Y410p [SLI] Purchase

LOL @ "produce." Now that's what we call "lost in translation." Dat Engrish. :laugh:

 

Did you try the dSLI method?

 

It will not boot up/get past the BIOS. It is a y410p with GT750M, not the 755M. It detects the device ID, and seeing how it is the WRONG device, and tells me to remove the hardware. Cannot get into Windows at all.

 

So yes, that's good. It is being recognized by the BIOS. Now you need to either modify the BIOS to not care about the wrong card being inserted or reflash the card's VBIOS via hardware flasher to have the correct device ID along with changing the following:

This area might be hardware straps. This was just a quick glance without looking at much else of the card. GT755M on left, GT750M on right


GT755M has pattern (1 is resistor [possibly a 0 ohm resistor], 0 is open):
10110010
01001101

GT750M
10111010
01000101

So moving the one 0 ohm resistor and flashing the VBIOS with a hardware flasher may enable use of the card on your system.

NVIDIA used to do hardware straps like this from what I understand. They would read what was shorted to come up with a PCI device ID. Now, the newer generation cards have different resistor values that the voltage drop acoss is measured for each strap to come up with a device ID. You could quickly check with a multimeter if it's just a short (0-ohm resistor) or actual different resistor values.

 

Ember,

I will check the resistor values later today when I get home from classes. I'm also fully capable of SMD soldering and have a lab on campus that I can use.

 

My findings:


In the picture above, I have just labeled the resistors. Also looking at the opposite side of the card where that resistor bank lies, there are clearly more open pads for some resistors. Thoughts?

Pad Resistor Impedance Rounded
1 1 25k 25K
2 0 105.7k 106K
3 1 44.8k 45K
4 1 4.9k 5K
5 0 90.1k 90K
6 0 85.3k 85K
7 1 4.9k 5K
8 0 75.4k 75K
9 0 81k 81K
10 1 45.4k 45K
11 0 106.9k 107K
12 0 63.0k 63K
13 1 29.9k 30K
14 1 25.0k 25K
15 0 60.8k 60K
16 1 14.9k 15K

These are not 0 Ohm resistors and their values vary and do not seem to make any sense really. Do you by any chance know what the device ID is SUPPOSED to be? We may be able to reverse engineer it.

It would appear that there are some capacitors at play here also. When measuring the resistance across the open pads, the resistance climbs slowly and then settles after about ten seconds.

Also the SPI flash chip appears to be an MXIC 25L2006E.

Extra: the PCB itself says 2013-01-16 (Made in China of course) Rev:1.0, which means this is likely the same exact PCB used for the 750m.

 

@bcunje if you had taken EE 101 you would know that you can't measure a resistor's value in-circuit I would take one off and measure it to double-check.

On the GT750M board the same pads on the opposite side are not populated also.

For your reference post with my photos of the GT750M PCB: http://forum.notebookreview.com/ide...wners-information-thread-178.html#post9418449

MX25L2006E SPI flash datasheet: http://www.zlgmcu.com/mxic/pdf/NOR_Flash_c/MX25L2006E_DS_EN.pdf

I wrote a bit of code that talked with a Bus Pirate to both dump and re-write the SPI flash on this board. You could do the same to reflash the GT750M VBIOS from Lenovo's website. Your school may have a universal programmer that would be faster and easier to work with, so I would choose that over my Bus Pirate solution.

 

If it was truly 0 ohms, wouldn't that be the equivalent of measuring the resistance across a piece of copper wire? Thus reading 0 Ohms . Any resistance within the PCB traces itself would only lower the resistance of a 0 ohm resistor since it's in parallel. ie. the resistance should be either 0 ohms OR less if they were in fact 0 ohm resistors.

I do agree that if the resistors had actual values, that measuring the resistance in circuit would not yield the correct results.

EDIT:
@EmberV do you still have your GT750M? I noticed that yours got bricked or stopped working for some reason, but I feel like there's some good knowledge that could be had if we poked it with a few DMMs.

EDIT2:

pls ignore my s***** ms paint

The resistors to seem to be bridged in some strange fashion, not entirely sure how they are supposed to be interacting. But on the positive side, the PCB layout is the same for the 750/755 so it doesn't really matter . The resistors are definitely creating a voltage divider network and I would be willing to bet that all of them are the same except values for the two that differ from the 750/755 PCBs.

 

@bcunje I sold my GT750M5 on eBay because I couldn't get it to even be recognized by my y410p (even showing me the "wrong produce" screen, which I did point out earlier). I then sold my y410p to get a Clevo W230ST.

Well my point was, yes, if you did measure and they were 0 ohms then it would show as a short just like measuring the resistance of a trace on the PCB. If you wanted to know if they are the same resistance, you would want to take them off to measure.

Here is a post that describes how NVIDIA handles hardware straps now: http://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/hacking-nvidia-cards-into-their-professional-counterparts/

I would wonder if Lenovo, in the BIOS, is examining the hardware straps or the software PCI ID given by the VBIOS.

Anyways, I would try a quick reflashing the VBIOS image to see what happens then go from there.

 

This is what I'm doing currently... looking for a programmer. The only thing I can think of that I have access to is a ChipMax (doesn't even support the chip) that uses a parallel port. It would seem I don't have enough hacker friends. Might just invest in a BusPirate, awesome little tool I could use for other projects.

 

Update:

I successfully re-flashed the GT755M5 with a slightly modified GT750M Ultrabay VBIOS, but still got the "produce" error. This leads me to believe that the BIOS is reading the Device ID off of the hardware straps and not the SPI chip, as we would expect. Going to wait for my friend to come back from school and ask him if I can poke his Ultrabay with a DMM.

Here's some pics for funsies:
SPI Flashing 750M BIOS onto 755M with Raspberry Pi - Imgur Gallery

 

Hi everybody.
I've finally received both laptop (755m version) and gt755m5, and this is what I did: instead of dremeling the external bezel I've used the blade of a cutter, heated over the kitchen stove. Is like cutting butter with a knife and the carving is really easy, I'd recommend this method if you don't have any professional tool at your disposal. I've completely removed the internal frame since is not an option right now for me to buy it from lenovo spare parts, and it seems really stable (is not moving at all and for removing it I had to apply a reasonable amount of strenght) also without it. I have the v3.05 BIOS and Sli seems to work just fine, so I'd say that the upgrade from 2.07 would not be a problem at all.
If anyone has any question, feel free to PM me.
P.s. thanks to all you guys for the help you give to all the y410p owners, thanks especially to pdnic, EmberV and Jobine

 

You guys didn't try using the modified SLI BIOS for mix and match cards?

 

Haven't heard of it. Care to provide a link?

 

I think he's talking about dSLI. Btw, did you try plugging in the gpu after the bios check completes and subsequently running dSLI within Windows?

 

This doesn't work. The BIOS puts the hardware into Optimus mode, when it needs to be in discrete GPU/SLI mode. Even if the GPU is inserted and the laptop restarted from Windows, it still will not recognize it.

 

Hey guys,
Btw Pdnic, I remember you posting this deal on slickdeals when it came out and I was the one who posted in the thread that one could put it in the Y410p LOL but I never got around to responding you.. Sorry for that. I rarely check SD.

Anyways, what are the best ways to install the 755m5 into a y410p (have the 755m version)? So far, I see cut it with a knife, use a dremel.. or get parts?
What kinda parts should I get exactly that would make this work?

 

They had to change the god***m gpu just after a few months! None of these manufacturers can be trusted to provide support for their machines anymore.

 

It seems that, by far, the easiest way to get the most out of SLI has been to have the older y500/400 models, since the 650m ultrabays have always been available, and work for both models if you play with the bezel. Plus you can overclock the 650m to the same level as a 755 or higher if you want with the modified BIOS. It's unfortunate that the people who bought the later "greater" models have such a pain getting full support.

 

haha, small world But I couldnt find documentation online so I created my own.

You dont *need* any other parts, but you will have to pare down the plastic (with a hot knife or a dremel, your choice) to get the bezel to fit the y410p. Card itself should work without any other modifications.

 

Actually I would recommend to get the y400 internal frame as pdnic did. I spent 2 hours trying to modify the one that came along with the gt755m5 in order to make it fit the internal mechanism, but I ended up simply removing it. It is working perfectly, but if you want to be 100% sure that is safely locked in the inside you might want to get one of those plastic things, expecially if you have the chance to get one easily.

 

Sure, but as long as you're okay with only inserting the SLI card when you need to use it on a table (as opposed to carrying the laptop with the SLI card installed) you can do without that part to engage the locking mechanism.

Also, it's pdinc, not pdnic, g*ddamnit .

 

So if I'm just gonna use it on a table, and after use remove it which I planned on doing actually when I take it to college, would I still need to take a dremel/knife to it?

 

If you want to make the external bezel fit, yes. But If you don't have any aesthetic needs and if you're gonna use it in a safe environment without anything that could possibly hurt the exposed gpu, I think you could just remove both bezel and frame, it will work just good.
@pdinc: Sorry, I've always read it wrong. Seems like a nice moment for changing glasses. If only I didn't spent all my money on this laptop, lol.

 

Thanks for all the info guys. Definately just purchased the y510p GT755m ultrabay roughly 1 minute after reading pdinc's post. Question though why would I need an ultrabay cover? Post a pic if possible. And why does this y410p show gpu vents on both sides if there isn't a y410p gt755m ultrabay?

 

link to website displaying that pic....

ET deals: Lenovo 14-inch 900p Core i7 gaming laptop with GT 755M for $774 | ExtremeTech

 

That's just a picture of the y400 with the ultrabay GPU. Lenovo copied the y400 images for the y410. That worked out for the most part, but in this case a change was warranted.

 

Interesting. So did the y400 use a GT750m ultrabay?

 

Pdinc what kind of temps do you get when running graphics intensive games in SLI? I heard the y410p will throttle any temps over 90c. Can anyone shed some light on that rumor?

 

Pdinc would i be able to use the Ebay 2nd Hard drive caddy bezel with the ultrabay vents that come with the y510p gt755m ultrabay? If so im assuming the Ebay caddy then consists of 2 parts. The bottom bezel and then the side bezel correct?

 

No, only the 650M Ultrabay was ever released for the y400.

 

Hey - I would still cut the bezel with a knife. You need one or the other to pull the card out - either use the locking mechanism to "pop" it out or just yank it out using the bezel. Without either it's hard to pull out the card; I've needed to use a pair of pliers when I tried to test it initially.

 

No, it's one piece. You wouldn't be able to use this bezel.

 

How are the SLI temperatures like? I'm planning on selling my GT750M Y410p for the newer 755M version and subsequently buy the GT755M5 ultrabay. Is it worth it? Are the temperatures that bad?

 

It surely gets hot, but I've not experienced any overheating problem yet, the two fans work like a charm. Still, when I play for long amounts of time at demanding games, I prefer using my Cooler Master fan to keep it completely cool. That said, is still cooler than my previous 17" asus laptop with a single gpu. Sorry I can't run any appropriate test right now, but exams are knocking at my door and I gotta let them enter.

 

So yesterday I took my buddy's y510p 750m SLI Ultrabay, removed the bezel, then put it in my y410p (August '13 /w 1.07 bios) and it worked just fine. Installed and everything.

I copied his hardware strap layout and values, so I'm going to be modifying my 755m as soon as my equipment comes in from Amazon. I'm not allowed in the nice labs on campus anymore because I GRADUATED .

At which point the 755m will have the same hardware straps + 750m bios, so in theory it should read just the same. There are only two resistors different in terms of values, so it's a piece of cake job.

I'll post results.

 

So the 750M cards will SLI with the 755M laptops? Does it work the other way around?

I'm running June 13' with 1.07 BIOS (svl7 Mod).

 

duplicate post... how to delete X(

 

Sorry I may have been a bit unclear. We both have very early versions of the y410p and y510p (August/Sept. 2013 both with 1.07 stock bios and 750Ms).

I am modifying the $99 755M Ultrabay available from Lenovo (instead of the $230 one) to (hopefully) SLI with the older single 750M y410p.

y410p 750m SLI is POSSIBLE, because it worked on my laptop yesterday by slipping my friend's ultrabay 750m from a y510p into my y410p.

 

Best news I've heard so far. Really appreciate you taking the time to post your findings. Hopefully, modifying the hardware straps will solve the incompatibility issue.

 

I want to upgrade my y410p to sli 755, but the graphic's card costs way too much, $274.99

http://shop.lenovo.com/SEUILibrary/...8B517832F7D2264A&hide_menu_area=yes#learnMore

Any alternatives ?

 

NEW Lenovo Ultrabay Removable Graphics Card NVidia GT755M 2GB Y510p for SLI | eBay
here's where I bought it, but I believe that if you're in USA or Canada you could find better deals. If you're willing to take the risk, try taobao or similar sites.
Or just wait and see if it ever get back to 99$ on the us lenovo site.

 

Considering doing this while the 755m is cheap and easy to find. Pdinc or anyone else who has done this; does running SLI cause microstutter or any other issues for you? I just got a stable driver setup that doesn't cause vsync stutter, tearing, or TDR and don't really want to bring on a whole new set of problems.

Just so I don't have to clutter this thread with another post I'll go ahead and ask my other questions.

All that is needed is for this mod are the Y 15" GT755m and Y400 module frame correct? Then trim the bezel to fit in the Y410P. Will a more powerful power supply be necessary? I'm using a 19.5V @ 6.15A which is 50 watts lower than what Pdinc reported using.

Edit: Running BIOS V3.05 so SLI should work fine. And the GT755m is still $99 here http://shop.lenovo.com/SEUILibrary/...nx|pla|11733&catargetid=1921822133&cadevice=c

 

@Bjulkes so I was right about the strap locations?

 

WOW that is f*****g robbery. They were selling it for 99 shipped just a few weeks ago. Had I known that, I would have picked up about a hundred of them and sold them back for "half price" and still made hundreds.

@EmberV I think you may have been referring to me, but I'm waiting for an order of 0402 SMD resistors to come in from Mouser. I have no doubt that modifying the resistors will work. Fun fact, all of the open AND closed resistor pads read the exact same values IN CIRCUIT... I'm pretty excited to get this working.

 

If i purchased my y410p w/ gt755m in February will i need to download this VGA Bios update for win 8.1?

NVIDIA GeForce GT755M Second VGA BIOS Update for Windows 8.1 (64-bit) - IdeaPad Y410p, Y510p - Lenovo (US)

Under the instructions for checking VGA card version it states "4. Make sure there exist "NVIDIA GeForce GT 750M" in it"
What if i don't have a gt750m?

Sorry i know its a total noob question. Guilty as charged....

 

It works!!! Almost... I modified the hardware straps to match the 750m resistors, and the device ID shows up as the 750m device instead of 755m!!!

I'm able to get past the BIOS, and got it to detect in Windows (I have two GPUs in Device Manager), but one of them (probably the second GPU) shows up with an exclamation mark. Trying to reflash the vBIOS with the 750m SLI fix from Lenovo, but nvflash.exe just closes out immediately. When using nvflash.exe --check, it says no suitable EEPROM device available, but --list shows two graphics adapters on the system...

Also I noticed that nvflash only has the MX25L2005 and not the MX25L2006 EEPROM chip that is on the actual board in the device list. They are pretty much the same device, though I believe the 2006 is faster/has better performance.

@EmberV help! I'm so close I can taste it.

 

THAT FEELING WHEN YOU TURN ON YOUR AUGUST '13 1.07 BIOS y410p AND SEE THIS:



I win this round Lenovo.... They are a horrible company and withheld this wonderful Ultrabay capability from all y410p/y510p owners FROM THE BEGINNING. If my 1st gen 750m y410p can SLI with my modified GT755m, then ALL LAPTOPS ARE SLI CAPABLE.

This is the last time I buy anything from Lenovo.



I will make a separate post outside of this thread about my findings.

 

Lenovo can suck our collective d's while we bask in glory. Join team Clevo, it's better here (you even get full schematics for the motherboard!)

 

While I envy your tenacity, this is why I purchased my y400 after it was confirmed to be SLI compatible. That being said, it's utterly ridiculous that Lenovo didn't bother to release a 750/755M ultrabay for the later y400 and y410p. I mean how difficult is it to put components (that they already had) in a slightly different casing (again that they already had)?