BGA Venting Thread ;)

As it stands, if my board/CPU goes out in the near future, it's almost certainly getting replaced with Ryzen.

 

For the desktop it's going to be a no brainer for a while.

 

Definitely for a Desktop. I'm excited to actually give AMD a try after being Pro-Intel for a while. Hoping to see them on a Sager Notebook to buy for myself in the future.

 

They have to have a viable platform to deliver that of course not just pick one vendor to release one model.

 

I would like all the vendors to give it a try, but I personally like the Sagers that I have been using so I would be a bit more eager to try and see how it would play out. I can dream!

 

With AMD's mobile CPUs/APUs lagging a generation behind it puts manufacturers in a tight spot, do they run with the desktop socket and make a big chunky (expensive) but extremely powerful performance notebook/DTR that'll only ever be a niche seller, or do they wait for 7nm mobile Zens whenever that will be?

I don't see much happening with interesting AMD notebooks for a while longer.

 

Yeah, IDK, manufacturers no know the cadence of release, and at least Asus and Acer will offer the "desktop" Ryzen 3.0 laptops (at launch?), and I would assume others will get clue that's what they should do too.

MSI is releasing the GT76 with an Intel desktop part, so MSI are already in the mindset to fit socketed CPU's in their laptops.

It could happen this Ryzen generation, lucky number 3.

 

When worse goes to even more worse... BGA is like an infectious disease.
http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...17-owners-lounge.826893/page-21#post-10919044


Alienware had a choice when they designed the refreshed 2019 models of their Alienware m15/17 R2 gaming books. But they rather prefered BGA in all form and shape in same way as the well known fruit-named company CrApple.

When will we see next step in welding technology from Dell and similar ODMs? One hint... Soldered on storage and Wifi module will be the BIG new in gaming laptops! What a sad move we now see in the nearest horizon.

Ps. My old post from 2017. Alienware needed 3 I mean 2 years to fulfill my prediction/divination about coming changes... But as you can see they easly surpassed my divination in hunt for thinnest possible notebooks. They couldn't even let you get a single ram slot for later upgrade. All aka both is welded on the MB now. Yeah, just sad see how far they are willing to go to destroy their own High end products. Of course they did the same for the bigger Alienware m17 r2. Because it use exactly the same Motherboard as they put into the smaller brother m15 r2.

 

Just when you think they've hit rock bottom already. They picked up that jackhammer and kept on digging.

It's like the South Park gnomes
Step 1: Solder the CPU, use thin heatsinks and reduce mounts, make it hotter
Step 2: Solder the RAM, claim it helps thermals
Step 3: Bolt in a new whoopy do but unreliable keyboard
Step 3: ???
Step 4: profit like apple

 

As I have mentioned many times, the rest of us will have nothing less than what the lowest common denominators are willing to put up with. There is no "bottom" because they're not done digging the hole.

How long will you lie down, O sluggard? When will you arise from your sleep? A little sleep, a little slumber, a little folding of the hands to rest, and poverty will come upon you like a robber, and want like an armed man.

 

Only Samsung and Micron now has huge LPDDR4 RAM ICs. So, they should provide 32/64GB as standard regardless of system specs. Anyway, new mobo now has CPU,GPU,SSD(BGA SSD in near future from all manufacturers),RAM,TB3 etc... What isn't soldered is external power brick and display panels.

 

Frank Azor confirms XPS 13 7390 will have soldered SSD, "not very different from smartphones today"

And Frank Azor the co-founder for the Alienware brand compare nowadays laptops with smartphones. They are just phones but in an bigger size.

 

@jaybee83 @bennyg @Mr. Fox More BGA SSD. I did tell this will be incoming. Looks like samples are acquired and GP testing is pending on 10K$ machine.

 

Will they have a recovery port to have some way of recovering data with a broken motherboard?

 

Not sure. Depends if there is enough space on the MB or the chassis. Could be they offer free Cloud storage equal the specs size on the soldered storage they will offer in this model.

The owners of this soldered mess should use a built-in media card reader for expanding storage he talked so nice about as backup for all their important files?

 

Perhaps there's a dongle?

 

BGA SSD? As if BGA RAM wasn't bad enough, man.
@Mr. Fox @Papusan
I guess the only thing left is BGA wifi right?

 

No, final result will be BGA everything with no expansion ports or bays. Total disposable hardware with no options for customizing.

 

Do you mean something like this?

 

Nope. Soldered on WiFi is already here. Can’t remember the notebook model which have it but I will post info about the notebook model later.

The next big after this will probably be soldered on heatsink No need for re-pasting anymore.

 

They might as well since you can't replace the filth underneath it anyway.

 

Here we go brother BGA Wireless card [Samsung]

Can you see that lovely small wifi card left for the fans? At least you get 2 ram slots in this Jokebook. You can even put in an single M.2 ssd.

 

Seems like the BGA cess pool is getting backed up by an increase in the volume of dung being deposited. Turdbooks are status quo now. It's too late to turn off the valve and people are getting used to the stench. It doesn't even bother some.

 

Intel already has soldered BGA Wifi applicable to some OEMs like Lenovo, Asus etc...

 

Wifi/BT is already integrated into the SoC for ultrabooks. For everything else it looks like Intel will be integrating WiFi6 into the PCH.

 

oh i got another great idea: how about integrated, soldered on PSUs? since power bricks are only covered by 6 months warranty, its the perfect excuse for manufacturers to cut down on the warranty, yay!

Sent from my Xiaomi Mi Max 2 (Oxygen) using Tapatalk

 

Apple used to have bolt on tabs for power in their cases, it was actually a very clean way of doing it.

 

Commodore did that for the external floppy drives. (Looking at you, 1541)

 

Never had a problem with the internal PSU on the 1541's, but I repaired a number of my school friend's 1541's for bad R/W head alignments with a dot of superglue including
my own 1541.

 

The entire commodore 64 was hot soldered trash.

 

magnificent!

you should be hired as the next lead designer for notebook for all OEMs, brilliant idea.

 

Im slightly mixed at the moment. Because of BGA the i7 4980hq with its eDRAM came into existence.

Now its been refabbed into LGA and rPGA packages and I now have the i7 4980hq installed in my t440p and it can punch up quite a bit as a result.

 

the only time when memory/ram is allowed to be soldered is when next 3d die stacking cpu becomes available. basically becoming as close to L4 as possible, wonder how they'll have to deal with the heat

 

It would be on package before stacked first most likely for the dense heat of a desktop CPU.

 

Looks like we are slowly heading back to the good old days then...

 

Now you making me feel old, however there is at least a class of laptop for me that isn't soldered crud. Thankfully with everything I do requires a Desktop Replacement Laptop, which seems LGA sockets are coming back but for how long I don't know.

Sent from my LLD-L31 using Tapatalk

 

For as long as there is money in selling them.

 

They had huge DIP sockets for some chips iirc

 

It's already here brother Falkentyne. It's confirmed. Frank Azor and Alienware went for soldered Wifi in their newest Alienware gamingbooks On top used one less screw for the heatsink vs. previous gen Alienware m15. Of course Dell's engineers also used same heatsink design for the bigger brother Alienware 17m r2 https://topics-cdn.dell.com/pdf/alienware-m17-r2-laptop_service-manual_en-us.pdf

To reduce RMA costs (If the wifi connectors break of the soldered wifi pcb) they welded the wifi card directly on the cheaper daugther board. Not the more expencive MB. Aka to reduce damage for themself. Remember i'ts a lot cheaper replace the daughterboard vs. the whole motherboard.

As it is now.... Almost Nothing can be upgradable. Cpu, Gpu, Wifi and ram is now welded on. What's left? Solder on Storage and the Heatsink?

The pict fits very well bro Fox. When bad wasn't enough....

 

Blame @Papusan for leading me here. I honestly didn't think I'd be this disappointed in a manufacturer that I'd feel the need to complain about it.

So I was excited for the upcoming Alienware M15 R2. Small enough, portable, good range of options to make it suit my needs. But, there was no information about the internals. This was off to me as they we so darn proud of themselves with the area 51m. I figured since they were matching the outside design of their bigger brother they would do the same for the inside. Well the manuals for the laptops started showing up and to my horror everything they could do to upset me they did.

So the M15 R2 and M17 R2 have soldered Ram, small batteries, soldered wifi card, and a confounded flipped motherboard?! Why in heck is the motherboard flipped? I thought alienware was an enthusiast gaming brand? So why is it that the inside is more difficult to take apart than it should be and even if you do take it apart there is almost nothing you can replace. At this point I'm surprised there are two m.2 slots that you can upgrade yourself.

And here I thought Razer was bad. . .

 

Maybe the new special ssd can offset the lack of upgradeable Hardware? And maybe these new thinner Alienware models doesn’t burn up in smoke?

I hope ssd guru @tilleroftheearth can explain for us what Raid 0 ssd‘s is? I know about that you can raid all sorts of ssd’s but what is so special with this type ssd Dell advertising in this soldered Jokebook?


Maybe @Ultra Male knows?

 

Noooooooo !!!!!!! AW is dead !!!!!!! UGH that's DISGUSTING.

They've shown that they don't care anymore, they just went full Apple !! nah man this is ridiculous. They've even slimmed down the heatsink, and created a more imbalance !!!!!
Not to mention the biggest fail will be the RAM and SSD throttling while under full load. Damn AW now looks like the retarded brother that's always the last person to adapt himself. Not only are they very late (ASUS, Razor and Gigabyte) but have they completely missed the boat by soldering everything. There was an AW monkey on twitter that blamed Intel for the soldered RAM, but Razor has released 9th gen BGA chips without soldered RAM so that's bull


Heat is going to radiate throughout the whole chassis, and the fans will NOT be able to dissipate the heat from within the chassis. Six screws ? are they serious or out of their mind. 4 screws without springs are already barely enough to keep the heatsink pressure high, let alone balanced. I can see the paste dry out every 3/6 months already, requiring alot of maintenance. Not to mention the fans got alot smaller. It looks like two 3.5 cfm fans which will push almost no air over the heatsink so these things will run hot at the beginning of an benchmark, and even when the clock speeds has stabilized (obviously no boost speed offcoarse) this thing will roam 500/700 mhz under it's boost speed. the heatpipes also got thinner while sacrificing cooling capacity. Just two pipes ? seriously what are you going to cool ? a 25 watt APU ?

this line up should've been called the new alienware 15 and 17 tt edition (people would like twin turbo or something like that, while it's actually Thermal Throttle) cause that's what these machines are going to do. Not to mention the mediocre screens and the higher prices they've given these models. I mean why should i nowadays get an AW while it's the same as an surface book, or an 2-1 convertible. It does not even have anything and i think it's quite ugly to look at. These machines look like Dell G series, meaning that in a few years AW will be completely consolidated in to DELL making it easier for AZOR to ripp off people based on false marketing.

keep swiping people, you're only making it worse and worse. If i could, i would've sold my R5... already for an Clevo/kunshans/eurocom/MSI. i'm not even surpised @AW anymore, i'm just bafled that they still have the nerve to endorse themselves, while prema single handedly can whip out an BIOS/UEFI that an million dollar company cannot. I won't ever endorse or recommend AW anymore, they're not my brand.

i guess the old haydays are not for AW anymore.

 

RAID 0 of two drives stripes their storage together. so its basically like SLI with two SSDs, doubling their total available bandwidth in sequential read and write (scaling is not perfect though, so in reality u get a bit less than double the bandwidth).

Problems with RAID 0 =
1) Zero redundancy. If one of the two drives fail, you lose ALL of the data, because you cannot read it out of the remaining drive.
2) "Marketing Performance". Sequential bandwidth indeed is almost doubled, but the most important 4KB low QD values are actually worse in most cases when compared with single drives. So as a pure data drive (for non-important data, that is due to point 1)), RAID 0 is nice to have, but for Boot/OS, it's actually less performant than a single large SSD

 

Dang. I who thought Dell have developed an special ssd only for this models. Raid 0 isn’t so special. Have done that several times before. False advertising?

@Rei Fukai I have said this change would come long time ago. Don’t be so upset. It was doomed to come.

 

Yeah you're totally right, and i should've seen it coming but at the time i was all in for AW. Just seeing all the hype on Reddit for the new systems while they don't know which implications this will in the future for AW laptops makes me puke. EVERYTHING is going to be soldered lol. Too many people are falling for AW it's marketing, it's just a matter of time when their bussiness plan get's exposed. That would be the downfall for AW. No AW for me, not even the 51m R2 or anything like that.

 

The sarcasm is strong with this one.

You know considering Frank Azor is on record to say that the M15 R2 had one Ram slot I have little faith anyone at the company knows what they're doing over there.

We've slowly been getting upgradable laptops back over the years. So Alienware to just take it all back when they not even a year ago was bragging how they wouldn't be following the thin and light trend because they make gaming laptops with max performance.

At this rate I should open a laptop company so I can finally get one that has no sacrifices.

 

I've been thinking about it for a long time to do what an HidEvolution Does. The legal side is the hardest part, but marketing can be done quite easily by letting the right people in the industry know that there is a new player in the field. also there would be some capital needed for the creation of the mobo. i think sourcing an LGA/PGA shouldn't be hard but that's if you can get for example a mobo manufacturer to sell to you directly.

just thinking about what type of laptop i would try to build (i would love to WC a laptop ! like Asetek with the mx18r1) and the components it would get, the thing would be an absolute beast.
if i win the lottery, i for 100% would start my own boutiqe.

@Terreos

 

Mac but runs windows natively I guess. They just need to glue the battery in now.

 

You know I love Alienware and Intel.


They both have this habit of reminding me that my Ranger is still the best laptop for me every product release. Its nice when a company is willing to endorse backwards design to reinforce the forward thinking my machine had.

Guess if I get another laptop i'll just have to hope AMD has a few more offerings with Acer.

 

Don't give them ideas.