Thermal Paste Roundup - Performance, Price, Recommendations (Update: Thermal Pads!)

Found them, thanks! Those are rather relatively cheap, 145 x 145 0.5mm/1mm/1.5mm for basically like $10 average

 

yep, thats the beauty of those arctic cooling pads, theyre so friggin CHEAP! and u get a whole sheet of it u gotta love them

btw, the total area required depends on your components, so no one can really tell you what size ull need. same goes for thickness. best thing to do is measure everything yourself and calculate a total. as a reference, i used up around 6000 mm² of thermal pads for a total repad of my 980M plus the mobo components on the CPU side. with two gpus, itll naturally be more, same goes for large form factor MXM ^^

so hey, btw, what your deal exactly? your old machine died and now it seems youre getting ready for a juicy upgrade, i want details on that heard some rumours of you doing a review on a machine and getting a good price on it afterwards? that plus the donation thread so what are your specs? lemme guess: Phoenix 2 / 3 with dual 1080s and 7700K

 

haha yeah I have a layout from Meaker so I'll be using that as a guide to repad.

You think I'd need more than 145 x 145 for each pad size?

I can clear up rumors. I'm partnered with www.gaminglaptopsjunky.com and I will be doing reviews for that site. I was supposed to review a P775DM2 as the first unit, but there was an issue getting it at the time so my partner/boss got a Tornado F5 to review in the meantime. During this time my PC decided to stab me in the cranium. My family is willing to help with a set budget, and review machines often have a discount (that's different with each vendor) but we need to buy it. I found out with the reduced prices I could get a P775DM3 (6700K/1080) mostly barebones, or continue with the DM2 and I'd have a little for an SSD (I can't transfer my mSATA ones to M.2 in the new machines). I asked Mr. Fox what he felt would be best, and he said a P870 would be best even single GPU. I said I agreed, but I wouldn't be able to (it was +$400 just for it, same specs) without extra help. So he and phoenix wanted to make that thread for me. I'll be attempting to order around monday. If I get another $60 US in donations (which Q937 will match) then I should be able to afford the 1080 SLI, which apparently NBR wants me to get (and I'm not complaining about xD).

I will be reviewing it, and then I have the option to keep or re-sell it (but of course I'll be keeping it). I want a P870DM3 instead of a KM because I can use W8.1 on it as my primary OS (Z270 chipset will be W10 only for drivers).

For the specs, it'll be 32GB of the 3000MHz G.Skill RAM, one or two 1080s, the vapor chamber heatsink and 6700K (7700K would need more money, and I've heard bad things about its multitasking ability from someone who does a lot of stream setting up; unsure if it's still true or needed a driver update or something). 2 x 330W bricks and the killer 1535ac card should fill out the rest of the machine's specs.

 

Don't go killer lol.

 

I know of Killer and their problems. You just need to use the basic drivers and run WLAN Optimizer, really.

 

thats sounds like a pretty sweet deal to me, and just in the nick of time, when your machine decided to go belly up! im sure ull be most satisfied with the Phoenix 2 at those specs

 

Oh certainly I shall. Even if I only get single GPU.

 

"only" *lol* well, theres always the upgrade path, especially if @Prema´s prophecy holds true that Clevo will stick to the large form factor MXM gpus from the DM2/3 machines onwards.

oh btw, the 145x145 mm sheet will DEFINITELY be enough for several repads, no worries there i was just speaking in general, if you were planning to buy more or less exactly as much as you need, best thing to do is take measurements before ordering. but in this case youre 101% on the safe side ive used up like 15-30% (very rough estimate) of my 145x145 mm sheet (1 mm) for one complete repad on standard mxm 980M and CPU mobo side, so with THREE sheets ull be golden

 

Well, you know what I mean. Honestly, the support has been amazing, I did not expect to get even half of what's there now.

Ah I see. That sounds great then =D. I'm going to need cooling to be its utmost! I aim for CLU on all devices with a delid on the CPU.

 

Glad you got it squared away.

 

Based on the repasting and repadding that I did just now, 145 x 145mm is too much... And 50mm x 50mm is too little!

 

I certainly want too much; I don't know when I'll get again.

 

...which fits exactly with my predictions

 

Same here; looks like it will last for a long while

Haha! Thanks again for the timely warning!

 

Alright, now into at least after 24 hours of using the new pads and paste... And I am still not see much of an improvement though, but being able to use new pads instead of reusing those dirty old ones still feels great!

 

It is just like changing the seat on your bike or car.

In the long run, you will thank yourself.

 

Does anyone know what this is? (Red arrows) It is an Nvidia Gigabyte GTX 1080 G1 Gaming.

 

My educated guess would be vRAM (Video RAM).

 

are you sure? I thought it was the 8 rectangles around the Nvidia chip...

 

I am not no, why are you asking?

 

Because change the original thermal pads by fujipoly 11 w/mk in those places. The others around the Nvidia chip are 0.5mm and I did not get it. So, leave the originals

 

The arrows point to inductors (the large squares) and capacitors. The small, 8-pin squares left to the inductors are power mosfets. Memory chips are indeed the eight rectangles right next to the gpu.

 

Great. I changed thermal pads in inductors and capacitors. Use Fujipoly 11 w/mk 2mm and Fujipoly 14 w/mk 1mm. On the memory chips leave the original thermal pads. And use Grizzly liquid metal for the Nvidia chip. The performance of Nvidia 1080 improved just a little. 5 or 8 degrees less temperature with maximum power. OC GPU +180 mhz (stable) and +625 mhz for memory.

 

TIL
10char

 

I feel confused about this.
How do you know it *is* CLU?
According to wikipedia, thermal conductivity of Galinstan is way lower than what Collaboratory advertises:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galinstan
But then, some question accuracy of what overclocker's TIM companies offer:
http://www.overclock.net/t/1588116/thermal-grizzly-conductonaut-73-w-mk/60#post_25109963

BTW, there's a much cheaper Galinstan seller now:
http://www.ebay.pl/itm/900-kg-10-g-...565500?hash=item4899c6753c:g:Dh8AAOSwFqJWoJbw

I can get 10g of Galinstan for 50% more than 1g of CLU, shipped from abroad.

 

It is the composition of various metal such as Tinn, Gallium and Indium which determines the final thermal conductivity results. See, for example... indium who is also used which has a thermal conductivity of 81.8 W/(m·K). Don't look on the numbers for a single metal.
Several have used Galistan. Go with what fits your wallet. @t456 have used it with good results.

 

Ran two long-term stress tests with fans maxed out (to eliminate fan table differences) on fresh repastes of both CLU and Galinstan; identical max T, not a single degree of difference between them. Also, you cannot distinguish them by either looks, texture or viscosity. It just might be something else of course, but wouldn't place my bets on that. Could ask an acquaintance of mine if she'd be willing to them both in a gas chromatograph and make absolutely certain (for science!).

The other liquid metals sold as TIM may use a different mixture. Supposedly some flow more easily than others, but haven't used or tested any of these.

Regardless of whether Galinstan is CLU, its performance is identical and never had to repaste any of the dozen systems or so I've used it on. So wouldn't hesitate on that ebay offer if you're looking for a good quality TIM (at a fraction of the cost).

 

Thanks for the answers.
It's not really about budget. CLU is actually cheaper per the smallest unit I can gat and since it's said to last, I don't plan to change it soon. But such things are nice to know.

 

This is one of those subjects with a fine line. The way that I look at it is like motor oil....

Sure you can use different brands and achieve the same outcome, but a lot of it has to do with other factors as in the additives etc...which in the case of LM = different mixture of metals / ratios, however, I can only tell you data from my own personal experience in that...

I use Grizzly Conductonaut (TGC), because it not only works okay on the front end / short term, but also works wonders in the long end / long term. This is not to say that CLU or Galinstan won't do the same, however, what I can tell you for sure is this.

CLU, due to it having a different mixture than TGC, if not applied correctly with the die and HS making good contact, any gap will "liquioxidize," (made up term that I've been using when explaining this) and get all gumpy. With the rapid rise and drop in temps from one extreme end to the other and with the the presence of air (gap), it "cooks" the LM and makes it do weird things. In simple terms, it burns it out and decreases the longevity if there is a gap and the CLU turns into gunk.

I've tested TGC under controlled conditions on my P775DM2, where there was a gap between the HS and die/IHS. TGC did not produce the same outcome of gumping up like CLU did. This could be highly due to the fact that TGC has a different mixture of metals and is particularly high in indium content. Long story short, TGC, stays in form.

The reason I don't use single metals like Galinstan, is because there exists LM's like TGC, CLU, etc... They have different ratios of metals in them for a particular reason and at least for me I find that comforting. Some call it engineering with a purpose ...I don't know... but it's more of a personal preference for me to use something developed by professional overclockers, over opting for something raw like a single metal.

This is not to say that it does not work, but to each his own.

Also, for goodness sakes people... if one is spending thousands on a laptop, please don't talk about TIM/LM prices....good grief LOL.

You will never hear people who buy sports cars like a Ferrari or heck even something less expensive, talk about gas prices. It's just not in the vocabulary, because it is a bit of an oxymoron.

*face palm* I keep having to tell myself...to each his own...yes....okay deep breath....on with what I was doing haha...

Cheers

 

This is very interesting.. Thanks for sharing.

The great thing is that we have many choices.

 

Due the exact physical properties needed you will likely find mixes to be similar for the liquid metals.

 

Would be great. That would be a definitive answer.

 

I can backup iunlock (sorry won't quote here, hell of a long post ^^) on CLU becoming cooked after some time.

In my p650sg, on a roughly 6-8 months basis, depending on laptop load and ambient temperature, I have to renew CLU due too lower performance, and each time part of the liquid is baked.

Curious how tgc would improve this tho, think I will switch to that on my new laptop!

 

Slight pumping of the heatsink is the likely cause mixing in air to the mixture with some oxidation changing the properties of the metal sped up by the higher temperatures.

 

An interesting read on Galinstan oxidation:
http://cjmems.seas.ucla.edu/papers/2012 JMEMS Liu Galistan (1).pdf

 

Indeed, and it is easy to spot when you have an 80g container of the stuff. But this is irrelevant when used as a tim. Removed heatsink from systems that have been galinstan'ed over a year ago and the bit between heatsink and die is still liquid (no oxygen, after all). Everything that's 'over the edge' is a bit smudgy at the boundary with the open air. That's actually a good thing since it'll have increased surface tension, minimising the risk it'll take off on an extended tour away from the heatsink into areas where it can risk shorting something.

In the end, if there's any tim pumping out, regardless the type, then you've used too much or the sink doesn't have enough downward force and/or 'spring' left. Best would be to apply, tighten heatsink, fire up benchmarks to the highest temperature possible and then tighten the heatsink one final time. After that nothing will ever pump out again and the liquid metal tim will remain forever liquid. If more 'spring' is necessary then you could either use a copper shim or, better, use four (plastic) spacers on the opposite side of the motherboard between the heatsink screws and the mb itself. That way the bottom of the screws will be farther away from the die and heatsink pressure will increase (not too much, preferably). Also useful for delidded cpus.

Spoiler: HP Pavilion DV3-2000 - T4300, liquid metal

Too bad the gpu on this system had an aluminium heatsink (too old to warrant a shim and it isn't mine, to boot). Funny thing is that it doesn't have any throttle on the gpu until at least the maximum 101°C it could be pushed (any longer and max fan cools it down again):

Spoiler: HP Pavilion DV3-2000 - cpu+gpu full load

 

The older chips would cook themselves quite happily yes.

 

Does anyone believe this:
http://m.sg-thermal.com/Thermal-Pad/TCP5000_Premium_Thermal_Conductive_Pad.html
?

 

The only way to prove that would be getting a sample!

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@t456 and rest of the gang: recently switched from clu to gallinstan (9€ per gram clu vs. 9€ per 10 grams gallinstan, so were talking a factor TEN cheaper). thermal testing revealed....*drum rolls*...

no difference in DeltaT between the two! guys, go for it, its cheap, its awesome, its ice cold and 10 grams equal ten packages of clu, so itll basically last you like....forever *lol*

btw @t456 the reason i went for cost per gram instead of volume was simple: all pastes are sold with gram quantity info, whereas volume info is rare! so that didnt leave me any other choice, sadly...

btw, time to update my sig and the first post in this thread...

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may I ask where everyone is getting this gallinstan from? Thanks

 

just take a look around on ebay there are sellers in europe and north america as far as ive seen

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waiting for someone to review this

 

Lower thermal conductivity than thermal paste so I don't see why it's false.

 

Wonder about it too... I may order some through my lab to give it a test !

 

where do you buy Kryonaut thermal pads?

 

id say the usual suspects: amazon, newegg, your local laptop/computer shop, ebay....

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not amazon; https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_...x=thermal+grizzly+,aps,162&crid=3DIE0GHCERPAO

 

check again

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/s/ref=is_s?k=thermal+grizzly+minus+pad+8

the pads by thermal grizzly are called "minus pad 8", there is no kryonaut in the name

edit: aaah, now i see the problem - the first post mentions TG kryonaut in the thermal pad performance chart, thats the actual paste though and was used as a standard to compare the thermal pads with regular highend paste

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Whats the best thermal pad size? 0.5, 1.0, or 1.5?

BTW this is for a Clevo P650RS-G Laptop