BLACK LIST. Adjustable voltage control/turbo ratio limits are locked out due latest Win Update/Bios

From what I recall, those were A51M owners that attempted to jump several revisions down (1.7.4 to 1.5.0) and ended up doing something bad to their CPUs. I've looked into this method and it appears to be what Dell does if they need to roll back BIOS for any Alienware laptop. It involves some of the steps quoted in the Dell link I posted earlier with the added action of actually flashing a BIOS version of choice. I'll need to read up on it more and see if 2.4.1 locks the BIOS from being downgraded, but if I have issues with mine this will likely be the course of action I take.

 

Okay, I can confirm that my M17 R1 shipped with BIOS 2.4.1, and can still undervolt. I installed Intel XTU and HWInfo, and have it currently undervolted -.155v, confirmed in HWInfo. So, I'm not at all sure what's going on here.

EDIT: Here's what I believe is going on; XTU threw a warning saying it could not perform watchdog service if I undervolted to an unstable condition, that the system would not be able to be recovered. @Papusan I believe this was the desired mitigation - give us the control along with the personal responsibility for managing our systems.

 

Alright! My best guess is that the people who reported UV issues with these laptops experienced what could be technically termed as PBUAK, as in the original "UV issue" report on Reddit, eagerly proliferated by the usual suspect I wouldn't go as far as calling this fake news, although it's certainly in that ballpark especially given the very clear anti-Dell bias involved (I'm not saying the bias is not entirely unjustified ). I guess one charitable moral of the story is that it is ideal to refrain from spreading posts by unknown source, without any means of personally verifying them.

 

It would appear that the initial complaints may have been legitimate, but Intel and the OEMs know that these functions are almost required for the proper use of any modern CPU. @Papusan I can confirm the Plundervolt mitigation has not disabled use of undervolting with my M17 R1. XTU cautions the user that if they improperly undervolt they can create a situation where the system would not be recoverable. The mitigation to prevent exploiting any secure enclave using voltage modulation is set so that any modification made by XTU will not revert on a crash, reflecting voltages are locked once set by the user.

 

I posted screenshots of me not being able to undervolt or alter the parameters within XTU or Throttlestop

I will try reset to factory image soon, and see how that goes, even though i've tried the windows10 reset function through the boot menu already and i'm still unable to under-volt, because if you're saying you are on 2.4.1 and i've already downgraded to 2.0.4 and still can't under-volt, takes me back to the damn windows updates, and perhaps micro-coding their plunder-volt update into the Bios

 

I know it's a hassle, but you may want to consider a fresh install.

 

It's the last resort i'm just too lazy to go through a huge round of backup, but hopefully that ends this situation, although what guarantees do i have, since the windows updates the main culprit in this annoying ordeal, will continue to do annoying things and install things in the background even after disabling the damn updates through every mean.

But i will eventually get up and do it

 

I'm not saying I can still UV on 2.0.4. It's a fairly old BIOS. Have you tried 2.4.1 yet? Perhaps there is some interplay between 2.0.4 and the current Windows build/patches. Might be worth asking in the m15 owners' lounge. Not sure how many people are still using 2.0.4 BIOS to begin with.

 

I believe 2.4.1 was the BIOS version that removed their ability to UV.

I got super nervous when Windows started it's 1909 update. What I think is happening is they may have slipped in a different mitigation after the initial round of patches. When you caught the update, UV was turned off. The most recent updates may have the version @etern4l and I grabbed.

 

Will attempt a clean reset, and see what impact that has, if i all clear and i'm capable of UV, and god forbid i catch the horror updates again, i will re-do the operation and upgrade to windows professional..

My anguish with windows update didn't start here and doesn't seem that it will end here either, 2 years ago with my last laptop (Aorus) windows updates gave me hell with one of their updates it was april 2018, everything was running fine until i decided to restart, and the screen went dim, no bios, no boot menu no nothing, i took my laptop to the laptop repair shop and he is an extremely tech-savvy guy and spent an extreme 2 weeks trying to locate the source of the problem to no avail, and exhausting every alley way to solve the problem until he decided to flash the bios externally and reset it's version, and the laptop worked again, i began trying to find out what, when and why the problem started happening, and after going down the list, i decided to check my last security update version and write boot loop in google, and dang many users were suffering the same ordeal..

I wiped the laptop clean and installed windows professional disabled updates permenantly and never had any software issues until the laptop eventually died two months ago due to a dead GPU worn out ICballs

 

A new one...
Alienware m15 r1 locked undervolt

 

It is not an isolated incident or "hidden agenda" against Dell, if you own one of these laptops and still on the safeside by all means celebrate but it doesn't negate the truth, and there is indeed a Bios-microcoded update by windows and dell that disables undervolting

It's not just the plundervolt bios update i have issue with, for the last 6 days windows updates are installed and immediately the laptop fans start going crazy after restarting from the update, working on high when there is medium resources usage and i go to the updates panel spend a good 15 minutes to uninstall the updates, restart everything goes back to normal, wait a few days, windows freaking updates downloads the same updates i uninstalled yet again, and considering there is very little info on which update is the one causing the fans to run on high, you have to remove them one by one...

I exhausted every option there is to eliminate windows updates permanently on a windows 10 home machine to no avail, the updates restart themselves forcibly it's quite ridiculous, i tried to install the Group Policy batch yesterday even that didn't work

I'm okay with laptop, even after the tragic plundervolt with a good re paste the temperatures cooled down, but i am extremely frustrated with the connection and level of control dell allows Windows updates, it's beyond pathetic at this point

Might use a last resort fix, and wipe out windows 10 home along with dell's recovery partition and install a fresh copy of windows 10 professional

 

Maybe try Windows 10 LTSC

 

I don't know if these are the same user but the one from Reddit was able to successfully roll back to 2.0.4, and regained undervolting. I'm positively flummoxed on this. I know I can undervolt, my laptop shipped with 2.4.1. @etern4l has had no issues and I'm sure we're not alone.

My request to the community; can anyone with an Alienware M15 R1 or M17 R1, running BIOS version 2.4.1 and has lost the ability to undervolt, can you send me your BIOS dump? I'd like to compare between two known laptops of each state and see if the issue is there.

 

i can't for the life of me find this default option in bios..

I'll try again today..i'm at 2.0.4..but can't undervolt still

I will try that flashing bios method tomorrow and see what happens

 

YESSSSSSSSSS, i'm able to undervolt again, thanks to that user on reddit, and also to etern4l, Papusan and Gumwars

The cold bios boot using ESC + CTRL activated hidden Bios boot menu, which had three options

1 - Recover Bios (Recovers bios to the factory image)
2 - Reset Bios Defaults (Finally located)
3 - Rollback Bios

Its funny that i tried to access this hidden bios boot menu on 2.1.4 previously and it didn't work, only once you go down to 2.0.4 does it appear, and the person from reddit had the exact same experience, very strange sequence

So i decided to try the elusive "Reset Bios Defaults" and that was all she wrote, now the voltages are once again available

 

You can add the XPS 15 9570 to the list of shame. Undervolt is gone with latest bios:

http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/xps-15-9570-owners-thread.817008/page-295#post-11012980

Revert system defaults trick still working though.

Edit: Someone on Reddit claims, his 9570 laptop is missing the restore factory settings in bios:


And the default load DOES NOT work and WONT give back undervolt!

 

Its really beautiful to be able to undervolt again...bloody hell

Temperatures under stress don't cross 85 mark as oppose to scorching hell fire 100c temperatures prior to this messy debacle

I can't imagine owning a gaming laptop without this feature and doing regular heat sink re-pasting

Laptop is feeling cool again

 

Right in time before Dell release their new XPS 15 +rep

XPS 15 9570 added into the list of shame! It looks like Dell is the bell sheep in how to screw its own customers. Bad News won't come alone. This is todays big News on "how to treat own customers" http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...-owners-lounge.826831/page-2131#post-11013116

1) All G Series Gaming Laptops from Dell
2) Microsoft Surface Pro 7
3) HP Elitebook 840 G6
4) Acer Predator Helios 300
5) HP Probook 440 G5
6) Dell XPS 15 7590
7) Dell Alienware m15
8) Dell Alienware m17
9) Dell XPS 15 9570

 

For 3000$, you can get rid of your 1 yo machine and enjoy an SD card reader. It's so sad as the 51m is expected to bring Alienware back. Now it's not much different from it's BGA brothers.

 

its only going to get closer. it creeps up (down) to the rest of the bga books

 

Sad that EOL products outshine the current and coming models.

 

ASUS gx502 added to the list, received a bios update the other day (bios v310) and now I’m not able to undervolt anymore my specs are i7-9750h and rtx2060 in a thin chassis imagine not being able to undervolt I cba to see my laptop hit 95c on the cpu during load might be my time to give repaste a shot

 

Thanks. +rep

ASUS gx502 added into the list of shame!

1) All G Series Gaming Laptops from Dell
2) Microsoft Surface Pro 7
3) HP Elitebook 840 G6
4) Acer Predator Helios 300
5) HP Probook 440 G5
6) Dell XPS 15 7590
7) Dell Alienware m15
8) Dell Alienware m17
9) Dell XPS 15 9570
10) ASUS gx502

 

I love that we have a list of shame for laptop manufacturers complying with Intel's update to fix one of their security flaws. Shouldn't we actually be blaming Intel?

 

we should probably blame manufacturers cause they didn't give us an option to reenable or disable undervolt throught bios most of them know their laptop run really hot so they should've gave us an option for that instead that letting us with a shorter life span or at least they should've gave more information in the bios update information rather than ''improved system stability'' (my case)

 

I agree that they should include more details in the bios update information, however adding security fixes into their bios is something they've always done. I still don't blame them. I'd love if all manufacturers had overclocking options in their bios, but that's not realistic either.

 

I don't blame them either for the security updates but I knew about the plundervolt thing and that a fix would've been necessary but if I were to read ''improved system stability and fixed plundervolt vulnerability'' I would've deffo decided to avoid this update now my best bet is to put my hands on a good thermal paste and risk to brick my pc because I've never done some repasting unless they release some fix later on which will basically come in a minimum of 2 months I'm not blaming them I'm just disappointed

 

I get it, but it's Intel that put out the microcode which disables undervolting. Have you tried downgrading the bios to a previous version?

 

currently waiting on an answer on an asus forum before doing that

 

Add the GU502 as well, as the latest BIOS (version 309) removes undervolting. @Papusan instead of listing each model individually, maybe for these Asus models put them under the category of Asus Zephyrus M/S.

My specific laptop's temperatures and battery life have been reasonable enough to not need any sort of undervolt, especially after tweaking the power profiles a bit. That being said, I am in full agreement that users should be given the option to downgrade if they so desire.

 

what's your cpu temp? my gx502 has the same specs as yours and in terms of chassis they should be the same one user on reddit told me that you can downgrade bios the same way you update it btw haven't tried yet tho

 

I was able to roll back to BIOS 307, and undervolting works again. I haven't done a ton of load temperature testing, but using the silent profile, my idle temperatures are in the 38-42 range.

 

Does any alienware owners here know how to control the fans manually, Dells supporting control program is pathetic

Only able to adjust fan modes when playing games, but the fan is running at full speed at some random timings when the temperature is in the 55>60 range and i wish to have some control over this.

Any thoughts?

 

For now I will add each model individually. Will see how this pan out before I make changes. Will then be added similar as for the G Series Gaming Laptops from Dell in op.

Thanks. +rep

ASUS GU502 added into the list of shame!

1) All G Series Gaming Laptops from Dell
2) Microsoft Surface Pro 7
3) HP Elitebook 840 G6
4) Acer Predator Helios 300
5) HP Probook 440 G5
6) Dell XPS 15 7590
7) Dell Alienware m15
8) Dell Alienware m17
9) Dell XPS 15 9570
10) ASUS GX502
11) ASUS GU502

Hwinfo64 is as I know, the only option for Alienware laptops.

 

.. This was the pending install today!! ffs not again



Edit

 

Or you can use StopUpdates10:
https://greatis.com/stopupdates10/

*on edit*
Pap has a good writeup on it here

 

Thank you for this ill try it right away, as i can confirm ... Yes!! all that previous efforts went to waste and Windows 10 updates found a way to bypass everything and reinstall these updates, i'm on the brink of going mad

 

I prefer not have any services/software running in the background.

This is my prefered way. Works for me.

Download patches as standalone and install in offline mode with Network disabled. Always have the door closed when you install patches. Always.

How to use WUB
Windows Privacy Dashboard
NBR Windows 10 Clean Installation Guide
Windows 10 Tweaks and Fixes (Index post #1)
O&O ShutUp10 - Do not use Windows 10 without it!

http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/the-throttlestop-guide.531329/page-1087#post-10980641

 

Thank very much for this guide and also for your detailed post linked by custom90gt on how to use Stopupdates10, i've installed it now and hope that it finally brings a close to this frustrating chapter.

 

Hey guys, quick question. My MSI GE65 9SF allows me to undervolt via the hidden BIOS menu (unlocked with a key combo). I don't use ThrottleStop anymore, I just applied the same undervolt that I had on ThrottleStop but via the BIOS. Even if I get a Windows update that disables software undervolting, the BIOS undervolt should keep working, right?

I don't plan to update the BIOS, but even if I did, MSI allows BIOS downgrades

 

Attention! KB4497165 was offered on all my PCs and laptops today including new Intel microcode updates! Not sure if this update will block undervolt or not.

 

See what HWMonitor says

 

asus gl704gw here with 8750h and 2070, latest 309 bios locked undervolt. I was able to flash back old 308 via ez flash utility in my bios an restored undervolt...

 

Thanks. +reps

Asus GL704GW added into the list of shame!

1) All G Series Gaming Laptops from Dell
2) Microsoft Surface Pro 7
3) HP Elitebook 840 G6
4) Acer Predator Helios 300
5) HP Probook 440 G5
6) Dell XPS 15 7590
7) Dell Alienware m15
8) Dell Alienware m17
9) Dell XPS 15 9570
10) Asus GX502
11) Asus GU502
12) Asus GL704GW

 

Guys, GL704GW does disable undervolt. I stupidly updated fw to 309 then checked our specific subforum. Anyway I can flash back to 308 using winflash. It is very simple actually. I think it should work for ALL of the Asus notebooks. Download that.

Open cmd with admin privileges.
cd to where winflash.exe is
then enter Winflash /nodate

Doesnt matter the version this always works. It worked on my previous Asus laptop too.

However, now whenever I restart it says "restart needed to update firmware" or some bs like that. And whenever I restart it automatically flashes the recent bios. I updated to 309 using a bios installer, and that might be triggering restart to update thingy. After flashing 308 I rollback firmware driver in device manager which fixes the yellow warning icon it has but it still flashes new bios on restart. How can I fix this, please? There must be a flag or something that triggers that.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Figured out a way to fix it.

309=newest bad version of bios where undervolt is disabled
308=the one before that, uv enabled

1. Let the pos windows auto update to the newest 309
2. Restore system to the point before the 309 installation(windows makes one before the first installation of 309)
3.System will restart, but PC will be problematic(shutdown of Asus software), device manager shows the firmware as 308 but bios is actually 309
4. Prepare a USB with 308 in it. It should be formatted with fat32
5. Enter bios (it says it currently has 309) and flash the 308 fw. Thankfully Asus is "benevolent" enough to directly downgrade with their ezflash utility on bios.
6. Thats it. No weird shutdowns I even upped the undervolt by 5 mv just because I can. Now its -92.8 mv. My 8750h will thermal throttle slightly later now.

FU INTEL! Hackers can steal my gay midget porn but they cannot take away my undervolt ability!

 

And Windows update won't come back in a while and try to update it again when it sees it as 308?

 

The thief was Asus engineers. They could easly offer you all an proper firmware. But they chose the easiest way out. Intel doesn't force the notebook/motherboard manufacturers to give you only one solution.

" PROPER solution would be a BIOS update removing SGX technology or exposing the option that allows it to be disabled. They could toggle voltage control on with SGX disabled and off with it enabled"

 

Control Panel>System& Security> System>Advanced system settings> hardware>device installation settings> SELECT NO.

Done. MS can keep their driver updates to themselves.