GT72/GT72S and GT80/GT80S Owners GPU Upgrade Discussion

okay

okay
thank you..

 

Actually I got answered a few days ago on my personal email from a Msi guy with an Asian name (exactly like it appended to someone else), saying that I will kept updated by them asap.
Nothing new really (for now).

Really curious on the pricing from gt72 to gt72vr. Hope the mystery will be unfolded soon


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

Interesting. I still haven't received a personal email from that mysterious Asian guy.

 

No man, TGP is the same, what power draw are you talking about, it's a standard (MXM) + it develops the SAME TGP.
1060 === 970M
1070 === 980M
1080 === 980 Desktop

Even the PSU is the same for the GT72 and the GT72VR, what power req are you talking about ? Or may be you are believing the B******it of MSI saying that "power requirements arent the same" so just buy new laptop with the same mobo and form factor.. Because I dont believe any word of it.. They didnt show even a simple technical explanation to the targeted community (i.e., us : People who actually knows what an MXM GPU is).

So different power requirements for a die shrink and what else ? the keyboard isnt compatible with the new speed of Pascal so throw your 1 year old laptop (monthes for some of us) ?

 

That's like saying Ivybridge is the same as haswell....

 

That's basically not reading between the lines

I didn't say that Pascal === Maxwell, it's just that the power requirements/specs should be similar and shall not require a MEGA/HUGE reform like MSI claims it. Especially when we know that the GT72VR is the GT72 downgraded (mux/SSD ports etc.).

btw, Haswell is not an Ivy Bridge die shrink Ivy Bridge is Sandy's DS. FYI, many mobos that handled Sandy's could also support Ivy's.

 

Something tells me that John knows that.

But in any case, identical TDPs does not necessarily mean that a system capable of cooling one can cool the other. Power delivery, yes, assuming that peak draws remain similar. But two 150W dies can reach very different temperatures depending on the surface area, since the rate of energy transfer is proportional to the contact area.

 

Well, there is actually no need to read between the lines because the same argument is posted across a vast many threads.

I didn't say they were = either. Just using it as an example.

Sorry, but that is where you are wrong. Pacal and other underlying requirements require a new motherboard. Sorry, but MSI is not the only one hit by this. Everyone is hit by this.
And a GT80 can not handle two 1070N's or two 1080N's. That is evident with the low marks it puts up all over the internet with two 980N's.@330W

Going BGA is a downgrade, but then that is neither here nor there. So dies shrinks this and that really mean more heat to me. Nothing more.

And that is why I used Ivy as the example, since it was the last chip. Just like 980M last mobile under Maxwell. Had I used Sandy you would have mentioned Ivy.

 

may I ask, what exactly causes the upgrade requiring a new motherboard?

 

Going with my best guess.....California. And since most of these companies have residence in this state...I'm thinking they have to adhere to it.
Along with Pascal and new technology.
You can start here, then go out and broaden your search to start getting more in depth analysis of things. This is not new, just not apparently top breaking news for some reason.
http://www.sacbee.com/news/business/technology/article70941087.html

http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/sdut-computer-efficiency-regulation-2016aug03-story.html

I'm am not here to debate it so i'm not here to argue that it shouldn't make a difference in current technology, but it is why Intel and everyone else is slowly following suit. Some just tried to wait it out longer than others since it's not a law yet, but no one wants to get hit with fines and sanctions for not being prepared. But it also means these companies lose out in revenue big time if it does pass.

So i'm thinking with each gen gpu they get more performance under the same amount of watts to keep in line with unseen public proposed regulations.

Speculations of course.

 

Got it but, here we have the same GT72 case, same radiator (which you can offer if it's not), same die size.. those secret power requirements are really shady and dark hahaha...
MSI promised something, they should explain at least why they can't, and properly.

 

I know for sure that the GT80S requires more power and new motherboard because it has the 2 GPU's in SLI not sure about the GT72

 

Didn't the GT72 come with a 230W psu? Or no?

 

Sorry, but no. I'm a big boy, and I don't need to waste a few weeks waiting for MSI to swap in some RAM and storage drives, when my own hands can do it in under an hour.

Just as they do now, they can say they won't cover it if I break something. I'm not worried about that.

Sending it to MSI would hurt more paying Geek Squad $50 to switch a stick of RAM.

Yes all 980 and below GT72 have the 230W.

 

And they wont allow you guys to run 2 230W psu's correct?

 

If I owned a laptop that couldn't draw enough power to maintain use of it's advertised specs I'd be demanding a refund under consumer law. Sounds like 980 SLI GT80 owners already should have mounted a class action over a defective product.

I'm not sure the "power" excuse is anything to do with load power or tdp or anything like that. GPUs have been sold downclocked to meet heat/power targets previously. Maybe it's something else in power regulation circuitry. If it is MSI and anyone else should just come out and be straight. Blame nVidia if it's their decisions that have forced MSI instead of saying silent.

Then the discussion could shift to whether MSI was negligent in making a promise of long term upgradeability which they hadn't ensured from nVidia was a technical certainty.

Sent from my Redmi Note 3 using Tapatalk

 

Well, in the beginning they were pretty much fine with the idea until they found out that there was even more to be had. And that came by way of a Clevo running dual 980N's with a much better score, but that came at a serious cost of heat and dual 330W PSU's maxing out somewhere around 800W+
So there is always that reason why they decided to stick with the 230W psu And locked the motherboard down as such.

Also, it has nothing to do with nvidia or intel for that matter. They would just assume keep making power hungry products for the masses.
Speculations of course.

 

Yeah, I was never fine with that nonsense. I originally filed a dispute, but realized that the only person it would be hurting is the reseller. Pretty sure that's why MSI refuses to deal directly with end users.

 

So why did you buy it? You got it around February right? Machine came out in December. And people were already talking about the 1 psu would not be enough.

And you did not buy it from MSI, you bought it from the reseller. They are the ones who take up your case with MSI. Unless you are sent directly to MSI on an rma.
If you buy from MSI or you are past the 14 to 30 day retail store warranty/return, then you deal with MSI directly. With resellers it's different. They are the ones purchasing your unit from MSI....

Edit: Nevermind...You bought because of the upgrade path.
Which is kind of funny because people were talking about that last year as well and you know.....No one gave an answer on it then either.

 

Huh? I bought mine when it came out. I had cash down as early as November. I was part of the first batch shipped to PNB.

At 130W/GPU, 1 PSU should be enough at lower CPU loads, but MSI reused the same EC code as the 980M versions with incredibly conservative power limits and with throttling down to 105W per GPU at 30% battery.

 

Ah, my apologies! I had read the thread you started about the 9W power drain on the battery and that you tested for a month and a half. Then made a thread on it. My mistake.

130W is a guideline. When unconstrained it's closer to 200+ watts. 980M can run 200+ watts. And when over clocking 130w gets pushed to the side unfortunately...

Let me ask...Are these factory vbios files as well?

 

I know that 980s can pull quite a lot of power, but on the stock MSI VBIOS, power is hard capped at 137W. Plus I tested at fully stock clocks on both the CPU and GPU, so it's ridiculous that it still drained battery IMO.

 

You gets no argument out of me there. I think Dell was doing the same thing on some of their models, but not 100 percent sure.

 

What does all this have to do with the 970m GPUs? does the 137w cap effect performance in the GT80S with the 970m?Curious...

 

Not sure what you mean? We were talking about his GT80S with desktop 980 that was throttling down because of msi imposed limits.

As to the second part...I don't think so. As long as it's a single 970M it should stay within the working limits. SLI would be something different. That could potentially reach the throttle threshold....Speculation of course.

 

Let's keep the topic alive, guys. So I have a question here...
Can MSI actually force GT72(S) owners to take GT72VR as the only upgrade option?
I mean we'll surely get a new GPU as an upgrade in that case but how MSI is gonna compensate the actual downgrade (absence of a manual GPU switch, RAID and stuff like that)?
I think that trade-in for GT73VR shouldn't be off the table, that's just not right.

 

If the only option is the new GT72, I would want a direct swap with zero cost to me for the reasons stated. Oh and the strongest gpu it comes with is the 1070.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

I will only take a direct swap for my GT80S to GT83VR at no cost. I was waiting to buy a oculus rift or some other VR gear till the next gen GPU came out and upgrade my Titan. But now I'll settle for the direct swap an forgive them the second GPU 11xx upgrade. I believe that is fair. MSI will save having by not having to make the next gen GPU compatable with my GT80S and I'll be able to play VR games for a while. Ooo I'll get that new one who makes it? HTC? And it's suppose to be made for the GT series. Wait that's probably a lie too to get people to buy the GT83VR LOL

 

I don't think that is going to happen. There is going to be some kind of upgrade cost. The question is depending on what spec your laptop is is going to change how much the upgrade cost is going to be.

 

man, still no updates. Didn't they mention having an update first week of September? Are they going to wait till October 30th to announce the plan? 1 day before its too late to register lol

 

Well if it doesn't happen then I'm going to be on the class-action bandwagon because I feel it's fair don't you feel it's fair? Who is for an even trade not do you think they'll do it or not, who thinks that a even trade is fair?

 

That is just it, it is not fair to MSI. I understand that they promised 2 gens of upgrades hell that is why I bought mine. But I did that expecting to have to buy the upgrades. Having to pay some sort of upgrade price is logical. Now I agree that it can not be some super high retarded amount. But a fair price for all involved. Depending on what laptop you have and what they are upgrading to.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N915A using Tapatalk

 

OK if I have to pay I'll be wanting my second Upgrade what about that?

 

Again depending on what laptop you are upgrading. Since they are talking about trade in for both the 800 series and 900 series. The 800 series would have a larger trade in cost. The second upgrade is not relevant sincee the upgrade in ram and ssd space. Again assuming you get the top of the line system.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N915A using Tapatalk

 

I'm sorry but why would 800 series have a bigger trade in cost? Upgrade kits would cost the same for any model. The only difference is the value of our current GPUs but I think we should be able to keep them for reselling.

 

Well I have the GT80S with the 970M GPU and I would like exactly a straight across upgrade to 1070. so I bought my laptop this year so I think I'm entitled to second upgrade and that's fair for me. I understand that some people bought laptops last year and they have the 800 series GPU but in my case I have a 900 series. Why do people think somehow MSI deserves some kind of a break over all this?

 

That is why the 800 series would be more, depreciation. There not going to traded these systems in with out the video cards. As any good business they will refurbish them and sell them again.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N915A using Tapatalk

 

In that case they better value our current cards fairly. And we shouldn't really care if they're going to refurbish them or not.

 

I have the 980 desktop gpus in mine. So I totally understand peoples frustrations i spent almost 5k on my laptop. This is also not all MSI fault. Nvidea had some to do with it also. Regardless of that MSI did make the promise and do not deserve a break on this but they do deserve to try and make it right with the customer. With good business sense as well. Giving people free trade in is not good business. There is going to be a cost and there should be.

 

I totally agree. I do not care if they refurbish my system or not. But is would just make good sense to recoup some of the money they are going to loose with this trade in program. That is all I'm saying why I would think they will not let you keep the old video cards.

 

Well, keeping a good reputation is also good business, don't you think? I hope they keep that in mind too.

 

I completely agree that why we need to give them a chance to see what this trade in program is.

 

Forcing the upgrader to resell the GPU would be completely awful for people with the 980. It's usable in literally one system.

 

That's assuming you HAVE a trade program Europe (France) I'm talking about you

 

I don't think MSI is going to refurbish anything or resell anything. Someone will have to go through the laptops with some kind of quality control and that cost money, that will cut into resale costs. The big picture to me is MSI will want to put this behind them as quickly as possible. Any unused parts after the upgrade up to an entire laptop will be trashed. rework is expensive unless a facility specializes in it. Unless MSI subcontracts it to another company then because the contractor would recycle the material. Oops I think I gave them an idea to subcontract this whole thing to the lowest bidder...FRACK HAHAHA. We will get a lot of cheap materials in our upgrades and our GT's will run like crap after the upgrade.

 

You can just about guarantee that MSI is not using this thread for ideas . They know what they are going to do already. They just are dragging their heels to announce it .

 

Yea right... like they knew what they were going to do when they advertised upgradable GPU's? I have no confidence in anything that MSI is planning. They've already said that they looked at this particular thread and in this website and read all our complaints so they're obviously going to listen to what is said here. Come on look at the announcement for the upgrade program they specifically said that.

 

If MSI was coming to a solution any slower they would be going backwards.

Seriously,... MSI what the hell is taking so long?? Just announce the damn thing.

 

Part of the problem might be the lack of a GT83VR 1070 SLI shipping version, and other models that they want to include in the trade-in.

MSI needs stock available for the units they will offer in the Trade-in, and MSI only started shipping Pascal laptops recently, with not all models announced shipping in quantity.

A new GT83VR 1070 SLI owner just started posting to the GT83VR thread, and his scores on Futuremark Fire Strike are the first 1070 SLI scores reported:
http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...nvidia-gtx-1080s.794897/page-48#post-10344679

That's a good sign that MSI is getting closer to having stock on hand for all the models they want to offer us in the trade-in, hopefully we will hear something soon.

 

Wow his FPS is amazing! But I am more interested in temps