OFFICIAL Statement regarding the Sager NP9260 (Clevo D900C/D901C) Quad Core Information

Hey, all! Writing my review of my Xtreme quad will need to wait another couple of weeks. I am heading out of the country and won't be back until mid-October. I will be completely without technology (except for my dive computer), which is going to be a fun change of pace. Here's hoping I don't get eaten by sharks ;^)

Jason

 

One thing I would like to know is if swapping just the motherboard is all that is needed to use a quad "safely" in Clevo's eyes? If so, does anybody know a place to purchase it as a part by itself [I like Eurocomm's idea of the upgrade and incuding the quad core, but since I already HAVE the quad core, there isn't much sense in that for me].

 

FYI
We have posted some initial scores and images of the new Quad Core support on the Sager NP9261 HERE

 

So there is no more issues with quad core ?

 

I have one of the original d901Cs. I am interested in upgrading the motherboard. Does anyone out there offer the revision 5.xa mb or offer a replacement service?

thanks

 

I would like to know this too. I would also like to know if the updated or current (9260) MB will have the option to upgrade the GPU when Nvidia release the 8700GTX or 8800.

 

That is correct. The warranty on the Sager NP9261 will have the full warranty backing from Sager...who will be backed up by Clevo.

 

Sager has not announced an upgrade program at this time due to motherboard shortage. At this time they are only offering the NP9261 with the V5.x motherboard. However they may well offer an upgrade program at a later date as has been their custom.

Sager does not sell motherboards by themselves.

 

Gentlemen,

It may be too late by now, but quad-core is of little use for gaming ! (at present)

I am quoting a European Game Magazine: PC GamePlay:

Quadcores are usually clocked lower than duo-core due to the extra heat, but it should still have double the power ?? NO; as it is hard to write software that spreads the processes over the 4 cores. With condensing video-pictures this is no problem and therefore faster, but not for games because:

The control of the different threads and load-balancing demands a lot of resources and also to keep it all synchronised. Even games like Supreme Commnder that is built for 4 threads is faster on a Duo-core.
Tim Sweeney - head-programmer of the Unreal 3 engine - says there is 2-3 times more time needed to make a game multi-threaded. Besides there are situations were things need to be sequential in a game and multi-threading is of no use !!!
Basically the development-costs for a game, that is balanced for 4 cores, is still too high, so that almost no game-makers are not doing this.

Bottom-line: most games will run faster on duo-core, because of the lack of multi-threading in games (due to development-costs)

Jules

 

I mean, I am dying to buy a D900C clevo with dual 8800 cards, but duo-core, because I want faster game-speeds and no overheating

 

Have fun, but me I am enjoying my QUAD CORE for a lot of reasons and gaming rocks.

 

Amen to that brother

 

actually the article is incorrect about supreme commander. that game actually does run faster with quad core, even at lower speeds when compared to a dual core. the performance increase is not large, though. this is the only game that runs a little faster on quad core for now.

 

Article please.

 

You wont notice a difference between my system and yours. When we get the 8800 GTX SLI GPU's these machines are going to scream. I am more interested in upgrading the GPU's, not bothered about the Quad Core thing. By the time they utilize all the cores there will be some new monster out. Dont get me wrong though, having a Quad core is not a bad thing.

 

http://www.gamespot.com/features/6166198/p-6.html

 

You also notice that we can run antivirus at the sametime we are playing games... We will do that faster than you.....

Honestly quad core is the way to go.... Remember what you do with a computer.. .multi-task... the more cores the better....

Joe

 

I have at least 10 apps running in the task bar including antivirus and play Crysis with everything on high except shadows and shaders set to medium at 1920x1600 resolution averaging 35fps and dropping to 20-30 at times.

And usually when I play games like Crysis I dont really want to burn a CD or DVD and the Q6700/Q6600 would not be able to do this either. Honestly, the Q6700 and Q6600 dont offer any more performance in apps and games than the X6800/E6700. IMOA the Q6700/Q6600 will not give you any advantage from the 9260's offerings. But if you are talking about new CPU's (QX9770) then yes Quads will come into there own. IMOA the quads that Sager is offering in the 9261 wasnt worth all the hype. But the 8800M GTX this is something to get excited about. Don't get me wrong the Q6600 and Q6700 are great CPU's for the price, alot better than the X6800 for performance vs cost. And why not have a quad CPU if you can. But for the Q6700 and Q6600 all it is, is bragging rights "my DTR has a quad processor" " Quads are the way to go blah, blah".

In the article's this is a QX6700 which is a better CPU than the Q6700 and it still has no advantage.

http://www.techspot.com/review/27-intel-core2-extreme-qx6700-quad/page5.html

http://www.tbreak.com/reviews/printpage.php?id=475

http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/2006/11/02/intel_core_2_extreme_qx6700/9

http://www.tomshardware.com/2007/07/16/cpu_charts_2007/page14.html

 

If you bought your machine just for gaming then you made a good choice. But if you bought you machine for high end work and gaming then the quad core was a better choice. I also expect multi-threaded programs to become more main stream in the next 6-8 months. But you do have point with the 8800GTX it will have more of an impact on gaming performance than the CPU will. Most games are not limited by the CPU but by the GPU and with that said there really isn't much if any difference between the 2 CPU's.

 

First of all, having Apps running in your System tray doesnt mean they are actually running.

What is being said about the advantage of the Quad core, is that while you can get 112 fps in prey, or whatever, with your Dual core, we are getting 105 fps with our quad, its still only using 2 of our 4 core most likely, while yours is completely devoted to one task. Meaning we can be running things like antivirus(not the tray icon, an actual scan...), or backing up a hard-drive, or encoding video, or whatever. This comes in real handy when you are actually using your computer for work, or creativity, along with gaming. I personally have so many things I wish I could have my computer working on, while I game.

And to say Quad has no advantage over a Dual core, well thats just wrong. So 99% of games don't take advantage of the Quad, that just impresses me more with how those games Perform on a Quad, while only using maybe 50% of whats there.

 

Remember I am just refering to the Q6700/Q6600. You should read my post again, I did not say "Quads have no advantage over Dual cores". I am comparing specific CPU's to each other. I understand how the quad CPU works.

OK, then post some screen shots with your Q6700/9261 with FPS when playing Crysis while you are running antivirus scan and encoding video. I am just curious about how well the Q6700/Q6600 performs, cause I have not been able to find any SPECIFIC benches comparing this on the web. And if you are perfoming these extra tasks, what other system resources are being affected? I do agree that the quad does do multi tasking twice as good as a dual core, but does the 9261 with Q6700/Q6600 have enough juice to handle these extra tasks you are refering to.

And you are wrong to say "having Apps running in your System tray doesnt mean they are actually running" look at the task manager these programs are using memory and CPU resources. With everything off on the screen and just the system tray apps running, I use up to 20% at times of CPU usage.

I would defintly take better performance over being able to run a virus scan or encoding video (which I dont do enough of to worry about) during gaming. And remember I am just refering to Sagers Quad options for the 9261/9260 which in my books is the best DTR now and for the next year or so with the anouncement of being able to upgrade to the 8800M GTX.

 

Ya, I am so glad that I bought a Sager, can't wait to get my hands on two 8800M GTX's.

 

Me too...

Joe

 

Me Three !!

 

Well according to Mr. Eurocom it looks like we will be able to upgrade to the new Penryn CPU. There will be a MB upgrade offered to support the 45 nm processors. I will make this upgrade as well as the SLI 8800M GTX. Life is good for us Clevo owners

 

^^ whoa thats fantabulous, any sort of time frame when to expect the new penryn chips.?? round bout the same time as the 8800GTX.??

 

Jan/08 I think, You can possibly expect Sager and other resellers to offer upgrade about 1 month or maybe more after this date.

 

Mr. Eurocom claimed that to support the new Penryn CPUs a new chipset would be needed, and that would mean a new MB as well. He used the word "would", he did not write that a new MB is planned.

I think it is clear now that the present 965 chipset can support the Penryn CPUs, the only thing needed for the D900C/D901C is a bios upgrade so it seems. Maybe Clevo was so clever to prepare the present bios for the new CPUs when they did the MB upgrade last October, I don't know.

Anyway, I doubt that Clevo will produce a new MB for the D900c/D901C early 2008. If they wanted to use a new 30s series chipset from Intel, they could have done so when they did the MB update to support the present Quad CPUs. After all, this isn't the world's most best selling notebook, so developing a new MB every half year doesn't make much sense.

 

what is the advantage of penryn?

 

what is the advantage of penryn?
........................................................................................................................................

http://download.intel.com/pressroom/kits/45nm/45nmSummaryFoils.pdf

 

my computer won't display that screen.

 

I'll more than likely upgrade with the Q9550's are released a bit later. I've already talked with PCMicro about switching out the MB and getting a hardware swap out on my GFX cards.

 

It's A .PDF

Adobe acrobat Reader is not on your computer?

 

no i am on my backup computer. my p3 600mhz from 1999. hehe. thats ok i can google it.

 

Wow you must of read a different post "D900C/D901C model is our long term mobile-workstation platform, so there is no question that we would support next generation of Intel's Penryn CPUs based on 45nm silicon technology i.e. Q9300. But this would require totally different motherboard (different chipset) as the currently used chipset supports only 65nm CPU technology"

Anyway I am happy that you know everything about Clevo's business plans, and just out of curiosity how do you know these things. But I think that I am more inclined to believe Mr Eurocom over your opinion.

I would not expect these upgrades from the world largest notebook seller, but a boutique brand like Clevo I would. They did release the fastest notebook system, did they not. Why would a computer manufacturer do that if they are not the largest and best selling, hmmm.

That last bit was sarcasm, Clevo is for serious notebook users not people that want a dell.

 

Interestingly well put.

 

I will try to explain it again.

Mr. Eurocom states " there is no question that we would support next generation of Intel's Penryn CPUs based on 45nm silicon technology i.e. Q9300. But this would require totally different motherboard (different chipset) as the currently used chipset supports only 65nm CPU technology"

He assumes that the present 965 chipset can not support Penryn CPUs, and from there he draws the conclusion that a new MB is needed. However his first assumption is wrong, the 965 chipset can support Penryn CPUs, so his conclusion that a new MB with a new chipset would be required becomes invalid.

You take Mr. Eurocom's statements even one step further, and take them for the announcement of a new MB for early 2008! I don't see any definitive announcement of a new MB in Mr. Eurocom's statements, just a lot of "woulds", let alone a timeframe for this supposed new MB!

The present MB should be able to support the Penryn CPUs, and maybe Clevo even prepared the bios for these CPUs already.

Now suppose Clevo would know that the present MB can not support the Penryn CPUs, and a new MB is required, and still they want to support the Penryn CPUs. Then tell me please where is the logic that they would spend months to redesign the present MB (as they did) knowing that it would have a lifespan of about 4 months, when at the same time new chipsets that can support the Penryns are already available. Doesn't make sense to me. And furthermore, high-end equipment (like this notebook) tends to have a longer lifespan then low-end bulkware equipment.

I expect a new MB when the successors to the Penryns will appear, or when new and faster SO-DIMM technology becomes available.

 

OK let me get this straight, cause I am not going to comment about this with YOU again, it is really pointless and not sure what your argument is with me, you should really start attacking Mr Eurocom. Mr Eurocom has stated that "there is no question that we will support the next generation of Intel's Penryn CPUs based on 45nm silicon technology i.e. Q9300". "THERE IS NO QUESTION" and why are you questioning him?? Are you a reseller?? Do you have another source??? Please shed some light on your sources. I am only going from the comments of a reputable reseller that posted on this forum. He also states "But this would require totally different motherboard (different chipset) as the currently used chipset supports only 65nm CPU technology", do you know more than him? If so I would be glad to believe you if you can prove your statements ABOUT THIS MB.

"He assumes that the present 965 chipset can not support Penryn CPUs, and from there he draws the conclusion that a new MB is needed" He is a god damn reseller troller he sell's these systems, do you? Why would I not believe him.

"You take Mr. Eurocom's statements even one step further, and take them for the announcement of a new MB for early 2008!". I never anounced anything, I said "I think" I never said "They are releasing a new MB 1 month after the release of the Penryn". This is my opinion and taking the comments of Mr Eurocom that is a reputable reseller. What are you talking about your whole argument about this is really kind off STUPID. Your attacking me for believing Mr Eurocoms post, why would you do that, but for any other reason than trolling.

"I don't see any definitive announcement of a new MB in Mr. Eurocom's statements, just a lot of "woulds", let alone a timeframe for this supposed new MB!" He says troller, that there is no question they will support the new processors, but they will need to release an updated MB. That pretty much gives me the impression they are going to be releasing a new MB.

This is just the icing ontop of the cake, you have been ranting about me commenting on specific details from a reputable reseller's post and you pull this one out of your behind. "I expect a new MB when the successors to the Penryns will appear, or when new and faster SO-DIMM technology becomes available".

Your other rant about costs and why would they do that, go pm Mr Eurocom for the answers. Read the posts and stop changing my opinions to suit your pointless argument.

 

Google can be your friend.

Link to the list of compatable Asus Motherboards. You will find the P965 chipset listed As a ASUS 45nm Ready Motherboard.

http://event.asus.com/mb/45nm/

So the chipset IS Compatable. With the right Bios.

Take a few deep breaths, We all seek the same thing here.

 

Is that the same board that is in the 9261? The 9260 MB should of supported the Quad processors but it didnt. I would take the statements made by a person that has been selling these machines to know more about them than a spec sheet of an entirely different MB.

 

You already know the Clevo Motherboard is not designed by Asus.

But the chipset IS made By Intel. and that is the starting point for all Motherboard makers.

Same FSB, Same CPU's Can be used up to the thermal limits of the laptop. Same memory speeds up to the Bios limits set by Clevo, Same Northbridge/southnridge combo.

Acording to the Spec's The D901C has all the same features as there desktop ATX counterparts.

Or would you think that Clevo "Reinvented the Wheel" and made the chipset somehow "Uncompatable by design?

We now live in the information age. It's out there....The answers are there if ya look for them.

Keep breathing.....do some research. It's good for you....

P.S. the Quads took MORE Power. And had to be updated to do that. The Penryn Chips use less.

In fact, if you look in the bios...the D901C still thinks it's a D900c

 

I think that it would be great if there would only be a Bios update to use the Penryn. I am not going to jump to any conclusions until I hear it directly from Clevo. "the D901C still thinks it's a D900c" do some research it's good for you.

D900C: Blue Case
D901C: Black Case (Sager NP9260)

 

From what I know, as of the end of October, the P965 chipset DOES NOT officially support the new 45nm processors. It is technically possible though on some boards for such support to be added through a new BIOS.

Also, take Mr. Eurocom's posts with a grain of salt, as he is giving his opinions, and not any kind of even semi-official information. Without a doubt most if not all Clevo OEM's and resellers would love to support Penryn technology on the D900c's, but that does not mean it will necessarily happen.

 

Well we were talking of the motherboard.
they upgraded the D901 To handle the more power hungry Quads. i don't know what the case says.

And Yup...the case is a differant color. But we were talking chipsets last i remember...
And there the same.

I'm not selling you something, You may believe anything you like. It's just a fourm to express our oppinions.

And we have both done so.

 

Actually, the D900c's and D901c's are parallel products, which differ in casing only. They upgraded the motherboard to handle the quad core chips, that has nothing to do with the D901c/D900c difference.

 

Sorry.

When i used D900C Ver D901C i was doing so to point out a newer/updated model. (It was my understanding that the D900C Was produced First with no Quad capeablity, It was not untill the D901C that option was avalable with a revised motherboard.

So they DO make a D900C with a quad capable motherboard that i can buy today with out the reseller swaping out the old motherboard?

I guess for us Clevo owners to be correct in future board postings we will have to include the motherboard revision number (4 or 5 if i remember correctly) because useing Clevo,s Model numbers only truly states the color of the laptop.

spliting hairs if ya ask me.....but it is very true.

We were disscusing the Chipset issue and we get sidetracked with this.........LOL

 

I will give you a big kiss if you can find anyone that even sells a D900C. I've never heard of the animal being sighted in the wild.

The D901C came out with motherboard revis 4.x and it didn't take kindly to Quads. Then a new motherboard came out revis 5.x and it allowed for the use of some Quads.

There has always been a D901C, but I've never met anyone that owned a D900C.

Hope that helps!

 

This makes sense, thanks for the info Odin243. I would not count on the existing MB in the 9261 to support, but if it does with a bios update that would be great, but don't hold your breath.

 

Read WuJen's post below, as he is very correct. I refer to all laptops in that line as D900c's, though that is technically incorrect.

My feelings exactly.

 

Ya I just wanted to keep you on topic, cause when you brought this up, it didn't make any sense. Just refer to the sager model numbers in the future (9260 = no Quad 9261 = Quad) simple. Wouldnt want to be spliting hairs, or getting our facts wrong. LOL