*Official* nVidia GTX 10xx Series notebook discussion thread

There is nothing decent about spending 3900 plus dollars on these cards when volta will be released extremely soon

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

 

It's not "cute" to spend that much money on a hobby

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

 

So is that supposed to be in response to someone or...? Also stop with the Volta crap. That's like a year away +- a few months, and there's a good chance its gonna be great, but there's a very very low chance its going to be a bigger improvement for mobile cards than Pascal was. It was nearly a 100% increase in power... The largest in history. You'll just wait forever if your already waiting for Volta. The 980m was a flagship for 2 years, while I doubt we'll repeat that, the 1080 will be the flagship for many more months. Why would Nvidia ever release Volta unless AMD finally comes back swinging. It appears the 1060 1070 and 1080 will all be unanswered. Even the 1050 will possibly be better than that RX 470 or whatever they are launching.

Edit: your own sig shows you spending way more money than that on laptops, what's your deal?

Double Edit: Like I ordered a Pascal laptop on release, and its not even here yet, and your already saying wait for Volta, give me a break...

 

He appears to be doing what we all do at one time or another, trying to convince ourselves to not do something by chastising others for doing it

"Please stop me from spending $3900 on a new laptop", "I know it's cute, but it's not", but man it's soooo nice.

We're here for you man, @Splintah - don't do it man, step back from the ledge, take a deeeep breath, and look away...

 

Really...

Then when do we buy?

Let's just enjoy what we have, what we're able to get and what we want to the max!

The rest doesn't matter at all really!

Why would we stress over such small things? Phones are similar, tech in general is. I prefer to have something ready fast so that I'm never locked with just an X amount of performance!

If Volta is 3xPascal, then I'll upgrade then. In the meanwhile, I seriously think that those buying those laptops should know what they're getting, what they're paying for, and why.

I've got friends who can't push an 1000$ laptop to it's limits... at all... They still buy those, then are sad for not getting Apple

In this time, an 860m + 4710hq is not nearly enough for my needs, but then again, I make games, and software... and music... and a lot of other things... Now then, do I also write dcuments on the same computer? of course. But I also push the same computer to the limits of human existence.

Graphics manipulation seems soft and easy until you're met with 10k pixels x 10K pixels works and even an 860m starts to struggle

 

If you have the money to blow good on you

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

 

A part of me can't help but think it wise to avoid gaming notebooks from here on out: desktops are more upgradeable, provide a better performance : dollar ratio, handle more demanding tasks, and have a longer useful lifespan than their notebook counterparts. Today, the only true benefit of a gaming laptop is portability. Ironically, even that is hardly worth the extra cost because the largest and least portable notebooks (with dual-PSU's, etc.) are the only notebooks worthy of comparison to desktops, as they offer identical performance.

I've been telling my colleagues to no longer stretch their budget when it comes to gaming laptops because their systems will likely be obsolete within 18 months. Back in 2010, people were spending $4k~ on notebooks that could be upgraded for 3+ years. Now you spend $4k on a notebook and it reaches EOL 12 months later. Sure, it can still play games at acceptable frame rates, but that's not the point. And this leaves me unsure of my next move. The next few months will be a defining time for me.

 

The only reason I can see for buying a desktop replacement laptop is, like you said, the ability to move it, even if it's only occasional. Aside from that desktops offer far more value. And you can upgrade every piece whenever you want. If I was just going to leave my laptop on a desk and never move it, I'd never get one. My reasoning is I'm headed off to college so can't lug the desktop there lol. Also far cheaper to build a desktop yourself.

Edit: I also only spent about $1700 on mine because it only needs to get me through a few years until I'm back to a desktop.

Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk

 

We don't have a P670 dedicated thread?

 

There's an unofficial owners thread if that's what you mean.

Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk

 

@Splintah
You're giving stange advice there.
If you need a laptop now it makes no sense waiting for Volta. There's always going to be something newer and possibly better on the horizon.

 

Just purchase what you can afford. Don't be wasteful for bragging rights. Nobody cares.

 

I can probably get behind that.

One of the more sane opinions I seen lately.

 

Exactly why I went desktop a couple years ago. Love my desktop. Only have this laptop out of necessity for the job and the lifestyle that goes with it. If I worked a reg 9-5 office job I would probably never buy a laptop again.

 

Will the new 1080M fit in my existing 980M socket?.

 

There's no 1080m, just a 1080, and bad news. It won't fit.

 

http://wccftech.com/geforce-pascal-mobility-1080m-1070m-1060m-launching-gamescom/

Isn't this it?

 

They're not called M anymore, and none of them except for the MSI 1060 are in a standard MXM form factor.

 

I would agree that it is easier to simply get a desktop, but in my country a 1080 costs 900+ USD, a 1070 costs 600+ USD, a 6700K costs 425+ USD, and don't even get me started on SSDs, Motherboards, etc. It is just crazy to me. It is cheaper to get a DTR from America rather than build my own desktop, if you can believe it.

And the laptop prices are borderline extortionate. A GT72VR costs the equivalent of 3200+ USD. And, just for kicks, a GT83VR with 1080 SLI costs 6300+ USD.

tl;dr - I'm screwed either way

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

 

In that case wouldn't it be cheaper to get a pre built desktop? Even prebuilt it should be cheaper.

Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk

 

Pre-built from where? In my country, we have virtually no boutique system builders. Importing from the USA means paying a vast amount in tax. I know that Origin PC has a website for my country, but if I want a 1080, 6700k level desktop, the minimum I end up paying if I get an SSD is the equivalent of USD 3500+. It is cheaper to get a semi-luggable DTR it whenever I go to the USA next, though God knows when that will be.

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

 

you might as well take a vacation in the states and bring a laptop back

 

Exactly. Will do so when finances allow, probably.

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

 

*sigh* where do I begin...

What about the P870DM? P65xRx and P67xRx models have MUX switches, and P7xxDM models are dGPU-only. Even the N155RF1 and N170RF1 have MUX switches. Pretty much most of their lines have them. It's a larger number of things than you make it out to be.

No, never. One could disable the dGPU I suppose in windows, certainly, but that would just relegate it to the iGPU only for the most part. It's a hardware routing issue. The MUX switch is there to switch the routing from the iGPU to the dGPU. That's why they are required.

It's a physical switch... it cannot be disabled. You would literally get no visuals to the internal screen if you had turned it off. Note that even a "disabled" or "driverless" iGPU still has to push video to the screen, via basic windows drivers. It's how you even get video before installing a driver when you install windows freshly. I know not what happened with your GT60, but it wasn't turning off Optimus.

Since the 1060 is replacing the 970M, you're never getting it for $1000, just like you didn't get a 970M for $1000. And the 1060 has slightly less TDP draw than the 970M before it; probably closer to 80W is it? I think that's it.

How is the build quality bad? My sisters both have N155RF laptops and the N155RD is simply that same model with a 960M instead of 965M. I haven't noted any glaring issues in their design (though they haven't stopped being lazy enough to let me open it up and teach them how to clean it yet). It seems to cool sufficiently well too.

Must agree. The *ONLY* time I tell someone to wait is if they clear all these conditions:
- Must not need laptop ASAP
- Must be UNDER 1 month away from new hardware; at least near-confirmed (when people are basically painting it on the wall, kicking away the bucket, walking away whistling, etc).
- Must be willing to deal with new hardware (early hardware driver pains, testing machines to see if they handle it well) and change desired machine based upon how things end up.

1070 is replacing the 980M, not the 1080. And no it won't fit.

Edit:
I opened about 12 pages without needing to refresh the page at all... is the forum fixed? Is this just the god of luck shining down upon me? Should I go play the lottery?

 

If BGA filth didn't exist then you would not have to put up with it. The only way we are going to cure this disease is by killing it. ODMs and OEMs will take a mile if you offer an inch. Otherwise, count on more garbage. RAM and storage will be next. That will be OK with Kool-Aid drinkers and we will see lame excuses like "a tiny fraction of users upgrade RAM and storage." Look no further than the crippled garbage sold by Apple and you will see the fate of gaming trashbooks with an army of yes men making excuses for lameness.

People need to pull their heads out. Funny how traitors think it's OK to be critical of what they personally despise, like Optimus filth, but if someone speaks out against what they are willing to put up with a moderator needs to be summoned to muzzle and censor. Isn't that special?

 

Aaaaand you turned me to BGA loathing again

Every single time I remember what happened when I bought the laptop of my dreams, only to discover after what Optimus is and what I have to put up with, even though not a single reviewer said a word about it, I just can't hold it within the strong dislike towards BGA and Optimus.

The problem with BGA GPUs is that we don't even know how the data is routed, even with a MUX switch. I can't buy an P670 because of this. I don't want to force anything on me, but I really need my video bandwidth to stop passing through iGPU and I need pure video output stream.

 

If I want upgradeability I'll buy a desktop. Oh hey look, they put desktop gpu's in a laptop! Imagine that...

trolllllllllllllllllll

 

On another note, here's a new review haven't seen posted yet on Predator 17
http://www.ultrabookreview.com/12357-acer-predator-17-review-g9-793/

 

I know this might be hard. But someone having a different opinion doesn't make someone a troll. Save the childish name calling and just make your point.

On that note. If I'm spending $2500+ on a laptop, you bet I'm going to seek upgradability / modularity. I don't see any good reason such a privilege should be left exclusively to desktops.

 

Not sure what you mean in that first part. I mean even all Clevo sales are an extremely low fraction of PC sales. Are you talking about Optimus still? The only thing that's working to kill Optimus right now is GSync, which I'm all for.

Yeah the igpu wasn't gone. What I'm saying is that Optimus was no longer autoswitching for launching games etc. I could use the igpu manually, but otherwise the discrete was the new default and no changing would occur without me doing it. I also don't entirely get what your saying about the video before installing drivers thing. My desktop 5820k doesn't even have an igpu, my only option is my dgpus.

Also sorry, the build quality is not great. I've used an N155RF (and I personally like the thing), but as far as build quality goes its pretty objectively low being made of plastic with a solid amount of flex. They are great laptops if you take care of them, and I wasn't trying to imply anything temp wise by saying build quality. Even Dave Lee omitted the N series machines from his under $1000 gaming laptop review my explicitly stating that their build quality was worse compared to every other option with a 960m in that price range. A Dell Inspiron or Yoga Y are just built better.

Jump to 1:40:

 

Even having modularity over the GPU and storage options is golden for me, and the ability to replace a broken GPU or CPU or heatsinks, since an Acer laptop cannot be opened at all, so you're stuck with what you buy when getting one...

I sure would love for them laptops from Clevo to be upgradable to the next generation GPUs and CPUs and from what I can understand, they are so far

 

Gtx 1070 with 3gb a vram? Is that a thing?

 

I'd avoid it! Games do benefit from the utilization of more than 3GB's now.

EDIT: Turns out to be a typo.

 

Unsoldered RAM is far more common than non BGA laptops, and would be a much bigger deal if gaming laptops went away with that. Apple doing it didn't make much of a stir because the power user doesn't make up a large section of their customer base.

The hard part about arguing against BGA is that your sacrificing form factor for this, and as laptops like the Razer Blade become more popular, people don't want enormous freakin machines anymore when you don't actually need it. For example, a P770DM can take a 1070, but so can a P670. This means for real life gaming performance will be similar (yes ik the cpus are different), but the P670RS is much easier to carry as it is lighter and thinner. So companies are moving away from it to cut costs that are only affecting a small portion of laptop users.

RAM is something that doesn't really add any significant thickness to the machine to leave in slots. It also affects a very very large percentage of laptops (most non ultrabooks) and would leave a lot more people angry then the ability to pull out a 980m and pay half the cost of a new machine to upgrade it to a 1070.

 

But the 1070 have a 256bit bus, how can they use an uneven ram capacity?
I guess they meant to talk abut the 1060...

 

No that's a typo, probably they assumed the VRAM from their previous review of the 970m. Screenshot in their own review shows proper VRAM: http://www.ultrabookreview.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/hwinfo.png

 

I adamantly disagree. Filth is filth no matter how you slice it. Anything that is a core component being soldered whether that be CPU, GPU, RAM, drives... all of it is completely, absolutely, 100% unacceptable garbage. People that support this utter nonsense are opening the door to a totally hellish future and they cannot seriously consider themselves to be "hardcore" at anything except mediocrity. The childish pursuit of super thin and light is one form of idiocy that started this mess. You cannot have it both ways. Either you demand something awesome, or you're a compromiser that shares responsibility for the bastardization of high performance notebooks. There is no wiggle room here, and if you allow wiggle room, expect things to continue to worsen. Form factor cannot be more important that performance or specs, or you end up with garbage every time. People that have contributed to this nonsense are the enemies of those that will not allow for it. They value things that make all of the arguments of laptop-hating trolls in forums like overclock.net completely valid. They are also responsibility for the idiocy like NVIDIA clock-blocking notebooks and making moronic statements like notebooks are not suitable for overclocking.

 

I'm not even against non-BGA machines, but the way you guys try to do it is irritating. A random user just literally said he's tired of reading your guy's stuff. @hmscott has never had something like that happen when he talks against Optimus. You know why? He doesn't sound like a whiny little kid. He speaks in a mature sentence structure in an informative matter while you guys sound like brats. "I HATE BGA" is one of your guys' freakin forum ranks. Your own is "." You say hateful speech constantly. "Filth is filth", ""hellish future", "unacceptable garbage", "The childish pursuit of super thin and light" (lmao on this one your out of your mind). You sound like Donald Trump. All those quotes are from the same post I'm responding to, you've said much worse. Try arguing like an adult and people won't get so tired of your "righteous crusade".

You sound like the Bill O'Reilly of the forum inspiring fear into readers, instead of informing them with real information.

 

Totally with you, brother!

I don't want the trend to continue!

We have 3000$ ULV CPU laptops coming in market because of all the people who support this happening.

We have 4000$ DTR laptops considered good for gaming, but they are BGA and if a single thing breaks, the entire laptop must be replaced. Even if not caring about upgradability, those laptops will die first month out of warranty... Let's stop with the insanity, people cannot continue like this.

80% of laptop buyers think that apple MAC thingys would had been their best option, they don't even know that those are passive cooled and for their price, they are equal to a max 400$ laptop... What is becoming of this society? I mean, okay some people really want to pay the premium for a sleek and elegant thingy that is powerless. That's good.

But we need a stable Gaming section with true DTRs for professionals. Xeon BGA is a thing, and I have my own feelings that it's weaker than 6700k we get...

 

But a BGA and you're going to have it broken and dead when the warranty is over because you can't repair it
You can't really OC it
You can't upgrade it
You can't add RAM, SSD or HDD to most BGA laptops because they have the policy that opening the case voids the warranty (almost all models available in Romania)
BGA means that those balls can melt, this means entire motherboard is dead, both CPU, GPU, everything.
BGA usually means Optimus, and when it doesn't it's strange how it works (I have a hard time understanding how a MUX can re-route the video stream without passing it through the iGPU either way)
Optimus will kill all professional applications
Those things are never said when you buy a laptop, I did not know about this and read every single review on my laptop.
They don't tell you that BGA means 50% value loss in a few months.
BGA means lower power since all BGA is made so that it's thinner and sleeker.
BGA means they have the BIOS and vBIOS simpler than... You can't do anything. A single thing. In none of them machines with their default BIOSes. (Thank god for our BIOS modders who helps us with this)

Those are actually real reasons to avoid it...

 

So then you must support modular phones as well, like project Ara. How far does this go? Must everything be modular, upgradeable? There has to be somewhere we draw the line. You can't make an affordable product without some compromise at some point. Plastic is the perfect example. We used to make everything out of heavy metals, toothbrushes, razor handles, combs, everything. Then they discovered plastic, now everyone can afford to brush their teeth. The compromise is an inferior product (have to replace every few months).

I'm just struggling with the extremism here. And I said troll because I'm absolutely certain that my opinion will just set Mr Fox et al going on another rant, but yet can't help but voice my own. I was hoping to lighten the mood.

BGA is not nonsense. BGA saves money. I can't afford $5000 machines and incremental upgrades. I am sure many other gamers are like I am, they want a laptop they can bring to a friend's house and don't care if it is outpaced by desktop computers. Another benefit to BGA, Quality Control. You don't have to have 50 different QC processes when every single BGA implementation for your product line is the same. Not saying these products end up with higher quality, just that it is easier to control. Of course, most companies don't do proper QC since the whole point is to cut cost. But the opportunity is there.

 

You can OC (see Prema bios P650 models). You can add ram storage and hdds, those stickers aren't even legal, and many gaming and business laptops don't have it. "Optimus will kill all professional applications"... Not sure what you mean here, I've had both Optimus and non Optimus machines, they never compromised anything like that. That value loss thing also doesn't make sense. "BGA means lower power" except it doesn't (GT62 vs P650 power consumption is similar). You are right about the bios and vBios thoug. Hail Prema.

 

And a big laptop as the newer Aw 17 models have... Yees!!! 2 ram slots!! 2!! Why? Because of the size or the design?

 

I've actually had to deal with really bad customer service because I did not know what Optimus was. (Coming from AMD GPUs)

My pro apps did not work with Optimus, and it did not stay turned on.

When I said that you can't OC or do anything, I mean ex-factory. They don't want us to. We just have great people helping us get our power unlocked.

I can't replace anything on my Acer, otherwise they say my warranty is voided and they refuse to replace the broken parts

If I want an SSD or HDD change or upgrade, I have to deal with their really bad customer service in Romania and have them replace it for me.. in 1-2 weeks and for a freaking tax of over 100$ over the cost of the components.. Welcome to the land of BGA and Optimus .

 

I touched upon why I miss upgradeable systems here. But a lot of what isn't being said is also why I dislike "BGA" systems. One example, which is quite prevelant, particularly in Dell and Alienware, is that once a company moves from dominating a niche market without compromise to a business structure based entirely on compromise and reduction of production costs, it trickles down to every department within said company. Alienware not only lost its place in the race but intentionally lowered its standard of care and support to save money. Back in 2010 when you purchased an Alienware system, extending the warranty for an additional 4-years (for roughly $500) meant you had premium support - a one-on-one connection with an individual whom displayed qualities of an enthusiast. Today, Alienware outsources everything and sends your "premium" Alienware system to the same repair depot that Inspirons and XPS systems are repaired at. My point is, BGA is only the beginning. And if we continue to turn a blind eye, things will inevitably become worse.

But I'm also tired of reading, debating, and speaking of BGA. It's not going away. Hate to say it, but we are the minority and are being ignored.

 

It doesn't matter that you are not against non-BGA machines. It only matters that you are willing will accept mediocrity instead of demanding excellence.

Colorful speech is what gets attention and makes people think. I'm glad that it is irritating. Because it strikes a nerve it will be effective with a greater number of free-thinkers that haven't stopped long enough to assess the situation and vote with their wallet. Those that choose to be offended by opposition are collateral damage.

I 100% do not care who likes or dislikes it what I have to say or how they view my opinions. This truly is a war for the hearts and minds of enthusiasts and if people don't wake up and pull their heads out very soon we are going to have a permanently ruined and irrecoverable situation brought on all of us... the willing and the unwilling. Compromise sucks and it always brings mediocrity to us all. Look no further than the overwhelming lack of acceptable non-BGA options and it speaks for itself. We have that sorry predicament due to the prevalence of compromisers that are willing to pay for trashbooks and fund the delinquency of the ODMs and OEMs peddling garbage. Their success is built upon the embrace of compromise and mediocrity.

I appreciate the compliments likening me to Trump and O'Reilly, but metaphoric flattery will get you nowhere. I know the Facebook socialist sheeple don't like them, but again... do not care. I think they're awesome and so do multiple millions of people that still possess the ability to use the brain that God gave them. I don't expect mindless sheeple to appreciate an opposing view on anything. They have their heads so far up their colon that oxygen deprivation has hindered their ability to think independently about anything... they simply drink the Kool-Aid because that's what has been offered to them.

 

... I don't even know what to say. Colorful speech grabs attention, but makes your arguments seem empty under true analysis. But your state of mind is clearly not open to change at all so I'm done trying.

Maybe try preaching your message in different places, the same 50 or so users are constantly seeing your stuff, but your constantly posting in threads that are mostly viewed by the most well informed and intelligent users on the forum. Your message isn't doing anything there, its the people asking for notebook advice who don't know these things, and yet I almost never see you post there.

"Compromise sucks and it always brings mediocrity to us all" - says a U.S. citizen

 

Nope. BGA is perfectly acceptable for disposable craptronics. I have no problem with that and never have. BGA isn't new. The only thing that is new about it is the abuse and lack of alternatives. I don't care about cost. I want what I want and I am willing to pay for it. If they don't offer what I want, I will pay nothing. This vitriol is all about the severe lack of options for those able and willing to pay for superior products, as well as the ludicrous baloney marketing designed to deceive the masses into believing turdbooks are the way to go. That is a distraction from the lack of acceptable options.

You are totally missing many points, and so are many others. You say you cannot afford a $5000 machine, but seem oblivious to the superior options available for half that cost. To say you cannot afford incremental upgrades is also ludicrous. If you can only afford to buy one turdbook every 3 to 5 years it might be valid. GPU upgrades are a fraction of the cost of a new system and allow two to three year old notebooks to perform as well or better than brand new turdbooks.

The masses moving to BGA is driven by greed and designed to force new product sales and block upgrades. The OEMs that are going along with the program are giving gamer-boys the middle finger.

 

Why don't you just have a fat thread stickered to the top of the forums named BGA filth then.
Hey look another 4 pages of BGA BGA.

 

Correct... my mind is not open to it in this case. I'd rather burn my calories effecting change rather than accepting change compromise. I only accept change when it serves my own interests and delivers something superior to what I had prior to change. Since neither of those are true statements, I reject change in this case. It's simply unacceptable and I would become part of the problem by accepting it. I'd rather be part of the solution. Your analysis is not relevant, so it's probably going to be less frustrating if you are done trying. Since I am a U.S. citizen, the opinion of other U.S. citizens are the only ones that actually matter to me. The exception, of course, is when the non-U.S. citizens agree... in that case the non-U.S. citizens that stand in agreement are an ally and a trustworthy confidant. Our enemies are only the Kool Aid drinking Facebook zombies.

Sounds like a good idea.