's obviously not going to help. Nevertheless I did find there is a SATA Controller on my device (likely for the model with the smaller battery) and I updated it to the Intel RST one but again no change in C-states. In general, it seems like the issue might stem form the NVMe controller that MS provide and sadly there is no alternative driver for that.

Sooo, still no dice. Thanks for the suggestions though.

 

XPS 15 9570 get hot or drain its battery when asleep? Dell says that you are using it wrong Notebookcheck.net | June 10, 2019

Where credit should be given. I expect Dell XPS boss Frank Azor endorses this awkward explanation fully out and will will stand up for his employees statement
"Bear with us, because we are still scratching our heads over this one. Previously, Dell has suggested that people "research modern standby and turn it off" if their XPS 15 9570 will not sleep properly or has high battery drain when asleep. Now, the company is seemingly blaming customers for causing this behaviour. Yes, you read that correctly" Please start use the notebook correct. Because some of you obviously use it wrong

 

Its their adaptive battery charging tech in BIOS that can wakeup PC to drain battery even when shutdown. Very good feature to kill battery.

 

@Coffeeboi - After a fresh install of Windows 10, individual cores can spend 99% of their time in the C7 state.



Your screenshot shows an average around 75% in C7 which means you have a significant amount of crap running in the background. Maybe only one crappy app but crap is crap. Open up the Task Manager, click on the Details tab and click on the CPU column to organize the running tasks by CPU usage. There has to be something on your computer that is running in the background. Only you can find out what it is and then you can decide if it is worth keeping or if you should uninstall it.

 

Keyword IMMEDIATE


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Right. It turns out the culprit is the FB Messenger tab I have in Firefox. The bloody thing uses 120MB of RAM and has a constant CPU drain. Thanks, Facebook.

 

I solved all problems and issues... I sold it!

Never again I buy Dell toys. For me they can only sell tomatoes...
They should solve all issues in the 9570 or swap for free with the new one.

 

Everything Dell (balveen) said is just BS, and it is so cringe how no one working at Dell seem to have any true idea, what they are talking about.

1. you cant toggle or switch during Windows 10 setup (a reinstall is useless and doesnt change anything), if you want connected or disconnected standby

2. you cant switch between connected and disconnected standby anymore, since over 1-2 years (not sure which major update it was), but MS changed it. They changed this in every major update of Windows 10, so there are 3-4 different howtos found everywhere on the internet, all of them wrong if you consider using latest 1803 or 1903 version. There is no toggle option anymore under System->Energy (you were able to select if you want to use connected or disconnected, before)

3. The current setting (gui design under 1903, changed in every major Windows 10 updates in the past) you can chose from is this: https://i.imgur.com/jxc4Pi5.png It will disconnect Wlan during modern standby. "Disconnect from wlan during standby and on battery = > always).

So everything Dell is telling here and everywhere else is total nonsense. They have no idea, what they are talking about. This is not the cause of drains or your laptops "burn to death" in your bags. Modern standby ist just a failure of a design, at least with Windows. It works under MacOs because of how closed the system is with its drivers and how there is nothing running in the background.

 

Dell woes continue as XPS 15 self-destructs notebookcheck.net | Jun 10, 2019

With Dell starting to blame customers if their XPS 15 9570 overheats when asleep, one getting so hot that it explodes would be rather inconvenient PR. That is the state that one person arrived home to see their XPS 15 in, and Dell customer support has not been forthcoming on helping them resolve the matter.

 

Dell PCs affected by Intel meltdown.

 

The heat issues are Disappointing.... nonetheless if you guys had to do it all over again... would you buy the XPS 15 again

For my purposes... I’m attempting to get my bachelors degree online and other than that. Just anime and movies.... bit of pornhub if my girl gets on my nerves lol

The one and only game I would play is Halo Wars 2 which shouldn’t be all that taxing for the XPS.... Can it handle it? I would be doing the repasting of the chips and undervolt the pc if needed

Due to my profession I live in a hotel room 2-3 nights a week and I accumulated 275,xxx hotel points that I converted into $1100 worth of Best Buy gift cards and I’m plotting on this config

Last Dell I had was a Studio XPS (Those were the days) and since then I’ve been a Mac user... I am considering a 2017 MacBook Pro 15 but I rather use the gift cards because they are basically free

 

If you are intending on a macbook pro 15 (IMO, for whatever reason ), Best Buy does sell them.

 

But Tim Cook is really smoking that ish... $1,600 is my max budget

 

The 2019 15" MacBook Pros now have pretty amazing thermal headrooms considering how thin they are. And rumors are still of a 16" MacBook Pro "Pro" at the end of the year - possible Apple portable workstation?

If anything with Apple releasing the Mac Pro and re-engineered MacBook Pros is they still can make professional, high-quality devices.

 

Why don't you choose Lenovo thinkpad extreme with 1050 or thinkpad p52?

 

I want a 15 inch 4K display and I’m imited to buying from Best Buy only... I would love to get the X1 Extreme but Best Buy don’t sell it

 

Dell doubles down on justifying XPS 15 9570 problems notebookcheck.net | June 17, 2019

Dell insists that Modern Standby will wake a system faster than S3 can, which Microsoft has thoroughly covered in its own support article. In essence, Dell is telling XPS 15 9570 owners that having wake on Wi-Fi enabled along with an outdated BIOS and drivers are to blame for high power consumption when the device is asleep. Incidentally, these also apply to the Precision 5530. Dell states the following too for both devices:

"Set the system up to use Modern Standby – Disconnected. This tells the NIC not to stay awake while in sleep mode. This is what Dell sets in the factory by default"

 

How incompetent can a company be? There is no disconnected/connected switch by reinstall, you can set wlan off on battery in 1803/1903 via system energy setting ( https://i.imgur.com/LIDLqmA.png ), there are infinite other issues with modern standby causing random drains (all random Windows 3rd party drivers, programs, tasks, services) and melting laptops in bags. dGPU toggles on/off too in modern standby (fans turning on off on off). No one cares if modern standby wakes up 1 second faster than S3, no one CARES. Hey it wakes up 1 second faster compared to S3, but has the very high chance to drain your battery, melts your laptop in bags, and fans going on off on off on off all the time in "standby". Wlan is totally NOT the cause of these issues. That was long time ago, maybe with version 1603 or something? Windows had long time ago a toggle switch for wlan off during modern standby and on battery. My Wlan turns off during moderns standby even powercfg -a tells I have "connected standby", guess what? Bad drain, fans turnin on randomly all the time in modern standby. This is obviously caused by "wlan keeping on" right. DISGUSTING LIES. INCOMPETENT. To me Dell doesnt look like a hardware company with their own developers anymore, but just a cheap buy in and sell out comany. Just buying hardware/drivers/bios from 3rd party company and "trust" and "relay" on their word. Oh MS told us modern standby is awesome, see, here is an article by MS telling it is faster!!11 It also contains the word "modern" in it, we at Dell liked that, especially Frank. Frank likes modern things.

 

Well, now my third (or maybe forth, have lost count) 9570 has broken down and this time I just refused another switch and has just had my cancellation approved. Now, back to the same question again on what to buy instead...

Must say that Dells customer service in Sweden is really amazing, has never been any whine or anything. If only their computers were as good.

Since I have a 9560 that I fortunately enough did never dare to sell that is my main driver for now. Will probably wait a while for refreshed models to be released from all major manufacturers.

Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk

 

@improwise you have been a trooper.

Maybe the updated XPS has some of the issues sorted out. That is 4th generation of this platform and the Skylake CPU so it should be. That said, the 9570 was 3rd generation of the XPS platform and Skylake CPU and had some issues.

I might wait until intel moves off the Skylake boat, which might be in another year or so. But then you are dealing with brand new XPS and CPU platforms so maybe give that some time to sort out lol.

I would consider another brand laptop also.

 

I kinda feel like the rats are leaving the sinking ship and I will sink with the Titanic, because of being 3rd class. Aye.

 

The irony is that the 9560 has been rock solid so far. And that is with the same OS installation as I just moved the SSD when firing my 9570 a week ago. And so far no sleep issues nor dead batteries.

Sent from my SM-N960F using Tapatalk

 

New 11.2 bios up. Haven't got time to experiment at the moment, but would love to hear what the "enhancements to thermal management of the system" actually means... Also, if there's any improvement to DPC latency...

https://www.dell.com/support/home/u...y&oscode=wt64a&productcode=xps-15-9570-laptop

Fixes & Enhancements
Fixes:
- Removed the pre-boot Intel RST Manager Optimized Defaults option.
- Firmware updates to address security advisories INTEL-SA-00233(CVE-2018-12126, CVE-2018-12127, CVE-2018-12130 and CVE-2019-11091)
- Firmware updates to address security advisory INTEL-SA-00213 (CVE-2019-0090, CVE-2019-0086, CVE-2019-0091, CVE-2019-0092, CVE-2019-0093, CVE-2019-0094, CVE-2019-0096, CVE-2019-0097, CVE-2019-0098, CVE-2019-0153 and CVE-2019-0170)

Enhancements:
- Replaces Absolute Software service from Computrace to Absolute Persistence Module service
- Updated the Realtek USB LAN UEFI driver to improve stability of connection.
- Enhances thermal management of the system.

 

- Enhances thermal management of the system.

I just hope it doesn't mean "throttle further"

 

After the first year of driver & BIOS chaos and a repaste, my 9550 also has been rock-solid. Good DPC latency also. It took a lot of learning and effort to get to this point but it serves as a pretty good live music laptop. In fact, just yesterday I was thinking about how well the screen, keyboard, track pad, cables, case and carbon fibre have held up; essentially new condition.

Still has some quirks; the headphone out is wonky. Can't use sleep in a backpack. Likes to force driver updates.

I owned the 9560, which had similar DPC latency. For my purposes, it performed about the same as the 9550 so I just kept the 9550. With thermal mods, the 9560 can perform a bit better for some scenarios.

The 9570 does not interest me due to DPC issues and I am wary the 2019 replacement will have similar problems as this will be same chassis and same Skylake CPU. After 2020, Intel's 7nm with onboard ThunderBolt might provide a compelling performance boost for my usage scenarios.

 

That totally smells like another epic fail. Anyone know any details so far? Just throttle it more now the new model comes out, and then never give any bios updates whatsoever anymore for it. What else should it be than throttle?

https://www.laptopmag.com/articles/dell-xps-15-modern-standby-issues

 

I did a quick test the last hour with this bios with a game, I was playing over the couple last days, so I knew the temperature and clock values, I monitored over the last days playing it. It totally seems to me, they changed the fan logic under stress (gaming)... for them now running at least at 1/3 or 1/2 of the speed (being more silent) and this results in a way higher temperatures. This is BAD!

I am using a 12W throttle on the CPU, a -112mV undervolt and a 0.875V undervolt on the dGPU, and now the temperatures rose to 77°C CPU and 72°C dGPU after just playing 5 minutes, where they were around 67°C and 66°C yesterday with the previous bios (and fans running higher). This could easily trigger the 74°C throttle of the dGPU. The boost waves of fan high/low/high/low while gaming also seem to be missing now or not so agressive anymore as before.

This is also just a really low load game, dGPU around 40%, and CPU 15%.

Totally no idea, who had the epic brain fart at Dell now to reduce the fans to make it run hotter and maybe throttle more, no one asked for this change.

No change for the short dGPU polls, fans triggered all the time for no reason.

 

@Papusan What is Mr. Azor's team doing?