Windows 10

I think M$, and allot of other companies, depend on our instant gratification standards and not spending hours on an agreement. This trend has gotten worst over the years to now this end. Essentially the consumer just saying to hell with it, it is all yours and do whatever you want (so long as it is in someones eyes good faith).

 

I watched the first 2 videos and I felt like I was watching a horror movie. Let me ask you this: If I am on Windows 10 and I am using O&O ShutUp 10 to disable Telemetry and all other tracking things, am I safe or not?

 

@Matrix Leader - I have no idea. Probably not is the safest answer, and maybe the most accurate. I am running it on my Clevo right now also, but I don't feel safe continuing to do so. I think the risk is greater than any benefit. Looking at the bigger picture, even if we are safe and telemetry is really disabled, should we be willing, and is it even ethical, to support the level of corruption that would produce a product that requires so much end user damage control? This would be a personal decision, but I think it is absolutely insane that we have any reason to have such a discussion and Micro$haft should be tarred and feathered crucified for their actions. We have other businesses getting the living daylights sued out of them for data security breaches and in waltzes the Redmond Nazi Team with a new OS that makes the accidental mistakes (or carelessness) of other businesses look like child's play... and, the world rejoices, LOL.

 

While some are reporting data is still being sent the important part is missed. With all the work we are doing it is only circumventing the fact M$ is still entitled to this information as we did agree to it. Meaning with everything done there is nothing stopping them from coming back in and resetting it or just outright disabling our tweaks.

 

What I would like to know what company would ever install W10 on there system. I know I don't plan on dealing with them if I knew that.

https://www.microsoft.com/en-ca/WindowsForBusiness/windows-for-small-business

 

Better also use Disable Windows 10 Spying. Now it's on GitHub, opensource so you can trust it.

 

The thing is, MS could always push updates without telling you anything about what they do (they are already doing this at least for some updates) or lie about their functions, and you would never know.

As long as you're still subscribed to MS's service, don't dream about being "safe" simply because you have a third party patch. Monitoring outgoing traffic may help somewhat, but you can't disable server access outright, can you?

 

Cheers for those videos Mr. Fox, I watched all of them. I think the most telling point about it was in 2 of the videos they quoted the following passage from the Terms & Conditions: "We will access, disclose and preserve data, including your content (such as the content of your e-mails, other private communications or files in private folders), when we have a good faith belief that doing so is necessary.". In the T&C's they then go on to provide a numbered list giving situations in which that information could be accessed & disclosed, one of them was "to comply with applicable law" in conjunction with government agencies. Yes, so Windows 10 does give them the ability to spy on all your activities and to be used against you if you deviate from law - thing is I'm fairly law abiding (because I agree with most of them) so on a personal level I don't have much to lose from using Windows 10. I wouldn't want this to be used & abused to help create some kind of police state, but I don't think it will get to that point.

Your Minority Report movie references - yes Windows 10 collects data to "know" you so that it targets advertisements - I wouldn't want the intrusive world of the advertisements following you around where ever you went that was shown in that Minority Report clip. Perhaps this is the start of that process towards that vision, but again we're not there yet, and I'd want to be able to opt out of intrusive ads seen in Minority Report.

I think people with shady dealings need to be concerned with using Windows 10, but as long as the data collected is not going to be used to change our Democracy into some kind of a police state then I'm ok with it.

EDIT: I do envisage one kind of problem with this though. All this data about everyone has to be held somewhere right, well if this data gets hacked then I can see company trade secrets getting stolen or hackers exploiting individuals with the information they glean. This is a negative point about Windows 10. I think they've gone a bit too far with the data collection, I don't think we're asking for this as consumers & business people. On a personal level it's unlikely to affect me much though I think.

 

@Mr. Fox @TANWare @toughasnails

Source: http://appleapple.top/the-state-dum...ows-10-this-is-a-threat-to-national-security/

 

So what country is next...China ??

 

Come to think of it, what kind of lobbying power will M$ have once all politicians have W10 on their desktops?

 

"Don't run, We are your friends"


"We come in Peace!"

 

Damn, there is too much spying in Windows 10. I'm going back to North Korea Linux.

 

Well I have heard that M$ has all them in there pockets but when and if they have W10 they will own them.

Its to bad that M$ has when this low . W10 just might of been a good OS...toooo bad.

Edit.. All jokes aside. What company or government would install it ??

 

2023 isn't very far. As long as Win API can keep its position among desktop app devs for a few years, most companies and governments would have no choice.

 

They would just use the glorious fire wall to block the MS servers, and redirect traffic to domestic clones.

 

The problem with Moscow is that I'm not sure why exactly they claimed Win10 as a threat... because their OS would spy 10 times more or because they would laugh of an idea about notifying in EULA about spying.

 

OK, the cancer is officially gone from my Clevo now. And, it is a good thing I made an image of my Windows 8.1 installation first. After choosing the option of letting Windows 10 do its "go back" thing the machine was completely unusable... black screen desktop. Seeing this failure occur is consistent with their demonstration of incompetence in destroying three of my LCD panels, just not as grievous. I am scared for the folks that didn't have the forethought to take such a disk imaging precaution and don't have installation media and product keys handy. Everyone should know better, but human error and noob ignorance are both legitimate reasons it might not go well when upgrader remorse sets in. Remember folks... you have a total of 30 days to repent. Don't let procrastination complicate your life.

 

My reversion was a bust as well. Had to rely on the backup image too.

 

At least the Kremlin wouldn't try to hide it and pretend it's all sunshine and roses like the thieves and liars at Micro$oft. Their oppression is in your face and they are proud of their vile governance, but the surreptitious acts of the Redmond Mafia are no less evil, only camouflaged. It's a sad day when one of the world's technology leader becomes a government shill and tries to cloak it in a cartoon-colored candy coating.

 

MrFox, not trying to add insult to injury but TBH M$ is touting how all this info gathering will help them out. Well has it helped them solve the LCD issue? Lies, just lies, its all lies.................

 

The truth is often painful. I have emailed and private messaged Gabe Aul multiple times and the man hasn't even shown the decency to extend the courtesy of a cameo reply. And, there is obviously something they are trying to hide. When the latest story of the LCD damage broke last night (see quote below) it was taken down in a matter of hours. I wonder if they pulled the "copyright violation" card or some other asinine shenanigan to hush things up?

I hope you made an image. DX12 wasn't enough to make me want to remain subservient to the Redmond Mafia. If I have to choose between my soul and DX12, I will choose the former and keep on using DX11 until Steam is finished making Linux a highly relevant OS. In the end, we may find we owe more to Gabe Newell than we could have ever imagined.

 

"We don't need no stinking EULA's!! (badges)"

 

I have wondered about that too. Absolutely no coverage of W10 in the main media. Nothing about slowing the net or anything else. There were a few blurbs pre-release but that was about it. I think someone has to have a pretty tight grip on keeping all of this so darn quiet.

Edit; I should note, for all you conspiracy theorists, the government has a stake here too. If this fails M$ stock could plunder bringing the rest of the market with it.

 

Some people say (50% trusted) that on 23-rd of August (today) on Windows 7/8/8.1 critical updates are coming/came KB3080149 and KB3075249.
After you install it every 15 minutes telemetry information (if you trust MS) is sent to MS servers:
vortex-win.data.microsoft.com
settings-win.data.microsoft.com

Float is going through port 443, SSL "package".
Again, they are signed as critical.

Hosts modification doesn't help.

Spoiler

P.S. Also you may delete these updates, won't hurt:
KB2505438
kb:2952664
kb:2990214
kb:3021917
kb:3022345
kb:3035583
kb:3050265
kb:3065987
kb:3068708
kb:3075249
kb:3075851
kb:3080149
KB2670838 – Windows 7 Only (breaks AERO functionality and gives you blurry fonts on some websites)
KB2976978 – Windows 8 only

 

I had KB3080149, 8/15/15 date, now gone.

 

Among the many cycles that Msft plays between in the market, Presidential cycles are a key 4 year cycle especially near the end of a large run up usually, since down run's are so quick.

There is no press at all about the bomb win10, Bill's eating poop, and life goes on. Put a stick in it, Win10 is dead and is going no where as per the even number Win number assigned to it (coincidence? lol) The biggest stock in the world can make more money going belly up dragging the whole world down. Msft does not give a hoot.

We have until 2020 to float this company along to use Win7, and then the trend looks very bleak. Bill may be dead as his S1-S2 lower back integrity is close to a wheel chair right before death. Everyone has jumped ship in Msft from what I've seen.

Out of millions and millions of programmers in India and China, you would think one would stand out to steal software like Bill did in his early days with virtually no legal barriers to contend with in India or China. No such luck.

Look for improving software OS's around the next 70 year greed-fear stock market cycle in 2069, maybe from a cloned embryo of Bill himself.

 

Is there any way to turn off the damn maintenance on Win 10? This go all day, even if you have a preset time. I could stop this garbage on Win 8.1 but not on this junk/trash. Is Microsoft's developers totally idiot and does not understand anything?

 

They just expect you to run SSD(s) as needed.

 

Ok to be completely fair, here's what I like about Win 10.

Reduced boot time (from 28 to 18 seconds on SSD vs. Win 7?)

The promise of DX12, notice how I've italicized promise.

The aesthetic face-lift.

The ability to do a System Refresh (assuming this feature has been carried forward from 8.1). System Refresh is basically reinstalling the OS because of a problem but keeping all of the applications and various tweaks and settings intact. I truly wish this option were available to me right now as I'm confronted with either clean reinstalling 7 or "upgrading" to 10.

I don't like the invasion, collation of and distribution to various alphabet agencies all my personal life "for my own good".

I don't like the forced updates, but, considering I would be "upgrading" from 7 Pro to 10 Pro (I'm still mulling it over, but once solid Nvidia drivers start rolling out and my Creative X-Fi 5.1 Pro external sound card gets a firmware / software update I'm probably going to "upgrade") I could simply defer updates for quite some time (Pro users, unlike Home, have this option).

I really, really don't want to clean reinstall Windows. DX12 promises something revolutionary, so I say screw it, I will be upgrading anyway. Worse comes to worse I re-purchase Windows 7 Pro and clean reinstall.

This is my even-handed appraisal of the situation of 10. You've probably already read my critical appraisal of it, the one where Bill Gates and The Powers That Be decide to shut down the internet etc.

I completely agree, for me I know that the alphabet agencies have been watching all of us willy nilly without Microsoft's help, so I'm not particularly bothered by revelations that M$ is now shoving this aspect down our throats, I am, however, not thrilled with the mandatory forced updates. Are they insane? As I said above, this is my even-handed appraisal of 10, here's that negative appraisal in case you missed it:

http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/poll-getting-keeping-reverting-windows-10.779733/page-5

The fact that I can defer updates (Win 10 Pro) and the fact that I could care less that The Powers That Be have now openly stated they are surveilling all of us "for our own good" means that I will likely "upgrade" simply to avoid having to do a clean install of 7, faster boot times, and a better looking and snappier OS.

Trust me. I don't like M$, nor am I thrilled with Win 10, but I would honestly put up with the BS, half of which (the surveillance part) doesn't bother me (they we're already doing it, do you use Google's services for example?) and the other half (forced updates) can be deferred nearly indefinitely with Win 10 Pro.

DX12 games arrive next year and Nvidia figures out how to not look like second place next to AMD with the new API and I will have no remorse (hopefully).

If not it's back to 7 clean reinstall.

 

Is it how they are looking for buying SSDs for those who doesn't have one already or...

 

Big brother is watching you . More coming from Micro$oft in later patches .
It does not help that Win 10 uses little less system resources on weak hardware, when the maintenance run all times when the PC is idle (stops only when the mouse is in motion) But starts again during benchmarks when you are not using the mouse... LoL
It is very strange that Microsoft's OS developers do not understand that hardware run at max during benchmark tests and allows maintenance to start (even if you do not touch the mouse, does not mean that computer hardware is working very hard)

 

4:17 mark is chilling.



Part 2 is must hear:

 

Good videos. Although it is nothing most of us did not already know, it is always good to hear of the atrocities all over again because of how abusive, intrusive and potentially extremely dangerous it is to have this installed on anyone's system. All personal preferences and new features being set aside, the user surveillance capabilities are truly outrageous. I don't really understand how it could be "worth it" on a system that is used on a daily basis. Maybe... just a big maybe... on a DX12 gaming machine that stays offline the majority of the time and is only connected intermittently for online gameplay sessions, then disconnected again, with no email, web surfing or personal files stored on it... maybe. But, the mere fact of how they designed Windows 10 to operate in terms of data gathering should be enough to make everyone angry. It's not whether or not one has something to hide as much as the dishonorable intent behind the architecture. I hear all of the excuses being made, dismissing it because Google already does it, blah, blah, blah, yet I see it being different because it is the operating system. This is not a service that we can opt out of and totally disconnect from and cancel our user account for. And, since when does two wrongs ever make a right?

 

@Mr. Fox , you touch on almost exactly what I said 30 something pages back in this growing thread, at the end of July. I don't mean to appear egotistical or preachy by re-posting, but here's my unchanged quote:

@vulcan78 "Chilling" indeed. I equally found the videos as well as much of what she discusses to be interesting on virtually every level (technical, corporate, spiritual, etc.). I'm glad I'm aware of much of it with regards to Win10 and that many who frequent this sub-forum also are, and hopefully even more will become aware. Informing every decision one makes is more important today than it might have ever been but one must also do their best to inform others as well, like the video alluded. Again, I try to stray away from instilling FUD when I comment but it goes without saying that if presented with such information (of a potentially troubling and far-reaching nature and consequence) you have to actually think about it and decide for yourself. Being aware, staying informed, and keeping others informed as best as possible is the all-important step 1. Taking necessary action, to whatever degree, can only follow after that.

As to the 2nd video specifically, we'll have to see if, when forced, M$ will actually issue this "privacy-friendly" W10 version. I've personally decided now that unless MAJOR changes are made to it in this regard and in some others, I'm completely avoiding Win10. M$ can shove DX12 where the sun don't shine.

 

It's quite frustrating reading all this serious stuff about what MicroPop will gonna do with all this collecting data and privacy raping. But at the Moment I don't think that MicroBalls will be releasing a "privacy-friendly" W10 Version very soon when simultaneously starting infecting Win7/8/8.1 by Telemetry KB-Updates and don't letting us know what's in their updates:

http://arstechnica.com/information-...no-plans-to-tell-us-whats-in-windows-patches/

So if this comes true, how are you supposed to know which updates to install and which ones are crap? Reverting back to Win7/8.1 might be "safe" for now, but for how long?

Despite I deactivated all the data collecting/Spyware stuff and letting O&O his work do, you strongly recommend reverting back to a former Version then, right?

 

My thoughts at the moment are the original EULA does not provide for keylogging or telemetry of local files etc.. To this end we should be safe on 8.1 and backwards. TBH this is my major concern with the privacy.

Now the concern would be they do not sneak it in with a modification of the EULA. You have to watch this as occasionally we get those updates with the accept buttons. So now no longer trust M$, watch any and every thing you accept.

 

On a purely personal level, what do you think are the specific bad things that could happen to you & your life if you were to run Windows 10, and how likely do you think that would occur if you did run Windows 10? (talking the Privacy concerns here, not anything performance or benchmark related)

 

Microsoft has a well-proven history of sharing user data with the government...

http://venturebeat.com/2013/07/11/microsoft-prism/

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/jul/11/microsoft-nsa-collaboration-user-data

http://www.itproportal.com/2014/05/14/microsoft-openly-offered-cloud-data-fbi-and-nsa/

And there's a *lot* more available if one wants to research the subject...

I don't know what's legal in merry old England nowadays when it comes to stuff like this, but around here with all the Patriot-Act-type legislations in place I'd rather provide the least amount of data possible to *anyone*.

That's why I don't have a smartphone. Or a FB/Twitter/Linkedin/etc. account, nor do I use any of Google's numerous offerings.

To each their own, by all means.

 

Yeah, we already know that Microsoft will share their data with government organisations when deemed necessary, it says that in the small print, but I'm postulating the simple question: what bad stuff is going to happen to you and your life as a result?

 

Ignorance of the law is not a reason to break it. Watch a video on your computer but since the monitor is not approved but the player ignored that you are breaking the law. Same could be said of almost any DRM content etc.. There are numerous more examples of possible issues. Since you are signing away the right/expectation of privacy there are tons of untested waters. This has never before been done so who knows how bad it can get over time.

This is not just dipping in a toe to test the waters but doing a belly flop in the deep end. Have you known any Corporation ever to take an inch and not explore how to take more? Again look what you are signing away!

Edit; bad stuff immediately is you have lost a right. One that many have died, at least in this country, to have and preserve. By agreeing to the EULA you are disrespecting those who have suffered for you. Is that good enough?

 

Didn't they say that they will report people who download copy righted content/use pirated software or games? What if one's kid does that ? Wouldn't Micro$h4ft co-operate with DMCA to sue them?

 

I think that Microsoft is only likely to disclose illegal activities that are of some greater magnitude - I don't think they'll be reporting edge cases and grey areas. Also when I read some parts of the T&C's I got the impression that information would be disclosed when those agencies already had you on their radar & those agencies asked Microsoft for the info - not so much Microsoft monitoring everything & then reporting to the agencies (that's my take on it).

 

To each his own, but to me personally, that is very dangerous it means they open the doors to one's computer if the authorities ask for it.

 

On a side note, if one installs Windows 10 and uses O&O Shut Up 10 to disable Telemetry, then what are the risks?

 

So it is true, not only can they come in but now that you have typed all this they can prove you were of the mindset it was ok too. Then again it is your argument it is ok so long as they go after someone else, nice just nice.

Again they can come in at any time and mod the root to prevent the tweaks. They are ENTITLED to the data by the agreed upon EULA.

Edit; remember they do not have to go to the authorities, they can just shut down the machine and its OS too at will.

 

And to sharing it with their "trusted partners". Which, in real life, ends up looking like this:

Source: http://www.itproportal.com/2014/05/14/microsoft-openly-offered-cloud-data-fbi-and-nsa/

 

TBH as well, by stopping telemetry in W10 you are breaking contractual law. I am sure they will not do this today as it would be too controversial but down the line they could just deactivate those systems with tweaks or unapproved software or just disable it etc..

 

I don't know, I'm not an expert on "O&O Shut Up" and how it interacts with Windows 10, although I have used it to disable Cortana (but I've left some of the telemetry active). I have read somewhere that O&O can't shut down all the telemetry - but not sure about that point, if I was more concerned about eradicating all telemetry then I would have read more about it.

 

What Brother @ajkula66 said...

To answer directly, I don't want to find out. Doing nothing wrong has never exempted anyone from the errors of overzealous idiots or intentional acts of evil intent. Plus, it's a matter of principle. I'm not going to give anyone access to information that is none of their business and I am not going to agree to make it their business. Since we have no control over what they collect or how they use it "in good faith" I think it's insane for anyone to agree to such nonsense. I refuse to be a willing party to their social engineering experiments.

Would you agree to have your home telephone bugged and hidden cameras placed around your home on the "good faith" statements of a company that stands to gain something from the invasion of privacy? Same thing here.

We have no ability to control Micro$lop or their employees, or what they do with the data we agree to give them access to. This is a recipe for disaster that has nothing whatsoever to do with "having nothing to hide" or being a good boy. The best mistakes in life are those we avoid, not those we have to work through and attempt to sort out later. Anyone that actually trusts a corporate entity or a government body to act in their best interests needs to seek professional help because they are totally nuts.