CLEVO Drivers Update Utility by OBSIDIAN-PC

Humm well maybe i can open an exception with you, but please understand that´s a "clients only" feature, to be honest i don´t remember if you purchased your laptop from us did you?

What we will probably do is offer a possibility to buy the full app experience, for those who want to be able to use 100% of the features maybe charge a value, then you get a fully unlocked app, we will then be able to route that money to developers.

Would anyone be willing to pay for the full app experience?
- Our special BIOS updates
- A degree of Support
- Remote access app that you can also use to remote connect to your laptop
- And whatever future updates might bring

I would also like everyone to know that some re-sellers have reached out to us to license this software, this means more people will be able to purchase laptops in store that will provide you with their full featured themed app. I´m still trying to think about how to make this work

 

Does this purchase include PREMA BIOS???? if so then yes I pay I pay all day ^^ lets go to pet store and buy kitties and puppies and go mew mew mew at them!!!! HAHAHAHAHA Lynx wins, hmmm I still may be willing to pay yes... even if no PREMA. Depends how much we are talking my good sir ^^ and no I did not buy from you sadly. to be fair, if someone knocked on your door, and said you want a 7820HK on launch day, and a gtx 1070 and 100hz gsync IPS... for $1360 USD no tax free ship... you probably would have taken that deal... so yeah lol can you blame me? i have receipt to prove it ( i have seen people pay more for gtx 1050 Ti's LOL i got an insane deal

 

Looks like you're doing an awesome job in there!

 

great app, great service, I would pay or donate as I'm not an obsidian customer.

 

I agree, even if I bought from XMG, I would pay or donate for this tool!. This saves so much time, and its an awesome service!
BIG THANKS!

 

Noticed your sig rig specs... my God that is a beautiful laptop you have! lol

 

This tool is a blessing when it comes to clean OS install or quick format.
Or in a situation where there is a mess/are troubles with corrupted drivers.
I'd call it more than enough.
Less advanced users can now much easier and faster install & update everything without fear of version compatibility.

 

I agree, I would pay or donate as well.

 

This! Me too, great utility from Obsidian worth paying for.

 

For just the drivers I probably wouldn't pay for the tool. It's not that hard to get them. If the Prema bios update was part of the deal then I would.

If for some reason the app would be released as a paid app with an option with or without Prema then I would say the Prema bios would justify a higher price than the non Prema enabled app.

 

Here´s how it´s going to be:

Free Version:
- You can only select laptop model and Wifi, no other options in the settings tab
- You can install drivers from the tabs: drivers and others
- Everything else, locked, only thing you can do is start TS or reset TS settings

Low Cost Version:
- Settings fully unlocked
- Others tab fully unlocked
- CPU tab fully unlocked

FULL app:
- Everything unlocked but the BIOS
- Limited Support
- Includes remote access app, and we will help you create a TS profile to load in the app (if you want to)

BIOS version:
-Everything unlocked including our modified BIOS -> flash at your own risk

Note: you are not "buying" the app, money should be routed to developers like uncleweb, skandal and every one else who contributed with code.
I would not mind adding the option to buy with prema BIOS, for additional X amount, that X amount would be routed to prema, but that´s something only he can decide.

Please keep in mind i made this app for my clients who still get it full for free, then i decided to share it, and as i said before, drivers install/update features will keep being free while the server manages to handle the load.
Paying version will help us reward people that have been helping getting this done, developers that added stuff to the app for free! They deserve it!
The full version / with our BIOS, is something we get emails requesting EVERYDAY, people offering to pay for it, and getting really upset if we do not sell them.

I think this is the most fair way of doing this right? You pay for what you want knowing you will be helping community members. As for OBSIDIAN-PC position on all of this, we don´t care, this is something made to be fully functional for our clients, we just can´t be bored/insulted everyday with rude people requesting stuff like we have an obligation with non-clients. This way it will be fair for clients, non-clients, paying users, non-paying users, people who contribute and deserve rewards, etc.

 

It's lookin sexy John!


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I would. You have done nothin but help me out.


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John I think that is a great plan, and if it was not for you I would not have a working gaming laptop right now. I really hope you can convince PREMA to take the money deal, since the money would be routed through you as well maybe he just might go for it, since little work on his end all said and done.

We throwing money at John like we at a strip club with ladies, SO MANY TIERS lol jk

 

This is not in my hands!

I can not make premamod available through this app, due to a deal John made himself while still working at another company which makes them the exclusive premamod partner for Portugal and prevents all other Portuguese companies incl. now Obsidian-PC to get access to premamod:

I am true to my word and I will not break it, otherwise what would we be left with in the end...reputation is made in a moment, character is built in a lifetime.

BTW, I never saw a cent from that 5€ deal mentioned there...

 

This is fine mate, no worries. Maybe someday in a few years, cheers. I understand your logic... Obisidian seems like a nice company, I am surprised they never paid you that 5 Euro fee for each mod... hmm, sorry to hear that man.

 

By selling your BIOS with my app you would actually be selling only to non OBSIDIAN clients, because our clients do not buy the app and they have our bios or the app won't work.
So nothing breaks there.

But moving on, that donation thing, saying that here like that sounds really bad man. We exchange lots of emails you could just write me.

Now, since I have a business I need to explaine this.

As I told you those 5€ per unit were an incentive intended for you to release public BIOS which you never did.

Then I told you that, you said you would make a big release thanking us, never did.
After we talked more you came up with the Early Access program idea. Something that can be found following my signature.
Basically you would flash my clients BIOS for x amount of money. So from this point on there's really no donations right?
I pay you 1000€ you flash 20 bios, was that it?


From that program how many of my clients actually got your BIOS? None.

As for the donation thing, wasn't it converted to the program thing? Even if donations was still relevant, you told me to keep saving it until it was a big enough value right?

Up to know I always followed your lead, the only thing I didn't do was transfer you the amount you wanted WHEN you wanted, well I explained why... I just can't take money from a company to do whatever I want.
On the other side where is that public Prema bios you said you would release thanking us? How many of my clients did you flash a bios with the Early Access program?

No problem, up to know OBSIDIAN got zero from you, after your post it seems we actually won't be having anything from you since you intentional tried to shame us here. I'll arrange the 1000€ for you, don't worry.

I'll give you 1000€ and you will keep not sharing public bios, and you will keep not following the Access Program you invented.

It's like it's all about money for you man, how many times did I made you payments and even sent you parts? You know I'm good complying. Why this reaction this time? Where did I wrong you? You only asked for money recently and I told you by email that I would collect the funds on a personal account. This makes no sense.

Makes no sense why you want to discuss this here and not Private... But ok.

 

I really want to make this clear.

WE decided to make a donation.
"A donation is a gift given by physical or legal persons, typically for charitable purposes and/or to benefit a cause..."

The cause? Incentive for PREMA to release public BIOS.
Never did, had no obligation to.

My message to prema when he asked for the money (remember asking for a donation, not asking for us to pay him a service he did or a product he sold to us):

"Well the 5 bucks per sale was a way to make you release public BIOS versions (specially with a "thanks to OBSIDIAN-PC" note), i even said "As a incentive for PREMA to release the BIOS", there is no release yet, and i promised a lot of clients that they would be able to flash PREMAMOD when it´s out, some keep asking me like dailly!!!! But hey, it´s your call, im ok with it to be honest!
No problem there, i can honor it..."

Basically it´s me saying "Well there was a purpose to the donation, it didnt happen, but it´s ok"...

Message from prema:
"how many systems did Obsidian sell till today?
Trying incorporate a plan which includes the 5€ thing..."

So after he said he would make a public release and thank us he probably decided not to and came up with a new idea.

Message from prema:
"I am contemplating about generating one 'premamod - early access - enthusiast key' for roughly every 10 models sold.
This key can then be distributed to "select power user" of P-Series systems."

So basically we would forget the donation, he would flash one of our clients for each 10 models we would sell.
Basically this is transforming the donation into a business, where each bios flash costs us 50€.
This was his idea not ours. I accepted it up to the corresponding current donation value, it was around 1000€ back then. So it was the same to say we were buying 20 bios flashes.

My question:
How many BIOS did he flash to our clients?
And why would he bring up the donation thing if he knows it was converted into the above solution? His post served only the purpose to shame us.
And even when he asked for the money like 2 months ago or something i did not say i would not pay. i only said i needed him to warn me in advance since i needed to have the money in a personal account.
So this is very unfair treatment. Specially because in the past i always honored my part, sent payments, parts, whatever.

 

You can't flash premamod to a system if you can't be granted access to them. I suggested you offer your app to your old company to release you from the contract, but you have no interest in doing that either...

I didn't wanna take your 'unconditional' donation without also giving you something 'unconditional' in return.
Since you can not become a premamod partner yourself I said hey I give you a limited amount of early access codes which you can forward to select customer, which they can then use to get a 'personal premamod' from me (with their own logo etc).
I said it feels right to me to give you roughly 1 such key for every ten models sold to give you a rough idea about how many codes you will have at your disposal. I did NOT offer to SELL you any codes. I wanted to give you something in return, because for me it's NOT about the money! Otherwise why would I have not accepted any of it? I am not that guy! I simply wanted to help you with your startup without breaching my contract!

So when I finally said OK you can send the 5$ money (1k) in early May of this year, after I posted this above early access key thingy to show my support which you have been using in your forum signature ever since (you didn't even send me the emails of the people that wanted a personal mod, which I asked you to), instead you told me that you didn't sell that much more units because of it and that you are now closing the 'supposed to be unconditional' 5$ thing for good because " it's 1k for a whole lot of nothing", before it even started. But hey thanks for using my name for a year...

 

tbh, sounds like an honest misunderstanding between you guys... *ducks away*

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Seems you're acting like a Company (Premamod Ltd.?), but if somethings wrong going to happen to you (and I hope no for your person, because I never downloaded or used your Bioses or Vbioses release) and you cant onorate your contract?

Have you at your disposal some workforce (people) that support you and your million lines code or is Just a person (you) "Vs" all the world? So people that believe in you has some sort of insurance?

Or we must continue to call it and you "magic" because it can disapper in every moment like a magic at this time, events are always behind corners

 

Man, i was offering you, for free, without any fee, a platform for you to sell your BIOS to end clients that are OUT of access to it, it was a good thing for you and for the community, finally a way to get the famous prema BIOS even if you did not buy from a partner.
To sell the app i´m making a configurator style of page, people select what they want to buy, if in that configurator i included "premabios" with whatever price you want, that does not mean the app would have to flash your bios directly. The flash could be made by you remotely, and i would just add your oem string to the app to make it unlock for that string. So it´s totally doable.

I did sent you more then one email with the accounts of the people who wanted the early access program, i think i already sent you 3 emails for that, the only thing i got was pissed clients complaining they got no contact from you.

Yes i said " it's 1k for a whole lot of nothing" because the community still can´t get your BIOS, obviously this feels bad for me, not for my company but for the community, even after someone offering a nice donation there was nothing out. I decided to make a donation so i think i´m entitled to end it, if i feel the donation is not bringing results i think it´s fair to end it no? It´s a donation not a contracted service, i think we need to remember that a it´s a DONATION, something someone is willing to give you for free, are you really implying i should keep it up forever? Forcing me to donate does not sound right.

Donation was for public bios release, i went on with it for a year, you got up to 1000€.
Then there was No public bios, so the donation objective failed, you offered a solution, one access code per each 10 units sold.
I took it, that makes it 20 codes. No client ever got it.

Still are you somehow saying i can´t stop the donation? I´m obliged to it until the company dies? Is that your point?
Or the problem is you asked for the money in May and you had to have it right away?

Because from my point of view, i offered a donation for something that never happened, i said i would still honor it, you then rewarded the decision with 20 early access codes, those codes were never honored to the people who got it, you requested the money last month and you are pissed because you did not got it yet? This still sounds like something unfair to me.

When i offered the donation i wasn´t getting anything in return i KNEW that, didn´t ask for anything either. After a year, you DID NOT release public bios, even after you told me you would. I still said "Ok you have 1000€, ill give you that, but hey the donation thing is over, one year is enough".

If i used your name for a year, it was because you came up with the access program, something to make up for the 1000€ donation? So the result of one year of using your name is 1000€ for you, the result for my clients is zero, the result for the community is zero. Did i made sales because i used your name? Look at the feedback thread i barely sell anything in this forum. But i´m not here thinking about "selling" i´m here to gain reputation, help the community, share our software for free, whatever, i believe one day our reputation will bring us sales, so i will keep building it in any place i can.

Imagine our company had more then 50% of sales coming from this forum, can you imagine the damage that your post would do? One of the most respectable members saying we did not honor our "donation", it would probably mean people loosing their jobs, and for what? Because we did not send you the donation money last month? Or because we decided to stop the donation after a year? As i said, we decided to open the donation, we have the right to stop it. That was so irresponsible from you man, you could at least send me an email with something like "Pay up or i´m trashing you in the forum", i would still say it is "unfair" for us but i would pay it, like i always said i would.

Man this is so unfair... specially after all the business i got you...

 

I will conceive it is, specially because he says he did not get any email with the usernames for the early access thing.

But i think this is VERY irresponsible, a post like that can destroy a company, people can loose their jobs, i think at the very least i deserve a email warning, so we could "discuss" and sort things.

Looking at our emails, and looking at my posts, i always sounded like a high-school girl with a crush on prema, i always been the nicest guy, always said good thing about him (just check my post history), always defended him, always complied with his requests and instructions, even about the level of mods i do in our OBSIDIAN bios so we never enter in his territory of features or original techniques. Then i get this? Man, i feel sad as hell, really really sad dude.
I´m sorry i decided to end the donation man, but i can´t keep up with something i don´t feel is right, sorry i could not pay you last month, never imagined we had a "deadline" to pay donations, you said to let it accumulate, never imagined we would have to do it when you decided and right away.

 

Let's make this simple:

- Never received any of this , please don't argue as if I even got a cent.
- Never received emails of early access user after I requested them, please don't argue as if I did.
- Never offered to sell any licenses, please don't argue as if I did.
- I can not be forced into breaking my exclusivity agreement not for a million bucks, my word is bond. Hence can't offer the mod through your app (wrote 3 mails repeating that in the last few days), not my call, please don't argue as if I could.

@aaronne Prema Partner Shops have their customers all covered under their warranty.
The free public mods where at your own risk (TOS as per details before download and incl. in the readme file)

 

Never received any of this , please don't argue as if I even got a cent.
Never said i would not, you decided to accumulate the value, you only requested payment last month, i only asked for time to get the funds on my personal account.

Never received emails of early access user after I requested them, please don't argue as if I did:
Last one i sent was on 04/05/2017 i am looking at the email.
I can post printscreens, i can even show you server log.

Never offered to sell any licenses, please don't argue as if I did:
You decided on this, not me:
"generating one 'premamod - early access - enthusiast key' for roughly every 10 models sold.
This key can then be distributed to "select power user" of P-Series systems."
Your solution to "reward us for the donations", you decided that since you had around 1000€ worth of donation that would mean 200 units, and that would mean you would give us 20 keys for your program.
Totally your idea.

I can not be forced into breaking my exclusivity agreement not for a million bucks, my word is bond. Hence can't offer the mod through your app, not my call, please don't argue as if I could.
Never forced you, how am i forcing you? For pulling out the donations? One year of donations should be enough even tough no public premabios was released, and even after your offer for the early access codes never happened.

 

Why don't you guys pick up the phone, talk to each other. Posting in a forum is ok but fails to drive the feelings and the emotions every each of you had while writing. Every other reader puts their emotions there which drive their own (mis)interpretations . I would suggest you guys to talk and then agree on a joint statement (why not) where you put a full stop on this issue. This way, truth is cristal clear for all of us - Both of you and us, the readers.

I believe that the service that both have offered over the years is invaluable, Prema with the Bios/vBios voodoo and Obsidian by providing top of the line systems paired with the amazing free software that helps the community.

Talk, and get it sorted out.

Why am i doing this? Im just a (mostly) silent reader of the forums for many years that has been following up more the Clevo section after returning from a Dell M4700 for the last 4 years... who cares about the healthy environment we can have around here.

 

Never received any of this , please don't argue as if I even got a cent.
Never said i would not, you decided to accumulate the value, you only requested payment last month, i only asked for time to get the funds on my personal account.

I decided to not take any of your money until I had something to support you with in return. This was not a waiting tactic for a larger cash-out. Don't worry you can keep your money.

Never received emails of early access user after I requested them, please don't argue as if I did:
Last one i sent was on 04/05/2017 i am looking at the email.
I can post printscreens, i can even show you server log.

You told me 3 user names and I told you I was sick with a kidney infection and I asked you for their email IDs, but only got a reply with "...As of now, im officially closing our 5€ per unit offer...Please honor the remote flash thing we should be entitled to 20 Keys..."

Never offered to sell any licenses, please don't argue as if I did:
You decided on this, not me:
"generating one 'premamod - early access - enthusiast key' for roughly every 10 models sold.
This key can then be distributed to "select power user" of P-Series systems."
Your solution to "reward us for the donations", you decided that since you had around 1000€ worth of donation that would mean 200 units, and that would mean you would give us 20 keys for your program.
Totally your idea.

Yes I wanted to give you something in return, because that's what my heart told me to do. For me it was like this little story:

John: "Hey I give you something for free"
Prema: "That's so kind of you but first let me come up with something I can do for you"
A lot of thinking later: "OK, got it here is what I can do for you"
John: "Ah great let us tell everyone"
Prema: "OK, I'll quickly post it"
Again a little later: "Ah nobody seems to see that deal and I am not having more sales because of it so the deal is off"
Prema: "Huh?"

I can not be forced into breaking my exclusivity agreement not for a million bucks, my word is bond. Hence can't offer the mod through your app, not my call, please don't argue as if I could.
Never forced you, how am i forcing you? For pulling out the donations? One year of donations should be enough even tough no public premabios was released, and even after your offer for the early access codes never happened.

I wrote you 3 mails just this week saying that this premamod in the app thing can't work as long as the exclusivity deal is active and showed you a possible way out of it by making the app available to your old company, which you decided to not even try.
So you simply skipped the necessary step, yet you are posting as if it was in my hands and even write may partner mails titled "OBSIDIAN-PC Tools - PREMA BIOS - Agreement" without consulting with me first. How is this not forcing my hand to re-act in public stating the reason why it's not even my call?

I think I said as much as I can multiple times now. John I love you but I am really really sad...

 

Yes you sent this:

"Make a list of models and user name/nicks for premamod, I am down with kidney infection, will ping you when I am better and back at my system..."

I sent you a list AFTER you sent that email. Not before, AFTER. I just got pissed out clients.

Then only when you decided to collect your money you asked for the IDs again, i had already sent them before... Obviously i was pissed with this, first no public bios release then this program of yours never was executed for any client, then when you decide to collect the money you ask for client ids again?

Yes i decided ending the donation after a year, as i said i think i´m entitled, there was no releases, i still kept my word and told you i would pay, yes i decided to end the program, i was getting only furious clients because they did not received any message from you, yet again, ain´t i free to stop your offer?

The fact that i decided to end something does not mean i would never honor my initial donation, NEVER have i implied that!

The only thing i feel i should have done different is that i should have removed that from my sig as soon as i sent you the email pulling off, that is the only thing i will conceive, i´m sorry for that, never even remembered about it.

This has NOTHING to do with the partner thing, the emails about the app that we exchanged has NOTHING to do with that, those were related to some re-sellers asking to license the app. Which would mean they would have their app with their logos and texts, they would supply it to their clients, again, this does not break your contract, unless i would ALSO supply your bios to my clients, i never said that was my position.

AND i only mentioned you in that post because someone asked about it, and because by selling the APP here to end clients we are talking about a whole new beast, it´s NOT for OBSIDIAN clients since they already get a full version, we are talking about a new "product" that is in it´s very core something FOR NON OBSIDIAN clients. So your deal with my old boss as nothing to do with this, that is why i mentioned you in that post. Because since this is something made EXCLUSIVELY for non-OBSIDIAN clients, you could take this chance to sell your thing.

And again all of this could have been cleared by a simple email from you, what you did was irresponsible and damaging. I think that due to your past events you have this tendency to jump into conclusions and fire away, even at someone who means no harm and if anything, always been more then good to you.

 

"Make a list of models and user name/nicks for premamod, I am down with kidney infection, will ping you when I am better and back at my system..."

I sent you a list AFTER you sent that email. Not before, AFTER. I just got pissed out clients.

Then only when you decided to collect your money you asked for the IDs again, i had already sent them before... Obviously i was pissed with this, first no public bios release then this program of yours never was executed for any client, then when you decide to collect the money you ask for client ids again?

In my very first mail after receiving the forum nicknames from you, after touching down at the airport, I asked for their email IDs. In the very reply to that you quit your end of the 'unconditional' offer and send me no email IDs until today. I was sitting at my system waiting for those mails with folders already carrying their names.

Yes i decided ending the donation after a year, as i said i think i´m entitled, there was no releases, i still kept my word and told you i would pay, yes i decided to end the program, i was getting only furious clients because they did not received any message from you, yet again, ain´t i free to stop your offer?

The fact that i decided to end something does not mean i would never honor my initial donation, NEVER have i implied that!

The only thing i feel i should have done different is that i should have removed that from my sig as soon as i sent you the email pulling off, that is the only thing i will conceive, i´m sorry for that, never even remembered about it.

You made a business deal out of a friendly offer. I was ready to flash users systems with personal mods even before receiving a cent from you, even though this was already beginning to feel awkward now that you pulled out from your very public statement before I even saw a cent.

This has NOTHING to do with the partner thing, the emails about the app that we exchanged has NOTHING to do with that, those were related to some re-sellers asking to license the app.

I only mentioned you in that post because someone asked about it, and because by selling the APP here to end clients we are talking about a whole new beast, it´s NOT for OBSIDIAN clients since they already get a full version, we are talking about a new "product" that is in it´s very core something FOR NON OBSIDIAN clients. So your deal with my old boss as nothing to do with this, that is why i mentioned you in that post. Because since this is something made EXCLUSIVELY for non-OBSIDIAN clients, you could take this chance to sell your thing.

And again all of this could have been cleared by a simple email from you, what you did was irresponsible and damaging. I think that due to your past events you have this tendency to jump into conclusions and fire away, even at someone who means no harm and if anything, always been more then good to you.[/QUOTE]

You posted and wrote those mails to prema partner (even mentioning prices) as if I could be the one to decide this, after I told you multiple times in private this week that it can't happen as long as the Portugal Exclusive deal is active. Each time I suggested to contact your old company and find a way out of that deal. I can not let my partner send you their premamod files or host personal mods on your server to be flashed through your app if you can't have access to the files due to the deal.
What would you have posted next, if I didn't take a stance in public, that it is Prema who doesn't want his mods to be available to anyone via the app? But hey everyone can now purchase your firmware instead...something you said that you would never ever even consider doing as it would harm your own hardware business as well as me and my partner shops. Yet, here we are...

 

About this:

"even write may partner mails titled "OBSIDIAN-PC Tools - PREMA BIOS - Agreement" without consulting with me first. How is this not forcing my hand to re-act in public stating the reason why it's not even my call?"

YOUR partners contacted me, not the other way around, after reading their messages, i had an idea that i wanted to share with you and with them, i wrote to BOTH of you telling about MY idea after I WAS CONTACTED.
Damn man, you see harm or wrong doing everywhere. After being contacted by them i actually had what i tought was a good idea and instead of being a JERK and telling them "Hey you know what, you want to license my app, what if i also sell you my BIOS?" i went on and decided to ADD YOU so YOU COULD GAIN WITH IT, thinking "Oh boy i think he will be happy that i thought about him and added him into a business opportunity"... boy was i wrong, apparently.

 

I told (some) of my partner to contact you regarding using your app to update their driver.
You know that I would have jumped on helping you with premamod integration and teaming up with the app a very long time ago if it wouldn't be for the exclusivity deal standing in our way. Theming the app for re-seller and making such a version available to your old company as well in exchange for the release from the exclusivity deal, so that everyone could get the premamod via the app, was the whole idea and the way out of this limitation stopping us from finally working together. Was it really to much to offer a single local company access to your app and may even still getting paid by them for your app in exchange to bring premamod to a lot more people incl. your own shop?

We can not simply skip that step and go full throttle ahead just because everything else feels so right.

 

Everyone is asking stuff from me, from non-clients, re-sellers, even clevo and service centers nag me with stuff that i don´t think i should be the one solving. I usually just try to find ways of everyone being happy.
You have been like the only person i been defending, never going in your away, but man, this last interactions between us have gone sour as F*word...

If just you discussed this with me i could have told you that i could just setup a selling page, with a *INSERT COOLNAME APP* - Not related to OBSIDIAN... No logos, no texts, nothing, a totally independent app, wont even work with my clients units, just so we can add your firmware, the community get´s happy, you do not break deals, and we can do re-seller version (for those that i agree to do, you decide who gets your firmware, i decide who gets my app).

I actually never intended to sell the app, do re-seller licensed version, etc, i was in my corner, re-sellers and users, came to me, not the other way around.

But the bomb you drop here made me really sad man, you have more then enough evidence that i never refused to pay you anything. And i don´t think i was ever unfair about wanting to pull off of your offer when i honestly felt like it was either messy or not going well. Maybe my timing is to blame, ok let me also give you that, looking at the emails my timings are not the best.
But even with the app thing, i was contacted, someone wanted something from me, i asked for all of us to chime ideas to make something good, and even that got you mad... wow...

As for selling my BIOS, why would you even care, just give everyone a chance of buying yours, it´s the way to go, mine is just some additional menu options, yours is full of great work, everyone knows that and i always said it. I just wanted to give a solution to the poor guys that dont even get updates from their resellers, the people who send me emails EVERYDAY requesting BIOS updates, this is people that are not after BIOS MODS but after simple OEM updates.

 

Sorry to have read all of this, dang, honestly not sure where we go from here. Well I guess forget PREMA, the 1.05.05 bios is plenty fine anyway in all honestly. I just hope you continue to bring us Obsidian tool updates, because those make clean installations so much easier.

 

It´s not "forget prema", we just are incompatible, not only because there´s a exclusivity deal between him and another re-seller in my country, but also there seems to be a really hard communication problem between the two of us.

I hope he still manages to find a way to bring his BIOS accessible to everyone so you guys can enjoy it.

 

*sigh* @Prema @John@OBSIDIAN-PC okay. Listen, I love you both. I recommend you both so much it's not even funny, ya'll could pay me for advertisement at this point. But let's not get me roped into this.

I would like to, as futile as I think it may be, try to mediate here. I... skimmed... over the last few pages. I have at least one person claiming it's a misunderstanding in communication going on here. I know everybody has a schoolgirl crush on prema (Prema-sama! *bats eyelashes*), etc.

Could I get you two to both just stop saying who is who, and trying to pinpoint where everything went wrong for a minute? I would like both Prema and John to just say what's needed for everything to work out. Prema seems to be offering a loophole way to get you capable of being a Prema mod partner which you seem to still like the idea of, John. John seems to want to get some codes for some of his users, which you seem to be willing to offer, Prema.

Can both of you just maybe say what each other needs to move forward?

I mean, let's not beat around the bush here. We have enough people screwing us over in the laptop market to have two of you outstanding people fighting. Do it for me ya? ?

And if nothing happens, at least I tried. But I hope good things happen. *spreads love*

 

I also want to see more peace!

From what I could make out of the last few pages, Prema has a deal made that gave exclusivity for Prema Bios for another company in the past, company for which John has worked. Knowing Prema and how he keeps his word, it is understandable that he cannot break his word on that one, but if possible, we should try to find the bridge that connects everyone and make everybody happy!

As @D2 Ultima said, we have countless laptop companies screwing us on a daily basis, we shouldn't fight as we are all that we have in this community...

 

As an outsider looking in it doesn't seem like prema wants to, but is more interested in cultivating the prema mod partner monopoly.

Now I'll admit I'm a little biased here, there is no prema partner in my country (uk). I cannot justify the price difference (25% on the total laptop, with the potential to be stung for another 20% on import) just for an unneutered bios by importing. Especially when it adds lead times, language and time zone issues, and a difficulty in legal recourse if it all goes sour on a purchase that costs more than my car. Since we are leaving the eu, no-one knows what difficulties and additional costs may arise during the warranty if I bought from an eu country.

I'm completely willing to pay a reasonable amount for a prema bios, but that's just too much.

As a programmer I can completely guess at prema's reasons. He wants financial renumeration for his work and limiting it to resellers allows him to more closely control that. It would be very difficult to control otherwise with no DRM to stop people releasing the bios.

However, I'm still of the view that it's anti-competitive business practices. Monopolies and exclusivity agreements are bad for the consumer as they remove choice. My laptop is still on order, but I suspect once it arrives I'm going to have to significantly downclock to run at acceptable temperatures as my only option without invalidating warranty (so delidding is out), that's extremely frustrating when its just software.

 

I believe nobody asked him to do that... specially after:

Which was already implicit in other John@OBSIDIAN-PC ´s posts before.

my 2 cents to cool this issue down from an unbiased stance.

 

There's a new GeForce driver available, 384.76



Link for direct download

 

It has nothing to do with that...

You cannot break your own word - I understand Prema very well when it comes to this.

I made some promises that are hard to keep, I keep them, because a character is indeed built over a lifetime.

 

My understanding is that no-one was asking prema to break his contractual obligations (and trust me I understand contractual obligations intimately, I've signed enough NDA's and similar myself).

My understanding is that prema is contractually obligated to not enter a prema partnership with any other clevo reseller in portugal, of course I've never seen the contract and have no idea what it stipulates but thats the impression I got from both sides. In principle that doesnt seem like selling the bios directly to international customers, even other portugese customers would infringe, but prema doesnt appear to be interested in exploring the options.

 

All this discussion was not about breaking deals. At least it was not for me, never tried to force anything but i just replied to requests, either made by users or either made by re-sellers. Both sides explained themselves. I wont make the mistake of trying to create business opportunities to anyone, ever again.

I´m actually confused to what triggered all this, was it replying to one of his partners, was it my reply in this forum, was it the donation thing, was it saying i would sell the update bios in my app? I have no idea, seems it was everything... And for everything i have my reasons.

I´m the owner of my app, and this topic is to discuss the app, i already said what i was going to do with it and all this last posts have nothing to do with that. In the meanwhile just enjoy it. It´s been free for a year, installing and updating drivers will still be free.

Edit: To be honest, reading some messages and emails i been getting (not saying that it´s from prema), i actually seem to be the one being forced to license my app to re-sellers, i actually seem to be the one being forced not to sell bios updates. And on the other hand, by reading community messages and angry emails i seem to be forced to do so by community users... So, no matter what type of arrangement i try, someone will complain. Who looses? Probably the community, again.

 

I have made personal mods for a LOT of people ever since I stopped making the latest versions available for just everyone a year ago. I do this till today whenever I find the time to do so. Every single of such mods is custom made with e.g. the owners name in BIOS and his personal logo of choice etc. This not only gives it a nice personal touch but also let's me track leaks back to their source.
All I told every single one of them was to ask their own heart when hitting the donate button and it will be equally fine with me, some of them did this before receiving the mod, many after receiving the mod, some sent me a single $ others where more generous, some (forgot?) and never sent anything at all.

This was a trial run for things to come in future, but rest assured I never stopped making premamod available to the community and I don't intend starting now.

 

Whilst I in no way intend to lessen your work, you can't possibly deal personally with every single customer like that. It's just not sustainable, no matter how many custom mods you make, it will still be a tiny drop of water in the ocean of demand.

I don't doubt that you've spent a considerable amount of time doing this, but I also doubt you've made a significant dent in the total number of non prema partner clevo owners looking to fix clevo's neutered bios.

 

I have seen some 300k downloads of free premamod files. There are dozens of companies who have requested to become premamod partner. But, I am not in for the money! I don't intend to milk the cow as much as it can give and kill it in the process. I am not looking for a way to maximize profits! I have even turned down the 'big bucks' offer to go exclusive with a single one for a whole load of cash. When the time comes I will select carefully and give new players a chance and make premamod available to a broader range of people directly via their hardware sale as well as directly to the end user who couldn't purchase from a partner shop.

 

That doesn't help those of us with no local resellers interested in being prema partners. Without a direct way of buying your bios, without involving our reseller, we are shut out.

 

There already are premamod partner shops in EU, North America, South America, Asia and a 'part-time' partner in Australia.
Almost all all of the them don't charge customer a dime extra for the premamod. Even for those who don't like their hardware prices and want to purchase from the cheapest one out there, who often ship the systems untested directly as received from their whole-sale partner, and want to fix the thermals etc of the system themselves, there are still the personal premamods. A lot of the frequent user in this forum didn't get their premamod from their point of sale but from me directly, they just don't make a big thing about it.

 

I mentioned earlier in the thread, I'm uk based and there is no uk based prema partner. Importing added considerable cost and hassle to do so, especially when there is no guarantee what will happen when we exit the EU in the timeframes of a potential warranty claim.

I'm willing to pay a reasonable amount for a prema bios but not a 25% premium on the total laptop cost with a chance of an additional 20% on import tax if I ordered from the states, along with all the additional downsides of buying internationally (lead times, language/tz issues, lack of legal protection etc)

So I have to befriend you on a random internet forum before being able to buy your bios as a direct customer? I don't think that's how you intended it to sound, but as someone with a clevo laptop arriving imminently who is looking for a way of countering clevos insane restrictions and bugs it just sounds like an old boys club that anyone else is locked out of.

I understand where your coming from, just pointing out that as someone outside that club looking in, it just feels like I'm shut out in the rain, looking in the window with envious green eyes at those that get a laptop that works the way it should have to start with, and the only way I could have joined the club was to pay a price that I couldn't afford, and very little of that price would have reached you anyway.

Anyway I didn't mean to derail john's thread, but I'd love it if you'd reconsider and look into some way of providing direct, no-nonsense sales to *everyone* not just a select few lucky people who can jump through the correct hoops. These laptops are on sale and being used *now* not some indeterminate time in the future.

 

@TheOneFinn

True in the UK you only really have PCS or 3XS as resellers and both of which are not PremaMod Partners.

However if your laying out £2000-3000 on a machine going to a PremaMod Partner in EU really isn't a biggy, you are NOT going to get hit by TAX or Import Duties. Plus if the exchange rate is good on the day you order you could save a few quid. As you say importing for the US is not viable.

Had I known about Obsidian I would have never purchased from 3XS. Once I found out about Obsidian I did a system build on their website and for £500 less I could have had a newer machine (KM1 as to DM2 from 3XS), plus the benefit of a Delidded CPU and their own BiosMod. And then theres the Obsidian Tool, wow makes things so easy.


Prema was happy to sort me out a bios, took a couple of emails a donation and quick Teamviewer session. A whole new machine was born.

Both Prema and John's work deserves to rewarded and I for one are more than happy to donate a few bucks for such.

 

Obsidian wasn't as an option as he doesn't do 4K screens, I wanted the option of running at 1080p native.

I priced up the exact same spec of laptop, £2700 locally, the very limit of my budget, and the cheapest was £3200 from a prema partner (I've been hovering over buying for months pricing up on numerous websites, partially because of the whole prema bios thing)

Also as mentioned it wasn't just the cost, there is the additional hassle of shipping internationally for warranty claims, dealing with language issues (very few of the European sellers have English language websites for instance), time zone differences, questionable legal protection etc. Sorry but I just can't gamble that amount of money (it costs more than my car) on an international sale like that.

And you have no idea what shipping to the EU is going to be like post Brexit, none of us do. It's too large of a purchase for me to take the gamble.

And at no point have I ever said I wanted prema's bios for free, but everything I've read has said it's unlikely without a prema partner, including numerous posts by people saying they've mailed him and been ignored. Combine that with the website recently going private and it certainly seems like it's no longer available to the public at large.