Dota 2 Discussion thread

Baka loves meepo ♥

 

Yeah disruptor is fun. Glimpse is so broken end game, no retreat.

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Tree_Burner and Hime: Disruptor is definitely one of my favorite heroes. His combos are pretty strong, kinetic field + thunderstrike + ulti and his ulti can be paired with a ton of other heroes. His glimpse ability, super fun to use, especially if you're attacking a tower and you see someone porting in, just glimpse them back. Haha. I wouldn't necessarily say it's broken, though. I would say it's one of those abilities that is really strong....but only in the right and competent hands. I've played many games where it's been misused, for example we're chasing someone from the river and then up into the forest high ground, then the disruptor would glimpse the target, allowing them to escape easily.

Anyways, played my first randoms this past weekend. Randomed Undying one game. Fun hero, really strong early and mid game, but I've noticed that late game, he starts to tail off. Also randomed as Lich and Razor. It was fun playing as Lich and denying the enemies some xp and gold and one of his in-game saying "Lich gonna have your mana" which was a play-on from the Ol' Dirty lyrics "B***h better have my money!" And his ulti can be super devastating! Razor, I didn't really understand how to play him, but last night, I watched a few youtube dota casters play him and I'm really looking forward to learning how to use him. His static link ability sounds SUPER good to use. I forget who the player was, but he was jumped by an ulti'd and BKB'd Lycan, so he linked him and that Lycan was absolutely nerfed and destroyed.

 

Razor's one of those weird Agility heroes that's built differently. More tanky than damage ._. Razor's quite a pain to fight against 1v1 and has an annoying passive that slows so much. Baka does not like fighting a good Razor.

 

Razor can be a pain to kill, but enemies with slow abilities like Naix can be his downfall as Razor can be tanky as Baka said, but he relys on his speed if a team fight goes wrong. However if you know something is going down, you can use Static Link on their carry and steal away all his damage. Like let's say a pub stomp fed Ursa blinks in an slows your entire team. Just static link his damage away while keeping your distance. Also he is pretty crazy during team fight with lightning storm and his plasma field hit all enemies. Plasma Field should be used very quickly as it takes time for it to cooldown then use it to finish off enemies, even double or triple kill with your ult. And by 16, your ultimate has a 20 second duration with a 60 second cooldown, almost like Lycan's ult...crazy. But Razor is very fragile during the laning phases, so that is the best time to chain stun/gank him (as a pattern you see with all agility carry heroes).

I tend to go Vanguard, Sange & Yasha, Dadelus, Heart of Tarrasque, Black King Bar, Butterfly, Treads.

 

Baka: Yeah when I did some research on him while waiting for the game to start, I was thinking, "wait...isn't he an agi hero? Why do I have to get items to make me tanky?" I didn't really know what I was doing when I played him, but after more research and watching videos of how he's played, now I know why.

Hime: 1v1 against Naix shouldn't be too bad, actually I think Razor would be a counter to Naix. His slow shouldn't be a problem because you wanna be near your enemy so you're in range and have sight so static link won't break and for the ult anyways. And when he pops Rage or even against a hero against BKB, I read that if you target the ground when you use link, it'll bypass his Rage or BKB and you'll still be able to steal his damage. If the Naix player is smart enough, he know's he'd have to run away.

But yeah, it's pretty crazy how high the static link buff can get. If you stay linked for the whole duration, it's practically your own double-damage rune.

 

Lol I finally got invited to the beta. Can't wait to noob it up.

 

Have you ever played a Dota styled game before?

 

I tried out LoL for a little bit, not long enough to understand everything.

 

:| League of Legends isn't really anything like Dota 2...

 

? How different can it be? I'm sure there's differences, but it's clearly at least somewhat similar.

Is it a problem that I haven't played?

 

It's generally kind of taboo to compare LoL to DotA, it's more the vice versa.

But, if you've only played LoL, you should have the basic understanding of what to do. Select a hero, hero has a particular set of skills and a role. You buy items at the start, choose a lane, kill creep, deny creep, fight enemy heroes. There are some mechanics that are different, but you should be able to pick them up. As with anything, if you're unsure, start off playing against bots, get used to a few heroes, and then ease your way into pubgames.

 

The mechanics available in LoL are pretty much almost the same except DotA has far more features which requires higher skillcap ._. But the basic ones of last hitting, pushing towers are similar. Only thing LoL has extra are runes/masteries but DotA has creep/tower/hero denying tree juking, high/low ground misses, jungle creep stacking, Cliffs, side shops and secret shops, stash and courier ._.

Basically, a LoL player will already know the importance of last hitting and farming. Other extra things that are basic one needs to know for DotA are creep/tower denying, using the courier, using the stash, side/secret shop. The rest are pretty much almost advanced.

Oh wards in LoL are cheaper and lasts only 3 minutes and are infinite. DotA's wards lasts 6 minutes, sight wards doesn't give as much vision as vision wards, costs more but comes in packs of 2s and are limited for the vision ward but restocks overtime. Basically, one needs to know the importance of ward placements and counter warding more in DotA than LoL

 

Sure, it's a "Dota" styled game, but it's much simpler as Baka pointed out. There is no deny system in LoL, which in Dota is essential during the laning phase as denys decreases XP significantly and enemies get no gold. The shop is laid out VERY differently, LoL categorizes them by type...while Dota is quite random. Wards, dust and support items play a huge role in Dota. LoL also has that bonus skill for each hero, something Dota 2 does not have. Sure the "gameplay" is similar, but there are so many little things that make it a whole different style of play.

If you throw a LoL player into Dota 2, they'll usually be okay, but IMO if you took someone who hadn't played a Dota styled game in years (me) and threw me into Dota, IMO it'll take a newbie and a LoL player equal amounts of time to get down the finer points of Dota 2, though big thing is LoL players will know the importance of Last Hits. Of course me just 5 months of having Dota 2, I'd categorize myself as an upper middle player in Dota 2.

 

Actually, the items in DotA are categorized. I know the basic items are broken down into consumables, attributes (+stats stuff), armaments (+dmg +armor stuff), and then arcane (+atk/movement spd +evasion +lifesteal +sight +regen +spell resistance stuff). Then the upgrades are broken down into your common upgrade items, support items, caster items, weapons and armor, and then the artifacts.

I gotta agree that support items are practically CRUCIAL in the game. Most times, having support items or not having support items can really change the outcome of the game.

 

I understand stuff like denying and last hitting, I get the basics, I just don't know the ins and outs of the heroes and abilities and what counters what and when to use what. It's all a bit overwhelming, but it intrigues me.

 

Hit up dotafire.com or dota2wiki.com. They have a lot of good information on all heroes. Dotafire has a bunch of builds that players create and upload into the website. That's how I learned most heroes. Also, if you're a more visual learner, on youtube, subscribe to Purge, DotaCinema, and GamingHoldDota2. Purge and GamingHoldDota2 are casters who usually do commentary on game replays or they'll upload videos of them playing with their own in-game commentary. DotaCinema makes a lot of really good videos for heroes, like introducing you to the hero and their abilities as well as videos that are like guides on how to play them. They also make other DotA2 related videos.

 

Ah the heroes...are kinda similar for the most part, just different names. That will come quick, I think LoL combined some heroes together to avoid being sued by Blizzard, but if you came from Dota 1, it is same exact heroes, sometimes they call a hero by 1st name rather than the hero name, like Furion, aka Nature's Prophet.

 

I can't let this thread go into the thread abyss....

So for bumping sake, one of the new heroes to be released either today or next week or very soon is Meepo the Geomancer.

Definitely gonna make the game a lot more interesting..especially when going against players who know how to play Meepo well and have tons of micro.

 

But then there's the people who don't know how to play him and will feed like mad

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Haha true! Can't forget about those ones, but I'm particularly more concerned about going against people who know how to play Meepo and have great micro skills. It's not going to be fun getting netted 4 times or 5 times (meepo with aghanims).

 

They go WELL illusions won't result in the death of my hero....NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.

The netting isn't even the real issue with Meepo, he can blink to other illusions. People who can micro with Chen, Enchantress and Brewmaster shouldn't have an issue with Geomancer.

 

Haha. It's still pretty terrifying to think about it.

Oh well, guess I'll see how it goes while in game. Speaking of which...I need to get some DotA in. Been busy playing the Black Mesa mod.

 

Meepo isn't hard ._.

Just like how people say Visage is hard

 

That's like saying any agility hero isn't hard to play. They really aren't, but without farm and knowing the heroes limits, any hero is "hard". City plays so many agility heroes so well because he knows the limits and then some. :|

 

For me, when I speak about a hero being "hard" to play, I'm just refering to the amount of micro involved to play the hero effectively. A lot of the heroes actually aren't hard to play at all, it's just the ones that have multiple abilities (Invoker) or the ones that can have minions (Enchantress, Chen) or the ones that can split up into practically multiple toons (Brewmaster, Meepo) that can give the most trouble.

Anyways, played a few games with Hime last night. Easy 20 min game as Windrunner and Hime as Treant. Gotta love when we're laning against someone who only buys one item and no regen to save up for other items later on. Also played Shadowfiend last night.........totally butchered it. Haha. I thought his raze was a target point ablity and never thought for a second you press the button and it just fires in the direction he's facing. If you watch the replay, there's plenty of times I completely shadowrazed an area......with no one in there. haha. Plenty of times I butchered his ult too.....didn't know there was a 2 second channel before he releases. I also haven't played mid in FOREVER. So it was a bit weird playing mid. He actually isn't too bad to play....might play him some more and try to learn how he works.

 

Shadowfiend is one of those high risk high reward heroes with quite a steep learning curve ._. Arnski needs to learn to last hit really well, position self decently for the raze, know the range of each Raze and where the AoE overlaps for maximum damage and change item builds on the go instead of following a guide blindly til the end. Must also do a lot of predicting with Shadowfiend :x

 

hahaha yeah. I probably won't play him again soon...but he's in my scopes. I'd like to get good with him.

I was just thinking, since his ult has a channel before the actual attack, is it treated just like Sand King's before you blink in? You just hide somewhere, start the ult, and then blink in right before he releases?

 

No. Shadow Fiend's ult will explode where he was initially so channeling and blinking in will not work as it'll just release at the initial point before the blink. Sand King can do it as the ult is doing damage over multiple pulses overtime. Shadowfiend's a one time release

Channeling it however does not break invisibility and being stunned while channeling it will reset the cooldown and not make it go into cooldown. One method would be Shadow Blade, get in position and ult. They won't see Arnski channel it but once it releases, the invisibility breaks ._.

Another common way is to blink in with BKB and start channeling in the midst of the chaos. Safest way but needs lots of gold purchasing BKB and Blink dagger. It does mean Arnski has completed 2 core items for the hero though

A harder way is to bait people up to a high ground or near some trees. The moment they lose sight but are still chasing, start channeling. When they reach uphill or reach near the trees, they'll be in for a big surprise

 

Not with shadow fiend. It's a good ability to combo with an aoe stun, like black hole or any burrow strike like skill. A great item that I feel is core on him is force staff. Gives you a good extension to get one last raze off, also a good escape. Not too mention the boosted mana helps a bit.

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Ahhh right on. Thanks for that Baka and Tree.

 

You can also use Force Staff with TP scroll, start channeling and push yourself into trees where they lose vision and you should be okay.

Shadow Fiend should honestly be the last person in, even with Heart of Tarrasque he is easily mowed down by burst damage, and as with any agility carry is still extremely fragile with extreme farm. Now after initiation from let's say Black Hole or Epicenter, then you can blink in and initiate his ultimate. He has the potential to crit 700+ with insane attack speed like many other agility carries, but like I said you don't want to bear the brunt of the damage as Shadow Fiend even with Manta Style.

 

Yep. Totally witnessing the terror that Meepo is capable of. I'm watching the youtube dota caster GamingHoldDota2 (aka alan) and he's been itching to play Meepo for the longest. He's doing a livestream right now and my god.....he's level 25 before the 30min mark. Crazy. His ending items were Blink, Mek, Treads, AC, Scepter, and open slot of TP. He would blink in, POOF all of his meepos, nets all around, and just own. It was too much for the other team to handle. His farming was crazy good too.

Testing Youtube Livestream - YouTube

 

I love returning to a hero I haven't played in a while and just owning. it's lots of fun. the other day as Windrunner, I landed a triple kill from a powershot. good stuff there.

 

Yeah Windrunner is pretty fun. Funnily I think I'm terrible with her, but I'm 2 wins and 0 losses with her. It's just getting that Shackle down and pushing lanes.

 

Yeah. Dota is funny in telling me that my three worst heroes are my 5-1 wr, my 12-7 vs, and my 7-2 slardar.

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Baka's most successful heroes are apparently Windrunner, Lich and Vengeful Spirit ._.

Maybe Baka is just destined to support for eternity

 

My top 3 are Chaos Knight, Bloodseeker and Lich, apparently I am destined for hard carry, but everytime I go carry my team is awful. :|

Though Tree_Burner can see me play carry Venomancer. And Baka can comment on my weird Carry builds.

 

Baka tends not to approve most of Hime's item builds

 

I'm with Baka on the item builds actually. You have some strange ones hime.

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Baka makes weird item builds too but Baka makes sure they're efficient or at least synergize properly with the skills ._. Hime's sometimes doesn't really work that well with the skillsets of the heroes

 

Gonna have to +1 on that and join in with Baka and Tree. Haha. Hey, but most times, your builds have worked!

Anyways, gotta love those games where you're incredibly losing at the start, the other team starts talking mad sh*t and then you just come back for the win. Played as Rhasta last night (not my best Rhasta game however) and our team consisted of Slardar/Axe/Ursa/Storm Spirit and the Dire team was KotL/Omni/Meepo/Lycan/(I forget their 5th). Early game, we weren't doing so bad, but by mid game we lost all our towers and then our mid rax. Then they started the trash talking and what not. Here, you'd think the dire would just push to end, and they did, but somehow we kept winning all our teamfights. Then I was able to backdoor their top towers and later in the game, we were able to backdoor their bottom tower and rax while they tried to push. We were able to catch a couple of them and pick them off a little at a time and that ultimately led to our win. Good game.

Reason I say it wasn't my best Rhasta game was because I wanted to try and use my wards to trap heroes instead of uusually using them on towers. That's where we were initially gonna lose. Once I start using them on towers is when we start seeing that small sliver of light to victory.

 

._. Why all you hate on my builds?!

For my carry heroes, I always go for Battle Fury into whatever items work well, usually Manta Style, etc. The reason why for alot of Carry heroes I get Arcane Boots now is because of flash farming skills, like Slardar's Slithereen Crush, Brewmaster's Thunderclap, Morphling's Waveform, etc can take out entire creep waves and require usually 100-150 mana which Arcane greatly helps out. Also by that level, if I get farmed up enough, the extra benefits from Powertreads isn't realized when you get Armlet, Battlefury, Manta Style, S&Y, etc.

For my support heroes, I normally go Urn of Shadows first, gets you bonus strength and mana regeneration which is a must for non-Strength support heroes (Crystal Maiden, Vengeful Spirit, Dazzle, Necro). I also get Arcane boots to sustain flash farmers as well as sustaining pushes. Then I get Mekasm.

 

No new heroes today, I really want some of the missing heroes...

 

Baka misses Techies

 

When all the commentators for the International went to Valve HQ, it was rumored that Techies were gonna come last, no surprise...pub stomp.

 

Random thought while reading through the heroes in the learn tab. Warlock's fatal bonds send 20% damage to each unit it's combined to, so, if you were to bond all 5 of the enemies heroes (3 or 4 for a lesser effect), and nail them with an AOE damage like Earthshakers ulti, or ravage, or even thundergods wrath, (lots of heroes of course have AOE damaging, Sand king is another great one), you can do 180% of the damage of the ability. sand kings ulti will now do almost 200 damage per pulse if you hit all the heroes, zues ulti will do 1000 damage to each hero if he has agh's.

The point is is that this hero can put out massive team damage if done right. pretty sweet stuff.

 

Is the 20% before or after magical/physical resistance or does it bypass it?

 

Pretty sure it's before. So there will still be resistance, but you can really add to your aoe damage output with it.

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Baka believes that most people also underestimate Warlock's mass AoE slow ability. Sure it's channeled but once Warlock does Fatal Bonds, That other skill and Warlock's ult, Warlock doesn't need to do much else. Just channel the AoE slow til it reaches the 81% slow. Makes a huge difference :3 Leave hero channeling, control Necronomicon minions and Infernals