*** MSI 16L13 (Eurocom Tornado F5)/EVOC 16L-G-1080 15.6" Owner's Lounge ***

I have not had the opportunity to try it on full blast but I did give it a run earlier with the fans just ticking over and it gives a good 2-3C drop more than the U3+ with the sensible fans on it.

 

Is it possible to upgrade from 7700K to the new coming Intel Coffeelake 6 Core CPU in the EVOC-G-1080?

If not due to mother board compatibility issues is there a replacement MOBO that fits the EVOC and offers support to coffeelake-S CPU?

@Donald@HIDevolution @Mr. Fox @Prema

 

Hi Bro. I don't think anyone knows definitive answers to this yet. I have not heard anything other than expressions of hope that it will be possible to upgrade from KBL to CFL. I am skeptical it will happen. That would be too righteous of Intel to give us that ability. I think they want to sell more motherboards and making CFL backward compatible would likely interfere with too much their wealth accumulation strategy.

 

You should be asking Eurocom and MSI as they are the two working on it, together. You should know that, Eurocom is the NA distributor, the original Clevo company here, the rest of us are just the smaller fries, whereas they been around for going close to 40 years.
I've met software engineers that had thier laptops back in the late 80's or so they said.

Anyways as I have been given the impression, it will retail 1151 socket and the new systems will be possibly Z370, but I am not sure where Z270 went.... or how this chipset naming stuff works, and it could all be just rumours and speculation at this point, no concrete evidence has been provided one way or another.
There are also rumours to have a Rysen version featuring the new AMD mobile 580 cards, since they are working so closely together as well. I say it could go either way. Like who offers the best pricing/options might get the stage IDK...

 

Coffee lake will require a new revision of the LGA 1151 socket. Aka dubbed with the V2.

 

Sucha nice guy Papsun ! always liking my replies and such, thank you so much.

So LGA 1151v2 ? Then that means electrically similar but not mechanically the same somewhere else, so they will change how it fits, I'm guessing to simply sell more motherboards is why.

didn't they promise us tick tock tack or something, with this form being usable by three generations ?

If they do a new one for the coffeelake, sounds like it will be the only generation using it.

something doesn;t make sense to me. Friggin rumours are never solid enough, does anyone have a link to anything 100% solid ?

 

Give a damn in tick tock tack or whatever Intel try on. Expect 2 revision of LGA 1151 v2 as usual. If not, I think a lot of screwed Intel boys and girls will be very mad Aka will be the same as Skylake and Kaby on same socket.
Edit. Same amout of pins but maybe change the pin placement. More Info

 

then that would be they talked for nothing for 2 years all about it, only to shutup and then go back to the way things were, always.
lol. Maybe they will half do it, like with HEDT only or something.

 

Only AMD <can> change Intel's attitude. Maybe, but not likely. Every new chipset and socket. Will give more cash to the Blue monkeys...

 

We need a third semiconductor company, that's what would really shake things, right now, these guys are the only two top dogs.

 

And it will stay that way. There will only may pop up some new Laptop, GPU or whatever manufacturer
that will still be dependant on one of theese two companies.

 

I guess I can wait to see the new stuff from Clevo/Eurocom/MSI. If they make a Ryzen AM4 socket MOBO for the Tornado F5, I'll drop cash on it with a 1700x CPU.

 

They are having bios trouble getting the new AMD cards working right, but they are infact exploring thier options. If they make some breakthroughs it could be potentially more options for us going forward, I know they did a April fools joke about Rysen and the RX580 etc.. but that actually is what they're trying to do, which makes the joke all the more funny !

 

...and my resupply came in so I will do that comparison for the paste later today or tomorrow.

 

Thank you!

 

Have you tried them yet?

 

Folks, been extremely busy lately with work and traveling but I got some awesome test results to share, hopefully by end of the day.

1. Established 4K GPU baseline by running FireStrike Ultra stress test 3 times in a row.
2. Established CPU baseline by running Cinebench 3 times in a row.
2. Modded the bottom cover and performed the same benchmarks as step 1 and 2. Recorded the new temperature.
3. Took apart the heatsink, replaced stock IHS with Bitspower IHS, applied Grizzly Conductonaut, applied Fujipoly 17.0 W/mK thermal pads.
4. Performed the same benchmarks as step 1 and 2. Recorded the new temperature.
5. Modded U3 with 3 x 120mm Noctua NF-F12 iPPC 2000 PWM and 1 x 120mm Scythe Slip Stream Slim fan.
6. Performed the same benchmarks as step 1 and 2, while on modded U3. Recorded new temperature.

I thought about just posting the results, but I'd rather take my time to put together a solid review with all the screenshots to prove it. I think you guys will be pleasantly surprised with the end result and I can't wait to share it!

 

Wrapping things up here, but I felt compelled to mention something.

There is something seriously wrong with SL version of Bitspower IHS. While running Cinebech, Core 0 will run 15~20C hotter than other 3 cores and I've tried various things to make it fit flush, but gave up after fourth attempt and three bottles of Kryonaut later. However, I tried the Kaby Lake version of the Bitspower IHS, and from the get-go, it is designed completely differently and blind person can tell it will fit much better than the SL one. Sure enough, after putting it all back together for the fifth time, Cinebench shows even temperature across the board, so theres that. I'll share the results probably tomororow, waiting on a 4pin to 3pin adapter for one of the fans on U3 to arrive.

So, unless I got a lemon, SL version of Bitspower IHS SUCKS and COMPLETE WASTE OF TIME AND EXPENSIVE PASTE. Use Kaby Lake version with 1mm copper shim instead and save yourself a LOT of headache.

 

why use 1 mm copper shim? the KBL IHS is the same height as the stock Intel, only SKL is 1 mm TALLER than the stock IHS. or did you adjust the cpu cooler via mobo retention to be 1 mm higher now, thus not reaching the stock IHS z height necessary for proper contact?

i actually went for the KBL version because i was worried the added 1 mm height would make things difficult with my unified GPU/CPU heatsink....

looking forward to your review

 

Hey Jaybee! Good question, why the copper shim? In my case, for two reasons.

1. Mr. Fox recommended from the get-go that we should be using SL version of the IHS, precisely because it is taller. I assumed this is to allow better contact against the heatsink. When SL failed to do its job and KL IHS was used, I wanted to make sure it will be the same height as SL.
2. When I opened up my 16L13, the technician who put it together already sandwiched a 1mm (could be .5mm, its thin) between the stock IHS and heatsink. I assumed they did this for exactly the same reason Mr. Fox mentioned.

Spoiler alert. I do not think Bitspower IHS was worth the effort, SL or KL. I spent hours trying to figure out why it wasnt spreading the heat evenly and in the end, the improvement provided by the Bitspower IHS was minuscule at best.

It looks cool though, so that counts for something!

 

Something I've been meaning to ask you guys, I'm noticing my PCH temperature idles around 72~75C pretty consistently lately. When Zoltan from HIDevolution helped me reapply the XTU profile awhile ago, it sat around 62~65C but that seems to fluctuate pretty often. Do you guys mind posting your PCH temp so I can see if this is normal?

 

i have a eurocom f5 with 1070 and 6700k, while my temp may not relate to the specs you have but guess i'll post anyway. i hardly see my temp on PCH ever increasing over ~61c. it just sits there during loads(my laptop never idle atleast not for a month). temp over 35-40c(room will be 30c) here where i live so thought these PCH already at max. if you have 70+ maybe its conceerning tho i have no idea about 1080 + 7700k combo. also these temps with fan on auto.

 

Alright folks, I got the goods for y'all. After spending hours taking apart the laptop and getting to know it very, very well, I'm finally ready to share the results. However, before I jump in, I would like to provide some context on why I felt this was necessary to began with.

As someone who is constantly on the move, I wanted a laptop that is capable of handling 4K contents while being light/small enough to fit into most messenger bags. At first, I considered purchasing KM1 with single GTX 1080, due to it having vapor chamber heatsink and reports of excellent GPU temperature. However, I just couldn't accept traveling with 17" laptop and 16L13 was the next best thing that fit the bill. After much anticipation, the laptop arrived and as mentioned by many of you before, the GPU temperature became an immediate concern during 4K gaming. While the laptop was perfectly stable, watching GPU temperature hovering at 90~93C simply wasn't acceptable to me and decided to do something about it.

Having said that, please keep in mind the entire purpose of this exercise was to see how I can improve the CPU and GPU temperature, especially during 4K gaming. As I mentioned before, the testing procedure were as follows,

1. Established CPU baseline by running Cinebench 3 times in a row.
2. Established 4K GPU baseline by running FireStrike Ultra stress test 3 times in a row.
2. Modded the bottom cover and performed the same benchmarks as step 1 and 2. Recorded the new temperature.
3. Took apart the heatsink, replaced stock IHS with Bitspower IHS, applied Grizzly Conductonaut, applied Fujipoly 17.0 W/mK thermal pads.
4. Performed the same benchmarks as step 1 and 2. Recorded the new temperature.
5. Modded U3 with 3 x 120mm Noctua NF-F12 iPPC 2000 PWM and 1 x 120mm Scythe Slip Stream Slim fan.
6. Performed the same benchmarks as step 1 and 2, while on modded U3. Recorded new temperature.

I should mention that I avoided using benchmark such as Firestrike and Valley/Heaven to determine the GPU baseline, because I believe it is not a realistic measurement of true operating temperature during prolong GPU load. A single Firestrike benchmark is only few minutes long, which isn't long enough to let the heat build enough to reach the level of temperature I'm observing after 15+ minutes of 4K gaming. With that in mind, I went with 3 straight runs of Firestrike Ultra stress test to achieve more realistic 4K GPU baseline.

As for the CPU baseline, I believe a single run of Cinebench isn't adequate to determine a baseline. Looking back, I should've ran it at least 5 times in a row instead of 3, but you can absolutely see the differences in end temperature as heat builds between runs. However, I must acknowledge that CPU temperature has never been an issue for me and runs very cool during 4K gaming, and I'm extremely happy with it overall.

So without further ado, here are my results.

CINEBENCH - Stock Configuration





Results - 83~87C

CINEBENCH - Modded Bottom Cover





Results - 77~83C

CINEBENCH - KL Bitspower IHS with Modded Bottom Cover





Results - 77~83C

CINEBENCH - KL Bitspower IHS with Modded Bottom Cover on Modded U3





Results - 75 - 80C

As you can tell, the modded bottom cover provided significant drop in CPU temperature. Bitspower IHS seems to have made almost no difference and modded U3 provided further drop in temperature.

GPU results on the next post!

 

Moving onto GPU! I purposely left G-SYNC on for the duration of tests because I will never turn it off during gaming (its awesome) and wanted it to effect the results as intended.

Firestrike Ultra Stress Test - Stock Configuration





Results - 90C

Firestrike Ultra Stress Test - Modded Bottom Cover





Result - 84~86C

Firestrike Ultra Stress Test - Modded Bottom Cover on Modded U3




Results - 72~73C

The modded bottom cover provided a nice relief to the GPU temperature, moving it few C away from the throttle limit. However, the biggest gain was provided by the modded U3 as you can tell and brought the GPU temperature WAY down, but I wish it didn't take a modded cooling pad to achieve this level of temperature.

Here are some pictures from the journey.












To wrap it up, this was one hell of a project. It was very nerve wrecking taking the laptop apart but really got to know it inside and out. The modded bottom cover exceeded all my expectations and the drop in temperature was very nice to see, considering it can be done in few minutes with right tools. Bitspower IHS was a massive disappointment and I personally would avoid using it, due to lack of improvement over stock IHS and the hassle it comes with. Although I won't be traveling with it, the modded U3 provided MASSIVE drop in GPU temperature and completely worth the trouble if you are stationary.

Quick shout out to @Mr. Fox for all his awesome videos, which was critical for this project and many others who contributed to the collective knowledge that I leveraged. I hope you guys found this helpful and please feel free to let me know if you have any questions, comments, concerns or complaints.

Tagging @Papusan =D

 

Wow, that's really good, so you reduced CPU temperatures by 7 degC, and reduced GPU temperatures by a whopping 17 degC! That's a clear win for the GPU, is it boosting to higher frequencies now or just running cooler? Your mods look very professional on the bottom cover mod, so all in all this a really good result, especially as your GPU is operating now at a really comfortable 73 degC, this is good news for longevity! One thing that surprised me was the amount of paste you put on top of your IHS - that was a lot of white goo, not sure you needed that much! Excellent job on everything & a well written guide that is easy to read & understand, it's the kind of thing I'd put a link to in my sig (in your sig I mean)! (I'll give you some rep later, won't let me give you any at the moment!)

 

Thanks for your kind words and feedback. I'm glad you brought up the mess of a goo on the CPU, it was Kryonaut which refused to be spread without clumping up within seconds. Due to this, it was almost impossible to put a thin layer on it and any attempt to spread it made it worse by leaving empty spots everywhere. I wrestled with it until I had it covered throughout the entire surface, but in the end, toss it aside and used Conductonaut instead. Speaking of, it seems conductonaut made absolutely no difference on the GPU temp, which was disappointing.

 

Your Kyronaut tube is bad. See if you can exchange it. My kyronaut spread as easily as the MX 4 I still have and the Nanogrease extreme. They all spread very easily without clumping.

 

That's good to know, I appreciate the advice. It would be nice and soft when first pushed out of the tube, but in about 10-15 seconds, it would get noticeable harder and started to clump together during spreading using the provided tool, leaving exposed spots in its wake. Not sure what amazon will say when I return an empty bottle but I'll give it a shot.

EDIT: Fun fact, I was so pissed off at it that it almost caused serious marital issue. Will be avoiding it at all cost, to say the least.

 

Hi, is there any way to disable the touchpad in a Eurocom F5? I tried the FN+F3 combination but it doesn't do anything. I have all the latest drivers installed and running W10 64. Thank you

 

+ rep. A very nice review And the classic U3 cooler is still the best one out there if yoo dump the trashy 5v usb fans for better and bigger 12v's. Worth its weight in gold
Edit. I forgot. Buy a few fan filters for your U3 (or rob one or two nylon pants in your parners garderobe-If you have a loved one)

Spoiler: Papusan's homemade fan filter from my wife's garderobe :)

 

The kids are at playschool, the dog is asleep out in the shed and the Mrs. is at work, so It was time for some science! You can still hear the fans for sometime after they are switched off but the results are in!

 

Yeah mine doesn't do that. I can pour it in a line on the CPU

@Papusan what's the difference between a U3 and a U3 plus? I Just ordered a u3 plus. Should I cancel ?
The "regular" U3 was $63-$300 ....

 

The newest U3 is called Plus. The older U3 is maybe a bit better. But probably not the big deal.

 

So you dropped about 10 degC CPU temperatures with U3 fans on minimum, and the U3 max speed didn't do much apart from loads of noise - so I'd run that at minimum U3 fan speed perhaps combined with max fans on the laptop (depending on if laptop max fans don't add much noise).

 

As others have said maybe you got a bad tube of Kryonaut. My tips for Kryonaut application is to keep the tube in my pocket for 15mins or so to warm up, then using the applicator (screwed onto end of tube) I apply gentle pressure to plunger while pressing quite lightly on the CPU & moving it slowly & steadily to paint quite thin lines across the whole of the CPU (there's a vid online.

Ha, your other post about it nearly ending in a marital dispute - time to take a break at this point or have a beer timeout!

 

I've been meaning to respond to this for some time now, but I've wanted to check the temps under varying scenarios. It seems that my PCH temps never really get past 60 C. They typically average mid 50s. I have the 7700k and the GTX 1080, so my machine can get the temps up there. I can run a more stressful test on my book to see if it will go higher, but under normal to fairly heavy stress all temps stay about where I want them. I still have to mod the bottom cover.

 

Yeah, U3 fans on maximum and at 83dB only gives a few degrees drop so would only really be useful when trying to squeeze just a few more MHz out of the CPU. Although they do have a big impact on the PCH and SSD temperatures.

The fans on minimum are tolerable but still a bit too noisy to watch TV over, however, they would be fine for leaving on in the kitchen overnight, with the doors closed, for any intensive tasks.

 

Awesome stuff, bro. I am proud of all you did here. Excellent!

 

Ah, so you've got some borderline practical applications, twas not all in vain!

 

True! I forgot to mention, it can also be propped on the spare dining chair which lives in the shed(office) and use it to ventilate the office(shed) - it does get a bit warm in there when the PC is running.

 

Ha, double bonus!

 

@woodzstack did you ever do that paste testing?

 

nah, asked client if I could use thier laptop for it and they didn't want to, maybe next guy. It's sitting here unused.
I could test it in other laptops, but I said I'd do it in an F5 and I don;t feel like buying more of this stuff if I waste it.

If someone wants, if you end up placing an order with me, I can run the tests to see which paste is better, and leave you with it, for free.

 

I actually used to have a mini-notebook that was 1366x768, if I'm recalling correctly. Agreed, it's a weird one.

Can you share how you did that? I'd like to replicate that here, and even after a couple of months of use I still don't think of myself as much of a Windoze wiz.

 

With respect, I don't think the problem is the semiconductor industry. It's the fact that the two main operating systems for end-user computing (Windows and MacOS) only run on x86_64 architecture.

There are other processors out there, for example the ARM series ( https://www.arm.com/products/processors), that can do amazing amounts of computation on very lean power and cooling budgets, and which are innovating at a rapid pace.

If the world moved from Windows/Mac to Linux, which already runs on just about any CPU you have ever heard of (from SoC/SBC to mainframe -- literally), there would be much fiercer hardware competition.

Microsoft Windows NT once supported Intel, MIPS, and Alpha architectures, but Microsoft dropped the RISC platforms.

 

FN+F3 is working for me on the EVOC-16L-G-1080 from HID Evolution. Do you have the KLM keyboard manager installed and running? I have W10 Pro 64. My only problem (and a small one) is that the touchpad disable does not persist when coming out of screen lock or suspend. I'm sure they do that in case you don't have the mouse still connected, so I forgive this minor inconvenience.

 

Is anyone running their F5 with the battery removed? Any issues with doing this? I am looking to remove mine since 99% of the time it is on AC power only and I would like to save the weight for travel. The battery adds significant weight to the laptop and while it may be a tad unbalanced with it removed I'll take that hit.

 

Ha, it would be much lighter and you would be able to bring it anywhere without the battery!

It will work fine, you might have to reset the little button there when you put it back if ever.

 

Just go here in the nvidia control panel and add custom resolutions


I'm pretty sure you can also edit the panel driver .inf or something but it's easy enough to do it here.

 

Many thanks. I had been looking for a way to do this in Control Panel.