The Official MSI GT73VR Owners and Discussions Lounge

undervolting reduces heat... read more

Re-pasting shouldn't be needed, and puts your laptop at risk - of you damaging it and worst of all losing your warranty coverage. Be sure and ask your vendor if you repasting the CPU / GPU voids your warranty. It's one time to ask for permission instead of asking for forgiveness, they won't be forgiving.

If the CPU is undervolted and running under the thermal throttling point - 93c, it's good enough for long term use. Any further temperature reduction through re-pasting is a waste of time, cost, and effort.

You are worrying about things you can't avoid if they are going to happen, you'll need to test for find any problems as soon as it comes out of the box, so you can return it in the first 7-14 days, depending on the rules for returns where you buy it.

Learn what to look for, and how to test, so you can be prepared before you purchase.

Undervolting is a simple tuning to find the lowest stable CPU voltage, and even a setting of -100mV can reduce load temperature of the CPU by 10c.

Overclocking + undervolting gives you best performance at lowest temperatures.

RMA is usually for poor construction, infant mortality of components - usually fail in first 2 weeks to 4 weeks of use. Some fail due to shipping stresses, some due to electrical stresses.

Most laptops never need an RMA, if you reject the ones with problems before your return period is over.

I've only had to RMA 1 laptop due to a bad GPU, and that was after 4+ months of use, and it was marginal from the start.

If I knew what to look for - poor OC headroom compared to other GPU (Crossfire so 2 GPU's in laptop) I should have returned the laptop when I bought it instead of allowing the marginal GPU to limp along until it failed. VRAM wouldn't OC, so it came as marginal at stock settings and got worse from there until I needed to RMA.

OC didn't kill it, OC found the problem, I didn't know better at the time to return it based on my results. You live and learn

If you go into this afraid of RMA, and you will likely find a need to RMA, and stress yourself out over it. I've seen that happen many times. When expecting perfection, you'll always find issues, there is no perfection just functionality despite imperfections.

Just because it's expensive doesn't mean it's going to be perfect. In fact logically the more complex and expensive something is the more likely some component or manufacturing step is going to fail.

Like I said, I've had many many laptops and only one needed one RMA, so you'll likely be able to not deal with that whole RMA thing, but if you do then deal with it in a timely manner, return it right away if it's got a problem - don't wait for it to fail and be required to go through full RMA.

It helps to have 2 or more computers, so if one is offline needing a software or hardware fix, you are still functional with another computer.

Maybe hold back some cash for a nice desktop first and then get an expensive laptop. Or get a nice 2in1 easy carry laptop as well as the high end gaming laptop.

I've seen people hold on to problematic laptops for months and years just because "they couldn't live without it" and don't send it in for RMA.

Anyway, lots to learn, have fun

 

If you want it to last as long as possible, then you want either the CM238 chipset version of the GT73VR (IF you can find it, as this version has been discontinued) OR the GT75VR, with the 7820HK. The HM175 chipset version of the GT73VR isn't horrible, but there ARE some possible extra limitations in the EC firmware (17A1EMS.112, vs 17A1EMS1.108) that are not present in the CM238 version (.108), but most users will not run into this, only people who push their hardware hard may.

If you want it to last as long as possible, you want the LAPTOP to be viable as long as possible, thus you want a laptop you CA overclock in the future.

How does this look? (fully game stable at this voltage):



(can be stable here probably maximum realistically, but I haven't tested stability yet):

Unrealistically high temps, not stable, temps are the issue:


SUICIDE RUN YEAH YEAH BRING IT @Mr. Fox @Papusan


This is with Liquid metal repaste and unlocked Bios.
Please don't get a 7700HQ. Please. Just don't.

 

You are waaayyyy over thinking this.

The temps on the GT73VR are fine out of the box, and better with the upgraded Thermal Materials applied.

These laptops are built for hard usage. Out of the box your idle temps will be in the 30C's, and under heavy stress your GPU will be in the 60C's and CPU will be in the 70C's. This is with stock thermal materials, and without any undervolting.

When we build them, the RMA rate is almost ZERO.

You just take good care of it, and it will take good care of you.

 

@Donald@HIDevolution, when ordering the overclock package from HIDevolution, does the service guy overclock as well as under volt? Or does he overclock via the bios or via software?

 

We undervolt and overclock in the BIOS.

However sometimes it is done by our female technicians

To correct what I said earlier, by default, our production technicians will start with an undervolt of -100mV, whether the OC package is ordered or not, and test for stability. Almost all of the time -100mV is fine, but on the rare occasions it is not, it will be adjusted until stability is reached. With stock thermal materials, but with -100mV, the temps I gave above are accurate.

With Fujipoly thermal pads, Grizzly Conductonaut on the CPU, and Gelid GC Extreme on the GPU, with a -100mV undervolt, and no OC, the temps we get under heavy stress are mid-60C's on the GPU, and around 68C on the CPU. Once OC'd the CPU temps only rise slightly.

 

MSI has some of the best cooling in a laptop from my experience with various laptops. Their Cooler Boost Titan is awesome. I rarely hear the fans spinning during my workflow which is mostly browsing the web and watching YouTube. You would only hear them spin up a little bit if you're gaming. If you want max cooling, there is a dedicated button on the right to put the fans in full blast mode



With that said, after I repasted the CPU with Liquid Ultra vs the IC Diamond that I had before my temps went down by 10C literally on the same clock speeds which I currently run (4.1 GHz on all cores)

Here are my idle temps @ 4.1 GHz just for reference. I've been running overclocked for a year now, 24/7 on my 7820HK don't settle for less unless you are on a tight budget but never worry about cooling with these laptops:



I highly recommend you get it from a good reseller like HIDevolution so they can properly do the thermal paste job, stress test the machine, and ensure you get a quality product that works great out of the box and to have that extra tech support other than MSI's tech support when you really need it. They offer a lot of customization options so you can choose from any SSD, RAM, etc. you want to make it really tailor made for you.

If you email [email protected] and tell him your NBR Forum username you may get a small discount.

Here is why I recommend these guys, their customer service and warranty support is beyond anything I've experienced before

HIDevolution - The Best Company I ever dealt with
HIDevolution's Warranty!
HIDevolution - a benchmark for excellent customer service

 

I believe HID's tests are also on auto fans, since manual fans sound like a jet engine, so you will get eve lower temps should you choose to push the fan speed.

 

Hi guys,

I am new on OC laptop! i just did OC my phones several times and I OC my previous laptop ASUS G75vx!
now, my question is, is there any tutorial to help me to OC + ondervolt my laptop? and help me in detail about what application i need to use and how to use them ... ?

my GPU and CPU's temprature when i am browsing is 34 and 36C , when I am playing game with ultra setting usually in HD GPU is about 75C.
so please let me know if it is possible to decrease the temperature of GPU by OC+ ondevolt

Thank you

 

https://www.3dmark.com/fs/14343977
Not bad for a BGAbook I guess

 

Strange dichotomy, spending $$$ on a super high-end gaming laptop, while being fearful of using it for what it was carefully constructed.

Is the cheetah afraid to run?

 

This is pointless... I give up. Have fun guys. Thanks for trying to help.

I've decided to just be happy with what I've got. I don't need to play games on Ultra-high-def-beast-mode to be happy, hell or even to game at all.

In all reality, these latest revisions of these laptops aren't even a year old. So no one can honestly comment on their TRUE reliability or quality control... or how many RMA's these things may need. it's too early to tell.

My T420 + EVGA 750 TI FTW eGPU is more than capable of still running many modern games, albeit not on Ultra. But I'm not someone who lives for games. I just enjoy them, and I appreciate pretty graphics. I'll just live with what I've got. The old ThinkPads are far more reliable than anything built today anyway IMO. Maybe when it dies I'll look into getting a GT73VR when they are $800 instead of $2800 for the same setup in a few years.

Thanks for the offerings of knowledge. Good luck to those of you that don't have massive amounts of cash to throw around and desire to take care of your valuable possessions. I hope these machines serve you well for years to come.

 

It's not pointless, the point is you have a lot to learn and experience, which is why so much of what we are saying sounds odd to your ears right now.

Don't give up now, this is the easy part

I've run high end laptops for years, and only had 1 RMA, Asus, MSI, Acer, HP all ran fine. There are others that have more problems, often problems they make for themselves. Stay out of the laptop, don't futz with the firmware, and OC within the limits of the design, and you there's a better chance that you won't have problems either.

If you are afraid of going offline for RMA then prepare for it and make sure you have a backup system to use. Usually we all keep 1 or 2 older laptops or desktops around for just that reason.

If you Think Thinkpads are more reliable, I've never seen that, I see friends with Thinkpads RMA'ing more than me.

You'll never see a desireable GT73 level laptop for $800, they keep more value than that for several years, and by the time they are that cheap they are "used" and beat up, probably needing re-pasting for real - or worse someone else has done it and also ran it ragged - and it will be outside warranty so any parts or user induced failure will be expensive and difficult to find someone to repair and for them to find good parts.

The fastest laptops at the high end are the newest ones, and if you stay at the cutting edge you will put up with design and production issues until they work the kinks out. I usually wait 6 months before buying a new laptop if I can to avoid those problems, at least I do now - before now I used to enjoy spending time finding and fixing those problems, now I just want a reliable laptop that is top performance.

You have a lot to learn, and if you don't feel comfortable now spending $2000-3000, buy a new $1000-1500 laptop with a 1050, 1050ti, or previous generation 1060 - watch out for cheap 1070's with the 2016 GPU bug.

Good luck, please come back and let us know what you bought, and how you like it.

 

Dude, it's pointless to upgrade what you have, just drive it until the wheels fall off and keep waiting till the prices of flagship models drop to $800 bucks, that'll happen by.......umm......never

 

Oh no, don't get me wrong. I've had my T420 for years. It's already been upgraded to the max, which isn't a whole lot People are modding the BIOS and putting ivy bridge CPU's in them, but I don't think it's wise considering how hot they already run with the I7-2620M which is the max they were designed to handle.

I just did the eGPU setup about a year ago and the whole thing cost me $150 to build, including a sweet case for everything. Totally worth it, even if just for adding re-sale value to the T420. It's still mint condition for the most part, even after nearly 3 years in my possession and heavy usage. Just some keys are fading, that's about all the "wear and tear" on it. It runs hot (during CPU intensive games) with the I7-2620M, about 85-90C sometimes, but I'm never concerned about it dying on me because parts are so ridiculously cheap. I've done hundreds upon hundreds of hours of encoding and it's still alive & well. I did put Artic Silver 5 on the CPU/GPU when I first got it. But I switched to Kryonaut last year, though it didn't make much of a difference... I did recently pick up an Oplar LC05 "vacuum" style laptop cooler. It works surprisingly well actually! It dropped my max temps down to 80C! 15C is a big difference. But I still don't think it's worth upgrading to the Ivy Bridge CPU's because the PCI Express ports are fairly limited when it comes to the transfer rate for the eGPU anyway.

But it's fast as hell for basic things & still gives me good frame rates on medium settings for most games, and low on the more stringent. Honestly Doom 4 is what has made me want to finally upgrade; because it won't handle something that intense at all. But I can wait at least a year to see if the 427 model develops any longer-term issues, and they will surely drop a good bit in price regardless when the next series of GT's come out.

I'd also like to purchase from the best-of-the-best supplier possible (which seems to be HID), so I'd have to wait at least 4-5 months to get all the cash together instead of getting financing through eBay like I had planned. Might as well wait another 4-6 months at that point to get a SERIOUS discount when the prices start to drop off a good bit. Undoubtedly they will as technology is consistently advancing at a very fast rate. Clearly my estimate of them dropping to $800 was jokingly exaggerated. But stuff does drop in price pretty rapidly regardless of brand over the years.

Just because I'm overly cautious, doesn't mean I am stupid or uneducated. I started out being taught how to use, build & repair computers back in 1996. I got my Comp Tia A+ certification in 2003, though it was starting to almost not matter by that point anyway. That being said, I have solid skills with soldering, diagnosing almost all PC problems, repairing both laptops & PC's. I was at one time very fluent in over 9 programming languages including HLA. I have also done in-home tech support on the side for extra cash for most of my adult life. That being said, I will admit that I am a bit of the loop when it comes to todays companies reliability, quality control, and when it comes to the latest & greatest hardware. I just recently learned about NVMe SSD's. I've been fairly content with my little T420 and haven't done any tech support for the last several years and have been working a non-tech related job, so yes, I am out of touch, and in the tech industry there is always more to learn, as things are constantly evolving. I by no means think I know everything, nor will I ever.

I haven't been a "dedicated" gamer since the days of old-school runescape 1, diablo II, and warcraft III though. I did get addicted to Black Ops for a while, but it didn't last long. I've been far too busy with life to have time for games. Times are changing though and I'm a good bit more stable, albeit still on a pretty tight budget.

However, I'm not "scared" to run the laptop as it's supposed to be, but I am overly cautious when it comes to long-term heat exposure. Cooler the better is my motto. My fears not may be justified, but hey, we all have some irrational fears. Like spiders, snakes, bugs, etc. Mine is heat damage with extremely expensive electronics lol Call me crazy! I would under-volt it a bit, I just thought that MSI modded the bios to make it impossible, which I admit I found extremely odd... I just hadn't looked into it yet as I wasn't concerned to that extent because of it having such an over-built cooling system.

The GT73VR is a beast, I don't think anyone would argue that! It is more than capable of having very playable frame rates on any game with the stock settings. And it would be far better than anything I've ever had the pleasure to game on.

I totally get what everything you guys are saying. It was a rough morning
I want a GT73VR BAD! But dropping that kind of cash is stressful when there is any risk involved.

I have a unique mentality. I am overly cautious by nature. For example, I would never buy a brand new car released that same year. Regardless of how reliable a car manufacturer may be in general, they all occasionally produce models that are literally worthless piles of trash. Some much more frequently than others. Same goes for (just about any products,) and with any company. I feel this is especially true when it comes to laptops.

I honestly wouldn't trust any company to open up & modify my laptop more than myself. Even for something simple like a re-paste. So I have no desire/need to waste money on that. Though... it'd be nice to have them stress-test it before hand just to make sure it's functioning properly & so I don't have to send it right back. That is awesome that HID offers such services.

In my defense, when I said that ThinkPads are reliable, I said the old ThinkPads. I've not heard of many T420's being anything but absolutely bulletproof unless someone does something reaallly stupid with them. I'd be just as concerned with getting a newer model ThinkPad workstation (if not more) than buying a GT73VR gaming laptop, even when generally workstations are more durable & well built than gaming laptops AND according to many sources, Lenovo has a much better recent history than most companies.

The only real concerns I have with the GT73VR is them developing problems after the 1-3 year warranty period and dying... I am a bit of a conspiracy theorist as well, and believe that many companies don't care what happens to the laptops after that, and don't design them to last longer than 1-3 years... hence why they don't warranty even serious defects after 1 year. The random hardware issues/flaws people often mention, the hinges, and the keyboard are also mild concerns. Where you think 6 months is a good waiting time, I believe that a year to year and a half minimum is better. But there is always some level of risk. But this is why I'm so stressed out about dumping that much cash so early after the laptop has been released.

I also have not been able to find out how many units have been produced/purchased, and if you look around, there are loads of bad reviews, even on amazon the model 427 only has 3.6 starts out of 5. Granted there are only 27 reviews, but those stats are off to a terrible start. People on amazon for the most part love to give good reviews, even on **** products... so I find this troubling. I highly doubt that this is due to "bad sellers. More likely it's due to manufacturing defects. If it's shipping related damage, well then these things are far too fragile... which wouldn't be a problem in my case, as I'd never drop it or hardly ever take it out of my home. But seriously, they should be able to survive shipping.



I was actually thinking it might be fun to build a semi-mobile unit (without a battery) and 100% desktop components. With all the micro atx motherboards available, it wouldn't be hard or expensive to do. I know how to work with ABS and could build myself a case very cheap. It'd not look near as good, and it'd be one huge machine, but it'd be functional & unique and a lot of fun to build. I'm not out to impress, I just want quality. And it'd be upgradeable. That being said, it's probably just a fun project I'll do in the future, I'll probably still get the GT73VR soon enough. We shall see what happens.

 

I read your post and your fears are COMPLETELY unwarranted.
A laptop dying 1-3 years after the warranty expires can happen to ANY LAPTOP. Any. Or none. And there is no such thing in the world as buying a laptop that is 100% utterly guaranteed to last 5 years without breaking. If one lasts 5 years, you got lucky. Look at desktops. People have motherboards, RAM, videocards (especially), power supplies, or sometimes, but least likely (almost never) CPU's fail after 1-2 years. It happens. You need to stop letting OCD control you or you are going to be handicapped through life in ways far worse than a laptop dying.

In some cases, you can buy an extended warranty, but that's it.

It sounds to me like with your way of thinking, you're better off just buying a Clevo P870 TM1 (the 3 fan version with possible SLI support, but installed with single card (upgrading to SLI later in that case would require you buying the SLI heatsink), with the desktop delidded 8700K CPU. That way, you're covered until the end of warranty AND, AND, if the laptop motherboard dies AFTER The warranty expires, then you can REMOVE the CPU, put it into a desktop motherboard and use it there, and (Possibly) buy a MXM riser adapter card and use the GTX 1080 on a desktop (or, more sensibly, just buy the freaking current Nvidia card and sell the 1080). Or, see if HID will do a out of warranty repair for you for a fee. I mean if you're THAT worried....

I'm telling you right now, your fears are completely utterly irrational. It's the EXACT SAME THING As being afraid to take an airplane trip because you're afraid the airplane will crash, and you want 100% complete assurance the airplane won't crash.....

And btw---just to let you know:
Trying to wait for 2 years for the MSI GT73VR to drop in price and then buying from HID then WON'T WORK. BECAUSE THAT MODEL (AND GT75VR) WILL BE DISCONTINUED AND THEY WON'T HAVE IT ANYMORE. So there.

So, you have TWO choices. Rather you have THREE choices now. YOU choose what to do:

1) buy GT75VR (not GT73VR) with GTX 1080 and 7820HK. Just do it. You get the 3ms screen instead of the 5ms screen (smearing should be reduced), and a FULL PER KEY RGB short throw mechanical keyboard (while not as good as the Cherry mechs on the GT80 Titan or GT83VR SLI, still the best keyboard otherwise possible on a laptop now). Stop whining about what-ifs and buy it. Get 32GB of the fastest RAM they sell, a 1 TB SSD (IF you can afford it, if not, 512MB), GET THE 30 DAY DEAD PIXEL GUARANTEE, AND MINIMIZE BACKLIGHT BLEED, and Thermal repasting service. whether to do LM repaste on CPU or Kryonaut (or whatever the best non LM paste they have) is up to you. And ENJOY your laptop. There may be issues with the WIRED adapter since it's brand new (unlike the traditional Killer Nic in the older GT73 and previous laptops), which can be sorted out by drivers; contact HID with any issues so they can escalate it to MSI/Killer/Altheros for fixing.

(My advice: Don't buy GT73VR now that GT75VR is out).

2) buy Clevo P870 TM1, (the 3 fan SLI capable version), with single card GTX 1080, buy the LM de-lid +repaste service for the CPU. Kyronaut or best non LM paste on the GPU, dead pixel and minimize light bleed services, 32 GB RAM, largest SSD you can afford, and off you go and ENJOY YOUR LAPTOP. When Prema bios becomes available for this model, HIDEvolution will remotely flash upgrade it for you so you can then fully overclock the system IN THE FUTURE to the maximum without any power system throttling.

3) Don't buy anything because nothing will ever be what you want anyway.

Decide between 1 or 2. Your call.

 

Wow man your first option would cost me $3,243.00
That is way beyond what I am willing to dish out on a laptop. My max budget is $2,2000, I repeat: max. And that's with eBay financing and paying it off over a 6 month to 1 year period. I could care less about a 2MS increase in refresh rate, that isn't even humanly possible to be noticeable... The keyboard is nice but not worth $600 more. I'd rather just use a wireless mouse + keyboard for gaming anyway.

I could pick up a model 427 from XoticPC and still have a 1 year (free) warranty against manufacturer defects for $2000. AND I can get it financed, and be able to drop the $800 I have now, and pay off the rest over a few months... I can re-paste my CPU/GPU myself, and if it voids the 1 year warranty, than I'd just avoid that until the year is over anyway. I am 100% capable of doing a proper paste job with liquid metal...

I am fully aware that my fears are unwarranted. But that doesn't make them just go away either. Maybe you'd understand if $3,243.00 was close to all you can save each year after bills. Would you really toss away an entire years savings towards playing games on something that you personally admit may die for no good reason regardless how you take care of it? Seems ridiculous to me.

Yes there is always risk. I am sure even the T420's had an occasionally defective unit. My point is, that was an EXTREMELY rare occurrence. And like the other fellow said, if you want to stay on the bleeding edge of technology (which I don't, at most I just want a good new laptop upgrade every 4-6 years at most.) There will still be brand-new units still available in 2-3 years that more than likely will be guaranteed against defects for a year, just like they are now, even if HID won't have them, someone will.

Honestly most of the stuff HID has to offer, besides fancing engraving & wrapping option, I can do myself with ease. So it's honestly just a waste of money. The only thing I'd have them do, like I said in my previous looonggg post, is to stress test the laptop before I purchase it so I don't end up with a defective unit from day 1. Other than that, I'd rather wait till the warranty is out and do the rest myself. Yea sure I might not get a "perfect screen..." oh well. It's still going to be awesome even if there's a couple pixels that aren't perfect. It's not worth $100+ extra (to me at least.)

 

You could say this guy has "fears" of buying a new laptop as well, or could say he has wisdom grown from having lot of experience with buying laptops that are brand-spanking new off the line and has personally experienced that they often have "kinks."

I don't like Kinks. I can fix kinks. But kinks aren't always cheap to fix.

I'm a broke ass honky. Always have been, always will be. I didn't want to do what I was talented with and be forced to sit at a desk all day, every day, designing boring commercial websites, or debugging applications.

 

after reading many long posts of yours here are my 2 cents

I live in a country where MSI has no representation.

I bought GT73 (1080) last year in Sep from USA via a friend and he brought it in, my laptop has only local warranty and if anything happened to it, I have to send it to USA to my friend first for RMA and shipment will cost me $900 (both ways)

I did some big upgrade myself, like replaced stock RAM with HyperX (which required full tear down), 2 512GB NVMe, 1TB SSD and 4TB mechanical (with little mod and 1TB removed)

Done all re pasting and re-padding myself, all thermal grizzly stuff, minus 8 pads, kyro and conductanout

Lapped CPU HS because it has some scratches on contact surface (when did first re-paste)

Connected 3 external displays (I need them for work not for gaming)

After 1 year and nearly 2 months, laptop working flawlessly, in mint condition......

and overall it costed me above $3500 so far, money doesn't grow on trees for anyone...

 

That's what I like to hear man. Glad it's working well for you still & nothing has broke. Thanks for the input. I definitely trust someone more that can do their own upgrades vs. having to pay to have them done.

How are the laptops keys? Is any of the lettering fading away?

 

I haven't touched the keyboard (may be used it twice or thrice), it's brand new, covered with dust cover, I use external kb and mouse due to external monitors setup...not possible to use laptop keyboard

Nobody here in this thread ever reported any letters fading away, I'm following this thread since day one.

 

I was kinda thinking about doing the same thing just to retain it's value if I do end up pulling the trigger and getting one. But that's odd no one reported it. I read several reviews elsewhere that said they started to fade after 3-6 months. I figure most gamers are probably more inclined to use an external mechanical keyboard...

 

See if you can expand your budget slightly higher than $2200.
TBH you do NOT want the HM175 chipset version of the GT73VR. Nor do you want the TERRIBLE 7700HQ version. If you want a laptop to be viable 3 years (since you DO want to game on it), you want the 7820HK version.

You don't want the HM175 version because it does NOT come with the headphone hi-fi sabre dac. The hifi dac DOES improve sound quality considerably (just think of phones that have hi-fi dacs like the Korean version of the LG G6, or I believe their current V30+). The problem is the CM238 version of the GT73VR is discontinued, and unless HID has available stock of it, you won't get Hifi Dac unless you go with GT75VR now. MSI did this on purpose.

I'm aware you have a budget. If you have a budget you also do NOT need to buy a laptop RIGHT NOW this very day. Why not save up a bit more and get the specs that would make you even happier and get you more legs? You can't possibly have anyone believe you can never, ever get another dime saved up for such a big purchase. It's something you expect to last for years, right? Then do it the right way and don't cheap out on components.

I know how much you don't want to open the laptop, but in your case, get the GT75VR + GTX 1070 version. Grab a 256GB SSD+1GB HDD, 32 GB of RAM (get 32 GB or you will regret it; ask HIDevolution to verify that all four RAM Dimms are matching, but decide if you want 2x16GB or 4x8GB (these must match; do not mix Kingston with Hynix and have HID verify this. TRUST ME), then upgrade the SSD in the future when you have more cash.

Then when you decide you want moar powa, you can TDP hardware mod the GTX 1070 from the (stock) 115W to 185-190W safely, repaste with Grizzly Kryonaut, and gain around 15-20% higher performance, which IS noticable in games (with this mod, you can actually exceed the 3dmarks of some lower spec GTX 1080's if you overclock the core and vRAM). Of course you don't HAVE to do it, but as you saw with your previous laptop, eventually you want to push it to extend its viable gaming piower.

 

may be but with 17" screen and considering the weight (along with scary articles how laptop heat can destroy man genital) high possibility of use an external kb

to me this laptop is kind of desktop,how I use it like, I open the lid, press power button and laptop runs straight 10 to 12 hours, external KB, Mouse, 10 ports USB hub connected, day end, shut it down, close the lid.

I second @Falkentyne, wait little more, do not buy right away, highly chances MSI will release new GT series in Jan 2018 with coffee Lake which will bring down the prices of Sky Lake and Kaby Lake models.

@DukeCLR @Atma

what you guys say about keyboard letters fading away, since you guys are also using laptop more than a year

 

any help?

 

Ehh.. I dunno man. $3000 is a lot. That's without an extended warranty.

I could get the same specs with the GT73VR, minus the "audiophile grade audio" for $1000 less. For $2600 I could get the same AND a 3 year warranty through HID. I can't justify $1000 more for better audio + keyboard.

 

You'll notice everyone is suggesting buy the newest release laptop model or wait for an even newer one

"No one" wants to order the "last generation" model, even with current CPU and components. It's in their nature.

With the GT73 you get a "tried and true" model, well past it's production glitches - and it should give you the same performance as a GT75 with the same GPU / CPU. Get a 7820HK model, it's worth it while you own it, and for resale down the road.

Like you said you don't want to buy the newest, you want something with the bugs worked out.

 

Hmscott and I are two different people with two different value systems agendas, but there is no flaw in his advice for what he needs. You, as a normal user, would not be disappointed if you bought the "Current" nerfed GT73VR with HM175, even though you are getting a downgrade (no hifi, downgraded Killer Nic(?), downgraded Killer wifi (unless you choose to buy the Intel 8265 upgrade), however there are "issues" that serious overclockers MIGHT run into on the GTX 1080 version of the HM175 based GT73VR (the GTX 1070 version would never be able to pull enough power):

If you look on MSI's current "global" site (not US.msi.com), you will see the "GT73EVR" system--this is the "nerfed" Gt75VR with HM175 chipset. What you need to notice directly is that there is a different EC fimware for this version. 17A1EMS1.112. Yet the CM238 version uses 17A1EMS1.108. The actual mainboard is identical otherwise (they use the same system Bios). Yet, 17A1EMS1.112 works just fine if you flash it on a CM238 chipset version. So why don't BOTH versions use .112? After all, .112 is newer than .108, right?

Well, first, I do not know if 17A1EMS1.108 will work if flashed on the HM175 chipset version. Most likely it WILL work (hell I flashed the skylake (6820hk version) based 17a1EMS1.105 on the kaby lake version, and that worked, except my CPU was hard capped to 45W TDP, since obviously the kaby lake system ID was not present in that EC), but if you look on MSI's website, one thing you will notice is that there is NO SLI version of the GT73EVR. This means that there is no "460W" power allowance code available in the EC, since, on the CM238 version, the GTX 1070, GTX 1070X2 and GTX 1080 all use the same mainboard and share the same EC version, so there has to be a provision for 460W to be allowed to the system. What I found with 17A1EMS1.112 is, if you exceed 330W of total system AC power draw, the CPU gets hard capped to 800 mhz (as if BD Prochot were triggered on, except there is no BD prochot nor power limit flag being visibly set). It just...sets the CPU to 800 mhz. And it sets it to 800 mhz even if there is barely any load on the CPU to begin with!!

I was able to "mimic" this, even though the most amount of REAL power I was able to draw by force was 315W system (350W from the wall; this has nothing to do with the EVR; I was just trying to see if it was possible for a 185W TDP GTX 1070 to exceed system total power of 330W--it's not, although a stock 1080 + OC CPU+AVX load MIGHT be able to do it), by doing something simple and easy:

Setting (in the unlocked Bios), PSYS PMAX=2700 (translates to 337W), and then putting a simple GPU load on the system like running Valley Benchmark.
BAM: CPU is instantly locked to 800 mhz. At something like PSYS PMAX=2400 (330W), this didn't happen. (Psys Pmax wattage is value divided by 8).

Just to make sure I wasn't seeing things, I tried the exact same thing on 17A1EMS1.108, and even though HWinfo64 reported a rediculous system power draw, the CPU happily ran at full speed.
So clearly it was the EC seeing and acting on a "fake" power draw higher than 330W and cutting power to the CPU.

I would hate for someone to try to TDP hardware mod their GTX 1080 to, let's say, 250W, overclock their 7820HK on the GT73EVR with a high combined load, and then suddenly wonder why their CPU is suddenly at 800 mhz. Even if the CM238 version tries to Power Limit 2 the CPU if you exceed 330W, 45W TDP limit via PL2 is a hell of a lot better than 800mhz.

I don't like to be limited by things if I don't HAVE to be, even if they don't affect me right now. It's very uncomfortable to know there is some giant elephant in the room somewhere.....but that's just me. And that's my opinion. And I live and die by my own choices.

 

I tried 17A1EMS1.112 on my taptop and it causes CPU Throttling, didn't even bother to check the GPU so I went back to .108

 

This. I've had this GT73 for 1 year exactly. This is the longest I've owned a laptop. That should tell j00 enough. My name is Phoenix, some call me, Mr. OCD. so j00 get the picture, if I keep a laptop for a year, it's like a super awesome laptop. Even the Clevo Desktop replacements that I had like hte P870DM and P870DM3 didn't last for more than 6 months then I sold them

MSI Gaming Laptops FTW, this is one company that knows how to make quality laptops backed up by good drivers and BIOS

 

Despite some glitches when I got it, and a few trips to the laptop hospital, My GT73 with the 1070 and 6820HK is still going strong and still runs anything I throw at it. It runs about 11 hours a day 7 days a week without a hiccup.

 

This is exactly why I'm worried about people buying the HM175 chipset version of the GT73VR with a GTX 1080.
I've only seen a FEW people who even have the GT73EVR and they all seem to have the 1070 version.
But because the hardware is 100% identical except for downgraded Killer NIC and no hifi board, and the different chipset, flashing 17A1EMS1.112 on a CM238 version should make it function just like an EVR.

I can't under any sort of conscience recommend a system that would throttle on a GTX 1080 due to different restrictions on the EC.

Now I'll tell you this. And this is maybe where HMscott got his original information.

There were 7700HQ and HM175 chipset versions before the release of the "nerfed" GT73"EVR" (i do NOT know if these older versions used CM238 with the 7700HQ, or HM175 with .108 EC and 7820hk or even 6820hk, but I do know that these versions were not sold in USA) of the GT73VR even BEFORE this .112 EC was released, and I bet you they all used 17A1EMS1.108, which means, no CPU throttling unless you had a 7700HQ (45W TDP). Until someone can actually find out this mystery with scientific testing, I can not under any good conscience recommend ANYONE buy the HM175 version, if Phoenix had CPU throttling out of nowhere. I never encountered CPU throttling unless i set up that PSYS_PMAX value, and I believe I was only using 170W TDP on my GTX 1070 also.

I also wouldn't exactly call the Bios "Good."
The black screen bug STILL exists (a bug with the "Auto" PEG enabled setting, actually), under some soft reset conditions, where it fails to initialize the eDP outputs if you switch from iGPU to dGPU under some conditions (One way to ALWAYS, ALWAYS Trigger this is to set spread spectrum from 50 to a lower value (like 0) to get 100.00 mhz instead of 99.750, then switch to iGPU then back to dGPU-->black screen (have to CMOS reset with 45 second power button press or do a blind hotkey reboot with the GPU switch button via GPU button->alt tab ->tab->spacebar), and that was a VERY major bug which caused no small number of RMA's, until people learned how to reset CMOS (without removing RAM sticks).

Whether this bug was fixed in .31B is unknown. Setting primary PEG (in the unlocked Bios) to enabled instead of Auto fixes this permanently.

 

yeah and that was with the same settings. j00 see, for me, I only change the VR Current limit from 0 to 400 in the BIOS, which translates to 100A in XTU (because the BIOS value is divided by 4) and that takes care of the throttling for me.

PS: Make sure you disabled the Intel SW Guards Extension, it causes a lot of adverse effects like mouse stuttering. It's hidden somewhere, if you can't find it, you know the drill

 

The 17A1EMS1.112 "800 mhz" CPU throttle doesn't even appear in Throttlestop under Limit Reasons. It's like the EC just forces the multiplier to 8.
BTW i was editing my last post when you replied, so I tried to add some more information.

I just don't want another user to be a guinea pig and buy a 'EVR'+1080 based HM175 and find that his CPU throttles under full combined heavy load.

 

The black screen bug is long gone after the latest BIOS and resetting everything to factory defaults then starting over again

 

Well I've received the GT73VR 7RE Titan SLI 4K replacement as of yesterday, and so far with the limited testing that I could do at work and at home last night it seems to be fine with the exception of temps.

The 7820HK runs HOOOOOOOT! Like, 93C hot... But no restarts and no white screen/no video out after (so far!). The primary 1070 also runs quite hot as well - 83 to 85C. Secondary hovers around 74C.

Did a complete repaste just a little bit ago and the CPU temps are the same at 4.2GHz, but I was able to undervolt by 100mV which brought the temps down to 88C max in XTU's benchmark. It appears the stock CPU voltage was about 1.325V according to HWInfo64. The GPUs are now both in the mid 70C range.

So, even without the - 100 mV undervolt, I can't seem to get anything higher than 4.2GHz working with XTU's benchmark (BSOD and reboot). Should I just use Prime95 26.6 or AIDA for testing instead of XTU? I just game on this laptop, no video encoding or other AVX instruction usage that I know of.

Edit: 4.2GHz and -100 mV wasn't stable in Prime95 26.6's default test (blend iirc), so I backed it off to -75 mV, and I'm still averaging 1.152 V on all cores with a max of 1.274 V on the worst core. Still seeing about 85C on the hottest core, and 80C on the coolest. I did up the turbo boost window to the max of 96 seconds and the CPU max amps to 100, the default of 75 was causing current throttling even when set it to 400 (100A) in the BIOS.

 

@Arestavo
Can you attach a HWinfo64 screenshot of the VID and voltages shown when you are using the XTU benchmark? Make sure min and max are shown with idle and full load.

Is the BSOD a "Whea uncorrectable error" or a "processor interrupt" error (BSOD code 101 or 124?)
Are you using "Cooler boost 100%" when doing these stress tests or auto fans?

Always use cooler boost 100%.
I suspect the BSOD is from overheating, but we're going to have to run some tests to be sure.
You should not be at 1.325v at just 4.2 ghz. I can do 4.8 ghz at that voltage (requires some Bios sorcery though). Your VID range at 4.2 ghz should be between 1.05v to 1.25v, not higher.

 

There's nothing wrong with 4.2ghz on your 7820HK as you describe it. Some CPU's have different characteristics than others. 4.2ghz @ -100mV with 80c's temps is good on stock paste.

The 6820HK mostly was stable at 4.0ghz as were the Broadwell CPU's. I could get them higher with positive voltage (overvolt), but then they get real hot real quick, even with 100% fan's running.

You might play with the fan curve and have it ramp up higher on lower temps, tune it for what you want - low temps or low noise.

Also, note that when first ramping up a benchmark, the CPU fan's won't react quickly, and you will get spike in temperature initially, but as the fan's ramp up for longer runs the temperature will come down.

For p95 small FFT, even on a good cooling laptop you can experience thermal throttling point being hit in the first few seconds before the fans ramp up. So I wait a few seconds and click the hwinfo clean/reset button and take temperatures from when the fans are fully ramped up - when I run auto fans - otherwise I run 100% fans for a minute before starting a test and for a while afterwards to get the CPU temp back down to the original low starting temperature before I start another test run.

So either run full fan's all the time, or run auto fan and reset the hwinfo readings after the fans and temperature stabilize lower.

Also, as you go up in frequency you'll need to drop the undervolt, say from -150mV at stock, to -100mV at 4.2ghz, and 0mV to -40mV at 4.3/4.4/4.5ghz.

I'd just start gaming at 4.2ghz @ -100mV and enjoy it for a while. That's a good every day setting. Even though I got up to 4.5ghz and benchmarked, it's not something I would run every day.

Take time to make sure all the rest of the parts are working, like keyboard / trackpad as you like them - customize them - and test all the ports functionality to make sure you don't need to return it within the return period.

Temps seem fine, you just need more time on it to experiment and tune it.

 

Have a quick question for you guys I looked over internet and found nothing to answer my question.

So the gtx 1080 has a core speed of 1556mhz and boost of 1733mhz.

What determines when the cars goes into boost mode?

And my next question, when you over click the speed, say u move slider to 200. Does that mean the boost speed then becomes 1933mhz? Or does it always run at max speed?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Copy, thank you both for the tips. I am running auto fans since I am at work and don't want to piss of the folks in the same room.

Tomorrow morning I'll see if max fans can let me get higher than 4.2GHz at stock voltage, but I'm doubtful as it BSODed with auto fans.

As far as the BSOD code, I couldn't tell as it did a 10% or 20% write, then shut off before I could read further.

 

Check your PM.

 

Anyone update the BIOS https://www.msi.com/Laptop/support/GT73VR-7RF-Titan-Pro.html#down-bios ?

 

Read before and after the post from bro @Phoenix. Afterwards don't forget to install INF-only driver v11.7.0.1045

 

but it contains a exe file only!

 

Hi Guys!

I need a help. I wanna update my samsung 950 pro m.2 drive firmware.

I cannot update under raid.

I cannot change the raid mode to ahci mode because if I change it my laptop not booting anymore I can not do anything with that not even to enter to the bios.

I have to remove all drive ( ssd, and m.2 drive ) after that I can enter to the bios, and switch back to raid mode everything boot normaly again.

It happening after every bios update too bacause the new bios default setting is ahci mode.

If I remove the samsung 950 pro m.2 drive I can change the raid to ahci, but if I install agan before change back to raid mode I get bios bootloop.

Anybody else have this problem too?


My Config is: Msi GT73VR 6RF
Bios E17A1IMS.10C

 

Anyone else have limited throughput, about 450 mbps, when using a wired connection for LAN file transfers? My 7RE replacement seems to be artificially limited, and updating the Killer driver to the latest on their website didn't change a thing.

Tonight I'll try a reboot of the router, and then I'll try plugging directly into the 10gBe switch to see if that changes anything - bit I've got a feeling that it's just the crappy Killer NIC.

FWIW, the wireless card is the 1535 model, and the laptop model is the GT73VR 7RE Titan SLI -423. I'm 95% sure that the wired NIC is also Killer.

 

It sounds like your best bet is to update each one in a desktop PC, either in a built in m.2 NVME slot or with a PCIE adapter card.

Or try it from a Linux Live CD, or install Windows on a spare external drive while the 950 Pro RAID 0 is set to ACHI mode and update it from that installation.

 

Why do you want to update? Does the new firmware fix an issue you're having? If not, why risk the headache?

 

Can't test wired throughput here. AT&T Uverse only has 45 mbps download here, so I have no way to test more. I was able to briefly use a wired connection at a community college and got 100 mbps; if you're getting 450 mbps you're a much better man than me!

I'm using the basic microsoft drivers however (The Intel 8265 has the Intel driver).

 

Haha, no, sorry - LAN performance. I submitted a ticket to the Killer folks to see what they say.

Although a few months back I did try the Gig service that CableOne offers, and they could only get me ~600 mbps during normal usage hours (after 2AM I could just about get a full gig). It was too expensive, and rather pointless with their small 1TB data cap.

 

I use an Razer orbweaver for gaming so I don't put the keyboard through what many others have but after a year my keyboard is just fine.