Pascal: What do we know? Discussion, Latest News & Updates: 1000M Series GPU's

That's good, I can see this GPU being chosen for the laptop 1080M very easily. It's only 150W in a desktop, so perhaps with some binning of chips, and a slight clock reduction they could bring this down to say 100-110W (maybe even less), and we'd end up with a slightly underclocked GTX 1070 which we could then overclock to GTX 1070 desktop & above speeds. I can see that happening! So, that would make it like having a 980ti performance in a laptop I think.

 

Can almost guarantee you the 1080M will be right with the 1070 in regards to performance, similar to how the 980M is near 970 levels.

Very happy to see this. That's a nice boost for mobile anyway you put it. Next year should be interesting, though.

 

Because names do not represent tiers. Tiers are represented by price. And right now 1080 is more expensive than a 980ti (due to the founder's scam). It is also more expensive than the GPU that is replacing. And on launch, it is significantly more costly than launch 980. So I don't think comparing it with a 980 and saying it's acceptable performance because it is replacing it... is any more valid than directly comparing to the actual GPU it is replacing (the fastest GPU).

It's just as silly comparing it to a 960 than it is to a titan x. While the market settles, the 1080 will be fighting vs the 980ti as it disappears from the market. A TI monkier does not mean anything on its own.

It better be. I won't be happy with anything less. But knowing nvidia, they are capable of releasing a futher gimped GPU and call it a 1080m, because they can, and then release the stronger version later. Ugh. I really hope we get a 1080m with very close performance to a 1070.

 

I mean... Yeah... Let's settle for 1070 on mobile... That is 10-15% faster than GTX980 in laptops at the moment, no?

I would really want a full 1080 in laptops asap, so that I will not have to build a computer to carry

 

Whilst you guys are happy for 980ti performances in the 1080m.
I'm totally exited about 1070m. If it achieves 980 levels I can be happy with that. But I'll be overly happy if it reaches 980m sli which would leave a fire strike score difference of 4000 scoring 13000m which "SHOULD" be in margin with performance apart from the 1080m scoring 17000 which would be 76% performance of a 1080m from a hypothetical point. Which stacks up. At least to me anyway. But even if it scored just 11000 fire strike in happy from the 6500 the 970m got. However if the performance gap was that massive. The maybe my 1st Alienware 15 (and Alienware product) can impress me enough to have one with 1080m. (I say Alienware 15 because they are the only notebooks in the 15" range that has not numpad on the keyboard. I'm just too used to the enter button on the end of the keyboard like all sub 14" keyboards.)

 

Let me spoil this for ya:

Spoiler

1080m gonna be gimped 1070 by cores+clocks or by clocks only at best.
1080 for mobile comes at the end of 2016 - 1st Q 2017 stuffed with marketing as always.

 

They have to be able to milk two sets of chips since Volta was pushed back so I doubt it's going to be a full 1070 right away unless they want to just rebrand with no core increase 2H 2017. 1080 runs very hot regardless of their fancy presentation showing otherwise. If nVidia is dumb enough to shove the current 1080 silicon in a laptop we will have another 480M or 880M situation.

 

But do they care? They'll just sell it as a $1300 USD overheating piece of crap and claim nothing is wrong because it can manage stock clocks without boost at 93c constant or something.

 

Yeah, unfortunately I see them holding back, to stretch chips out over time. In my view GTX 1080M will be a very situation similar to the GTX 980M, meaning a chopped 1070.

And do remember, we never even got the full GTX 970 in mobile form, as so many of us expected as a no brainer 2016 release. Who knows what Nvidia will do as far as refreshes go, in 2017. It'll be very disappointing, if we go straight from a cut down 1080M to a full on custom MXM GTX 1080.

Fortunately for me, I have enough of a GPU to easily hold out for the 2017 cards, should they even come.

 

Should see them by end of this year. Will very likely be a cut down 1070, but still close to 980 Ti performance in a 120W TDP.

 

I didn't say that they cared, I was just pointing out the huge downside to stuffing current 1080 silicon in a laptop. Nvidia obviously rushed Pascal to market, we need a B1 revision chip so they can fix the heat (if they can - Samsung couldn't do it with the Exynos) otherwise it's going to need liquid cooling or vapor chambers and a monster fan which would mean a machine approaching P570WM size.

 

Ah, that sounds disappointing, so it will only be slightly faster than 1080M?

 

A 980ti is significantly faster than a 980m if that's what you are asking

Sent from my Nexus 6P using Tapatalk

 

No, what would be disappointing is if the GTX 1080 (Notebook) turns out to be only slightly faster than 1080M.

In comparison, the GTX 980 (Notebook) is based on the GTX 980, not a cut down GTX 970, and is much faster than the 980M (if I understand correctly).

 

Guys, moviemarketing wasn't asking about the 1080M, he was asking about a full GTX 1080 brought mobile.

 

Ehe 30% stock? Probably 40%-50% overclock.

Expect same as 980m vs 980.

 

comparison with Maxwell in SPECviewperf12:

 

How does 1070 vs 1080 fare that will bring down the speculation of the GTX 1080M vs GTX 1080 mobile, GP104-200 cut down vs GP104-400 cut down (?) (Was GTX 980mobile cut down GTX980 desktop ? )

When does the 1070 arrive ?

 

980M was cut down from GTX 970. 980 notebook edition was a full fledged desktop GTX 980. GTX 1070 looks to be really cut down compared to the GTX 1080 and we don't know how much of a factor GDDR5X on the 1080 vs GDDR5 on the 1070 will impact performance, we will just have to wait and see.

 

How does SLI Change with the GTX 1080?


With Tom Peterson from Nvidia...

 

Interesting, I've listened to what you've all had to say on the format of the 1080M - I still think it's gonna be a full GTX 1070 with reduced clocks, but all cores intact. Doesn't seem a stretch to get it down from 150W in desktop to something around 100W in MXM/notebook form factor. The only thing that makes me think they might not do that is the milking strategies from NVidia to allow for another iteration of Pascal in a years time, but I'll still go with my idea of a full GTX 1070 just with reduced clocks for the 1080M.

 

This is the best review I've seen of the 1080 so far, makes my 980 GTX seem like a poor last gen card:

@Mr. Fox @Papusan

 

Yeah..., a nice card. Maybe next year for laptops if the cards will be made. I think I will skip 1080M.

 

10th of June.

 

So late, Ngreedia milking at its max from the founders scam.

 

VFXARG channel today put up parts of the sessions from the U.S.A. Texas Austin Nvidia Global Presentation of GeForce GTX 1080 and GTX 1070, the invite only event held to pre-release the consumer gaming Pascal boards.

What is GDDR5X New Memory in GTX 1080 Explained

GTX 1080 Pascal Memory Compression Explained

NVIDIA Pascal SLI Modes Explained

NVIDIA Ansel Architecture Explained

What is GTX 1080 Founders Edition

What is NVIDIA Pascal PlayReady 3 0 and HDR

NVIDIA Pascal VRWorks Virtual Reality

NVIDIA VRWorks VR Fun House Demo

What is NVIDIA Fast Sync

GTX 1080 Pascal Async Compute Explained

GTX 1080 Pascal Architecture Explained

 

I also am clueless why would anyone want to buy a GPU with stock cooler for 100 bucks more...

 

simple: to be first

Sent from my Huawei Mate 8 NXT-AL10

 

So you can be cool.

 

It would be so ironic if the founders edition, or rather stock cooling edition to be actually better in terms of cooling than all others.

I really fear they might had invested a lot in that cooling mechanism and now it might run cooler than all of the others

 

The confusion comes about because Nvidia has taken 1 thing - the "Reference Design" product, and split it in to 2 things - one thing at $599 and one thing at $699.

At $699, it's the "Founders Edition".

At $599, it's "another thing".

Nvidia haven't told us what "another thing" is, only that it's the $599 MSRP 1080 card.

In fact, I don't think Nvidia realizes they have created this confusion, and that is where the real confusion is coming into play.

As most of you, I am assuming the $599 MSRP 1080 GPU is going to be a "non-premium" component build of the "Founders Edition", but Nvidia haven't said that explicitly, yet.

Nvidia have given no name / form to the $599 MSRP edition. Is there some unannounced "NDA" or "Embargo" on the form and name of the $599 MSRP 1080 card?

 

Base models from 3rd party vendors, with basic cooling solutions possibly worse than reference.
Edit:The 100$ premium is probably Nvidias way of saying that their reference cooling is as good as the ones on non reference OCed cards and not a cheap 'stock' solution


Sent from my Micromax AQ4501 using Tapatalk

 

In the past Nvidia has issued the "Reference Design" as a product at an MSRP, which the other Partners were free to reprice, but pretty much kept to that MSRP for cards of the "Reference Design" form, at least initially.

In this case Nvidia has issued 2 MSRP's, $699 for the "Founders Edition" which we can see pictures of, hold, and for the lucky few test and use.

What does the $599 MSRP product look like?

That $599 MSRP must be based on a product design, build list, etc.

Nvidia has never forced a price range on any Partner, so Nvidia isn't setting a Minimum MSRP for just any 1080 card, Nvidia is setting a price of $599 MSRP for "something".

What is that "something"?

Is it a "non-premium" version of the "Founders Edition", or something else?

If the $599 MSRP 1080 card is a "Founders Edition" minus the backplate, substituting a plastic shroud for the metal one, and substituting some other board components for that $100 lower price, but has the same performance as the "Founders Edition", why haven't they specifically said that?

If you listen to the session at the Texas preview for the press, people were already getting indignant that their $599 entry level 1080 card is going to effectively be considered using inferior components in their build as compared to the "Founders Edition":
What is GTX 1080 Founders Edition

 

From what I have read there isn't a fixed design, so each manufacturer will have their own custom design at the $599 price point.

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Considering how the nvidia ceo is how he presents each luanch makes you wonder why he would let this happen someone surely within the company so this confusion coming

 

Why need People a search engine, when They can find all links here?

 

How can Nvidia assign a $599 MSRP to nothing specific?

Nvidia didn't tell us what the $599 MSRP card is going to have for cooler, parts, dimensions, components, etc. We have no idea what it is.

Does it have the "Founders Edition" cooler design, but implemented in cost saving materials?

What is the card design, whose parts list defines the $599 MSRP? And, how does it resemble the "Founders Edition"?

If Nvidia didn't want to show us the $599 MSRP card, why did they give us the price now?

Nvidia gave us the "Founders Edition" card in physical form, and priced it at $699 MSRP.

What is the physical form of the $599 MSRP 1080 card?

It's not defined.

 

That's another good assumption, but has that been explicitly stated?

All that I have seen is the $599 MSRP, no other details for what that 1080 model consists of has been released.

How can Nvidia set a price for something that hasn't been shown?

Are there 10 partners with 10 different $599 MSRP cards? Or is there 1 card design that is being shipped by 10 partners for $599?

Setting a minimum MSRP of $599 is against Nvidia's previously stated intent to not constrict partners to a set price or price range for product.

The partners are able to set their own prices. Nvidia has only had an MSRP for the physical instantiation of the "Reference Design" that Nvidia itself ships.

 

I think it's that you can buy the actual Nvidia reference design for $699 but 3rd party vendors can get them cheaper and will likely offer BETTER cooling solutions than what Nvidia has to offer.

 

Curated Content, right here on NBR

There are a lot of other videos, but none of the other ones were as content rich as these, and I kept adding to the list and reordering yesterday as they were posted and viewed.

I am sure I missed some good ones; please post the good ones you all find.

 

We all assume that a variety of implementations with the same GPU using a different implementation is part of the whole eco-system, why set a price of $599 MSRP to nothing in particular?

In the beginning there is only the Reference Design, which gives us a single price target - the cost of the card.

This time we have been shown the shipping card, the Founders Edition, and an MSRP of $699.

We have also been given a second MSRP of $599, with no physical example of that product, or even a description of what that card has to offer.

That lack of definition for what that $599 MSRP card has in comparison to the $699 Founders Edition is creating confusion.

What doesn't that $599 product have that the $699 Founders Edition has? Does $100 less cost mean $100 less performance?

Does $100 more in cost buy us $100 more performance?

The confusion created by Nvidia by setting a price performance point by shipping a "a premium component" implementation of the 1080 card called the "Founders Edition" at $699, and then saying that there will also be a $599 MSRP 1080 card available at release.

At best Nvidia should have said that there will be 1080 cards coming out below and above the $699 Founders Edition price, and left it at that.

Why assign an MSRP of $599 with no physical product? Why not mention the $549 product, or the $659 product as well?

If you don't have another card to actually show us, please don't give us prices for something we can't see.

 

Yes!!, and why didn't Nvidia come up with a plan to manage this after the Texas press briefing showed the backlash at the way it was presented.

 

Well I guess it's their money to spend and their (annoying) right to brag.
If I decide to upgrade I rather wait some and stick with extra 100EUR.
But if nVidia does this then there is clearly a market for braggers with extra dough on their hands.

Have reference coolers ever been cool? Both temperature and...uhmmm...fashion (?) wise?

 

Yeah it's a cluster #@$# alright.
I'm assuming that we'll just see 3rd party vendors release their designs for whatever price they see fit. The only difference I see here is Nvidia charging more for less. That tired old reference design needed an update - Nvidia acknowledged that a while back. All they did was put lipstick on a pig. It's still incapable of cooling the card when overclocked. So many cards are throttling when overclocked. Most of the reviewers run 2 minute benchmarks and call it a day. Very few have actually done their due diligence and observed if the overclocks are actually sustainable without temperature throttling.

 

Do you think mobile Pascal in 2016 will be able to do 1080p 60fps on ultra settings?

Currently the 980M can just about manage 1080p 30fps in the most demanding games like The Witcher 3, Crysis 3 etc. I want to see 60fps this year, in all games nomatter what.

 

I've noticed that too, reports are that under OC boost and high load the temperature gets up to 82c which is also the throttling point.

And once the temperatures reach that throttling point, the clock dips rapidly and recovers rapidly, over and over, showing a very jagged clock frequency graph.

I was waiting to post these videos until the 3rd one came out, the results video, and it just came out.

Gamers Nexus decided to create a Water cooled Hybrid card to see if better cooling would stop that erratic performance seen at the 82c throttling point:

Building a GTX 1080 Hybrid Part 1: Tear-Down

Building a GTX 1080 Hybrid Part 2: Assembly

Building a GTX 1080 Hybrid Pt 3: Performance Results

In the spirit of NBR hardware/software hacking for improving performance I thought these videos were pretty cool

The Hybrid does accomplish dropping the OC load temp well under the 82c and the clock that fluctuated greatly after 10 minutes under load, has been stopped.

Spoiler: 1080 clock frequency Founders Edition vs Gamers Nexus Hybrid Air/Water Cooling

 

Perhaps NVidia consulted with the 3rd party board vendors and $599 was the cheapest that the card could be offered at through any of those vendors - it'll be using a 3rd party cooling solution of their own choice. That's my understanding, as to the quality of the components used on the board well that's also not known - it's just down to the 3rd party vendors I reckon. We'll just have to see what they can offer, I'd be surprised if 3rd party cooling solutions were worse than Founders Edition, I'd expect them to be at least as efficient.

 

Brother @hmscott > do you like pretzels?

Spoiler: with mustard

Cal: "If you slept with your best friend's wife, why would he apologize to you?"
Jarvis: "Yeah, I know. That's weird."
Cal: "That's what I'm saying. My head's all tied up like a pretzel. I got a pretzel in my head!"

I'm not the one's gonna say Ti was priced high at $650, but add 50?, now a $700 card, $800 1080Ti FE on launch. $150 profit. $1150 Titan FE's? We'll see. Me thinks NVidia wants to get paid for being #1 ... they just unzipped their fly.

 

I like Puzzles, and Pretzels

"Cal: "If you slept with your best friend's wife, why would he apologize to you?""

The solution to that puzzle is simple

Because he knows her better than you, and he is apologizing in advance for the crap he knows she is going to put him through, and he is apologizing for being the cause of the problem in the first place - on oh so many levels...

There are as many possible answers to that question, as there are possible answers for what is shipping for the $599 MSRP.