ATI Mobility Radeon? HD 2600 vs. Nvidia Geforce 8600M GT 512MB

Wait guys, I was under the impresson that ddr3 version of 2600 was better than the ddr2. If so then why do all the data suggest that ddr2 can OC much higher than ddr3? for example, others with ddr2 2600 have reached over 700core/600 mem range whereas mine(ddr3 2600) can only reach 500core/480mem.

 

What laptop do you have, and also could you please link to someone with the DDR2 HD2600 OC'ing to 700/600?

 

I own the hp 8510p
Link: Look at the fourth post by Shambles. He quoted someone who achieved 700/600
http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=176829&highlight=2600+overclock

 

Plus, didn't some people say that the 2600s are severely underclocked. My results suggests otherwise so what did you base your answers on?

 

I'm not seeing that. He quoted notyou, who got 625/525 I believe. He also posted (without a link) an unsubstantiated claim of 700/570, which I would need a screenshot and some serious stress tests to believe was stable. (570mhz is just withing the range of possibility for DDR2 mem, if your lucky).

Not sure who you're talking to here, but most reports of severely underclocked HD2600's are referring to the GPU in the HP 8510p, which (if it does indeed has GDDR3 memory) is quite severely underclocked.

 

how does the 570m compare to the 2600 HD (in the new hp 8510's)? they're both DDR3 right?

 

Quadro FX570m GDDR3=Geforce 8600M GT GDDR3. So it's faster than a HD2600

 

thanks, and are these benchmarks pretty standard?

GDDR3 HD 2600 (3300 3dmark06)
GDDR3 8600M GT (3700 3dmark06)
GDDR3 570M (3900 3dmark06)

and if so, how much higher could the GDDR3 HD 2600 be if it were not underclocked (as HP ships it)?

 

It would be around the 8600M GT GDDR3 scores. But I don't know how much it would OC above that, as the 8600M GT can OC fairly well.

 

HD 2600 scores are with underclocked core/mem so they should be on par with 8600GT yet the true performance You will see in games. From I have heard nVidia is a bit far behind ATi when it comes to drivers so at the mo ATi is winning during gaming. But apparently HD series suffer big FPS loss while AA is turned on. I didnt notice that in my case though.

 

Hey guys!

What about the ATI HD2600 Vs. Nvidia 8600GT, both with 256Mb and DDR2, which one is better for gaming?
And which one uses less energy?

I saw here and they are only separated by 171 points in BM06, is this really significant?

GeForce 8600M GT - 3252
Mobility Radeon HD 2600 - 3081


take care

 

In cnet.co.uk's review of the Toshiba A210, the ATi HD2600 gets 3181 in 3DMark 06 (256mb DDR2), so that's just 71 points difference.

Also, I was looking at the 8600gt screenshot thread, and the performance benchmark for Company of Heroes gets 36.8 fps average with everything at high but for shadows at medium, effects fidelity and denisity both at medium, and model detail at 50%. My HD2600 gets an average of 35.2 fps with everything at high, and model detail at 100%. So I think that's a strong result for the HD2600, espcially considering the laptop with the 8600gt has a T7250 Core 2 (2.0ghz) and my laptop has a Turion TL-56 (1.8ghz).

According to GPU-Z, the HD2600 is based on a 65nm manufacturing process, whereas the 8600gt is 80nm. So based off that, the HD2600 should use less power, but that's just an asumption.

Overall, I think that the performance difference between the two 256mb DDR2 GPUs is insignificant.

 

To answer your question quickly, no. ~200 points isn't enough of a difference to determine which card you should choose. You must also look at the other differences between the cards, ie. the ATI is made on a smaller process so it should be cooler and use less power so potentially it could OC higher (I got my HD2600 to a staggering [safely clocked] 740/468 3dmark06 stable from 500/400, [mem could go higher in other tests before artifacting]). But the real difference should be the price, so just get the one that's cheaper (assuming the rest of the laptop specs are the same).

 

What did you score in 3DMark06 before and after OC?

 

I scored (at default settings, 500/400, and 1280x800) 3100 while OC'd (at default settings, 740/468 and 1280x800) I managed to get about 3800.

 

Very nice increase there!

Since the HP 8510p scores about 3300 with its underclocked HD 2600, does that mean once you manage to overclock it, it could break 4200?

 

Thanks for the reply, it seems the HD2600 it really kicks ass!

The doubt was on purchasing the F8SA or F8SV model of asus, the price and specs are the same, the only difference is on the grafic card.
Since the HD2600 uses less power and has a great performance, i'm gonna purchase the F8SA with the referred grafic card!

Thanks for your help guys!

 

I played same games on different laptops,while (i read from you) on 3dmark hd2600 is better in real games 8600gt is 5-10% faster(counted with fraps).But hd2600 has better image quality and resists better to filters that cause heavy drops of framerate on 8600gt

 

I thought AA/AF caused a heavy drop in performance in the new ATI cards vs. NVIDIA ones.

 

Ah, but if the image quality is higher, that then means you could lower the settings, which would then equal the 8600m gt for quality, but you would very likely end up getting more fps due to the quality difference. Therefore, the HD2600 should be better.

 

Ok I'm more than likely going to be buying the Toshiba A210-11P on Monday for £599 sporting a HD 2600. From what I can see it's an absolutely steal considering the features. Am I making the right choice? The HD 2600 seems pretty decent. I'm not that bothered about playing games at ultra-high/high settings. As long as I can play UT3, CoD4, etc. on medium settings I'm fine.

 

I think the HD2600 is DDR3

 

No HD 2600 can be either DDR2 or GDDR3.

 

How much of a difference in CS:S would there be between a HD 2600 GDDR3 and a 8600M GT / 570M GDDR3 with the same settings?

 

Both will max out the game fine, so don't even worry about it. Performance differences in older games is mostly driver related, but baseline performance is good enough that it's usually not a problem.

 

What about newer games such as Call of Duty 4? How much of a real-world difference will there be at the same settings?

 

The problem is that I've never seen benchmarks for a stock clocked GDDR3 HD2600. Are you looking into getting the HP 8510p? If so, expect at HP stock clocks and newest drivers to be up to 20% slower than a stock clocked GDDR3 8600M-GT/FX 570m. However I've seen OC'd DDR2 HD2600's reach the same framerates as a stock GDDR3 8600M-GT.

 

Hmm "notyou" said he overclocked HD2600 mobility? Ive tried overclocking with ati tray tools but it gave me blue screen? and ntune, may i knoe how you overclock yours? and what program did u use?

 

I think people underestimate the power of the DDR2 HD2600, it's quite a powerful performer. If you've seen the clocks that Roby86 has got with his DDR2 HD2600 using AMD GPU Clock tool it's pretty impressive. I'm hoping to achieve similar results with mine as my new laptop will be basically identical to his. CS:S is an ATi optimized game so the GDDR3 HD2600 might pip the GDDR3 8600M GT.

 

Hmm i downloaded that AMD GPU Clock tool, How do you use this for overclocking? it says Engine :499.50 Memmory Clock:396.00, But how come when i check the box that says Show Current Clocks. it reads Engine:109.68 Memmory Clock:252.00 ???? WHY so low, Can some1 Correct me, im confused what is this suppose to say.

 

What card do you have and what laptop?

 

F3KA A1, AMD Turion X2 TL-60, HD2600 Mobility 512 MB

 

Hmm i messed with it and set 499/396, now even if i put a check mark on " show current settings, its 499/396 too.. ahh damm will i damage my card?

 

Hmm sounds dubious to me. I don't think it's detecting your card's clocks properly.

 

I think the 109/252 is a manufacturers settings, i really dont knoe, but i used GPU-Z too it said the same thing, til i set the clocks my self to 499/396

 

Hmm that is very strange, anyone have any other ideas?

 

I don't care about performance. Maybe the performance will be very same.
Actually problem is DRIVER. I never believe ATI drivers which drive me crazy. Performance is not major problem, think about the reliablility.

 

Myfrozenchip.....your card is using performance on demand...it uses as much freq as it needs of OS...when you start some game it'l boost up to 500/400..maybe in CCC(Catalyst Control Center) your powerplay is set to battery optimized...you must set it to max performance...then check...

Cheers...

 

Hi from Slovakia ,

I have Toshiba Satellite A200-1M8 with HD2600 500/400MHz and Catalyst 7.10 (modded by DH mobility modder on Vista). My problem is that i cant set permanently clocks on this card. I tried AtiTool, Ati Tray Tools, AMD GPU Clock, Riva Tuner and PowerStrip but without results. Also a tried to turn off ati powerplay but clocks still dont want to set up. If i set any freq in these utilities, freq automatic goes back.
And question on you, how did you overclock your card? I cant find anything functional guide on the web... Please, help me.

Nice day

 

Roby86, Thats what i tought too, that it will boost up if i start some game, but on powerplay everything is set to maximum performance, battery and plug inn, i can overclock mine from amd gpu clock tools, but im not sure how to use it right tho, Can you tell me how step by step u did yours? Because like what i said, When you open up the AMD Gpu tool, it reads, 499/396 engine and memmory, BUT, If you click that box that it says "show current clocks" it says 109/252 engine and memmory. Then IF i uncheck it, it reads 499/396 again, its pretty strange. I dont wana do any overclocking yet til i knoe how u safely did yours, cuz everytime i select restore default clocks, it gives me a driver error.

 

WOW just tested Crysis once again with the 7.10 catalyst , Resolution of 1280x800 widescreen, All medium settings , DX9 30-45respectively playable rates, DX10 20-30FPS jumps around really playable rates, i just came across some display problems on crysis so i uninstalled it. GAY, but yea those wer the numbers i saw b4 uninstall,

 

do u know that all dx10 stuff is possible to get on dx 9?? just need a small patch lol

 

Crysis is a tough comparison for these chips, Its been pretty much confirmed that the largest difference between the HD2600 & 8600GT is in Oblivion & Crysis while all the others seem to be pretty much the same with the HD2600 lagging behind by a minimal 5-10%.

8600GT GDDR2 > HD2600 GDDR2 ~10% average
HD 2600 GDDR3 > 8600GT GDDR2 ~10% average
8600GT GDDR3 > HD2600 GDDR3 ~15% (because ati stocks are 500/600 while nvidia are 500/700)

Then again the HD2600 tends to do better in games like The Orange Box & F.E.A.R so to each their own.

 

Don't know if it's posted, Catalyst 7.11 has been released...suppose in changelog better performance in Bioshock, etc...on amd.ati.com

Cheers...

 

Did everybody downloaded 7.11 yet? mod tool work for that too?

 

Hmm, I downloaded that 7.11 Catalyst but my mod tool diidnt detect the driver when i was extracting. Do I always have to un install the old version before installing new versions? and just 1quick question, I already did recovery 3 times in 1 week, does this hurt the computer? performance? And how how come after i do recoveries, i notice that the hard drive light is always lighting up now, ever since teh first recovery? what does this mean?

 

Always a good idea to uninstall and then install a fresh set of drivers if you have any problems with a straight upgrade. I usually just install over the old, but every once in a while or for testing/reviews I'll run DriverCleaner and do a fresh install of drivers after a full removal.

BTW, 7.11 wokring fine on the MRX700 in XP, still haven't tried Vista on the Fujitsu yet.

Sounds like you're using Vista and the recovery has left Super Fetch and indexing on. Disable them if you don't want to thrash the heck out of the HDD.

 

Works fine with 7.11 Catalyst...and Mobility Modder 0.8.8.0...with Vista.

Noticed some slightly better performance in games...Crysis and Bioshock...

 

[/QUOTE]Sounds like you're using Vista and the recovery has left Super Fetch and indexing on. Disable them if you don't want to thrash the heck out of the HDD.[/QUOTE]

Hmm How do you Disable them? Well now the Hard Drive is not clicking alot anymore, it just happens once in a while. Iono wtf does it do tho. And yea 7.11 Catalyst Improves ALOT of performance and FPS on some games i play alot, Guildwars, and CS:Source and Crysis.


Asus F3KA-A1
AMD Turion X2 TL-60(2.0 GHz)
ATi Radeon HD2600 DDR2 512 MB
Stock 500/400,
2 GB DDR2 667 MHz
160 HDD (5400 rpm)
1.3 MP Camera

 

How much of a performance increase did you guys see with using the 7.11 drivers?

Secondly, how does the HD 2600 with 256MB GDDR3 memory handle UT3? Will it be able to play it at max settings?