The ThrottleStop Guide

What did you use to get windows black? I used to have it all black but since latest updates I can't get it to work anymore.

 

Thank you.

Is it not best to let Windows Update find and install the latest drivers? I know Windows Update may not have the latest drivers that you can find on Station Drivers but it should be stable?

 

Go to this link and you will find what you need...
https://www.deviantart.com/niivu/art/Guide-To-Installing-Windows-10-Themes-708835586

 

Yes, it is stable if you acquired either from Windows Update or Station Drivers but the difference is.... the MS driver will not have the latest drivers usually and will not have all the added features that comes with it because MS make those drivers to the basic with no added features. For example audio drivers.. if you got it from Station Drivers you will have all the audio enhancements while the MS driver you won't have any

 

Is it possible to bind profile 1 and 3 on the following hotkey - Win+Ctrl+1 / Win+Ctrl+2 ?

 

@unclewebb, @Che0063, @THEBOSS619, @Papusan...

I did some more poking around. What I did was to limit the Xeon CPU to 2 cores in the BIOS and booted into Windows, such that any CPU hog's effect would be magnified. And I discovered that in the System process, there's dxgmms2.sys that's spiking up to 14% of CPU usage. The System process itself uses 10-20% of the CPU without ever going down.

Here is some evidence:


And the dxgmms2.sys process spiking:



Thinking that it might be either of the graphics drivers, I installed the latest Intel UHD Graphics drivers straight from Intel itself, but saw no difference. My nVidia GPU is completely disabled, and clocks return 0 MHz in HWiNFO. Even with 2 cores, my system idle power draw is something like 15-20W, occasionally exceeding that range.

 

Do you mean you disabled nvidia from BIOS or from the device manager? Either way Nvidia must be enabled and then install the latest drivers straight from nvidia
This will allow nvidia to power save correctly when not in use

Unless you mean that you selected your preferred GPU from Nvidia Control Panel to--> Integrated Intel Graphic card.

As expected dxgmms2.sys is wildly popular related to driver issues

 

Uninstall most Dell SW such as, Dell update,Foundation services etc.. and keep only Precision Optimizer, Precision Command Center/Power manager. Install latest VC++ runtimes from Majorgeeks or MDL and if possible install latest dx runtimes from Steam game libraries or get it from MSFT.
After installing everything, compile binaries optimised for your PC configuration(Nvidia and Intel must be present, reset bios to defaults for optimal results).
Open up cmd prompt as admin and type the following in serial order:

Code:

cd C:\Windows\Microsoft.NET\Framework\v4.0.30319
ngen update
cd C:\Windows\Microsoft.NET\Framework64\v4.0.30319
ngen update

Afterwards, use Dism to cleanup older SxS and update files:

Code:

Dism /Online /Cleanup-Image /StartComponentCleanup /ResetBase

 

Very clever, good job! Might I ask what version of the nvidia driver you have on your system?

 

Sorry, I should've been clearer: by 'disabled', I mean in the BIOS, I set the notebook to use Optimus switchable graphics, so that I could maximise the battery. It doesn't seem like it at all, as I can't get more than 4-5 hours. This is a brand-new computer.

Thank you for the detailed reply. I'm curious though. What do VC++ runtimes have to do with the CPU being pegged high? Also, I tried the ngen update command, and I received a ton of errors, saying:

Code:

Failed to load dependency Microsoft.VisualStudio.OLE.Interop of assembly Microsoft.VisualStudio.Tools.Office.ContainerControl, Version=10.0.0.0, Culture=neutral, PublicKeyToken=b03f5f7f11d50a3a because of the following error : The system cannot find the file specified. (Exception from HRESULT: 0x80070002)
All compilation targets are up to date.

I've got 392.00. I have a Quadro P3200 inside my notebook—couldn't find the time to post a signature yet, perhaps I should do that now.

 

[QUOTE="Ionising_Radiation, post:


I've got 392.00. I have a Quadro P3200 inside my notebook—couldn't find the time to post a signature yet, perhaps I should do that now.[/QUOTE]


You could try wiping those drivers and letting windows install it's default ones and see what happens?

 

Errors are fine. VC++ are libraries which helps older/newer apps/games run smoothly like intended w/o compatibility issues.
Did cpu usage % decrease for you?

 

Not at all. I don't have any games installed, no Steam, even.

 

So CPU usage hasn't dropped?

 

Alright.. well I'm nearly running out of idea but I will keep trying to help and do some critical thinking
Due to you have Quadro P3200 [I just noticed today] so there drivers are meant to be more power hungry while not in use even.. even if it is 0 MHz.. it will still draw power..

To me & depending to my knowledge... due to it is Quadro P3200 it is normal that you see more or higher power draw during idle. so... correct me if I'm wrong. So...

My last solution (It won't be related to your idle power consumption) but it will help :-
So.. to be able to save some power while using your laptop.. you won't notice decrease in performance significantly but you will notice significantly less power consumption while in use
Use Nvidia Profile Inspector... you can download the latest version from my attachment because the original author download link is currently down https://ci.appveyor.com/project/Orbmu2k/nvidiaprofileinspector/build/artifacts

So .. open nvidiaProfileInspector.exe and then search for Battery Boost and Enable it as you can see below the picture...


I hope it helps you

 

After searching this forum, i found out that analog i/o refers to system agent and vice versa on latest 8th gen processors. In that case, should i undervolt iGPU and analog i/o equally instead of system agent?

 

Alright, @unclewebb, @THEBOSS619, @Papusan, @Che0063, @Vasudev and anyone else who's tried to help me with this issue...

For some reason, my idle CPU power has gone down, and the battery discharge rate is around 10–15 W. I suppose I can bring this down further with an undervolt, but some photos first:

ProcExp showing System at a more reasonable power consumption:


HWiNFO Discharge rate:


Exception is ThrottleStop, which still shows around 5–10% CPU usage with five Chrome tabs, Adobe Acrobat, HWiNFO and a custom Sticky Notes app running in the background:


Otherwise, I'm pleased with the power reduction. How, I don't really know. Now, I'd like to learn more about undervolting and tweaking clocks/time limits in ThrottleStop accurately for maximum efficiency on battery, as well as maximum performance while keeping temperatures manageable, while plugged in. Hence, I plan to have two profiles in ThrottleStop. Any advice, guys? Thanks so much.

 

On the Performance profile,you want to enable Speed Shift EEP and set it to 64 or even 0.
On the Battery one,you want to disable Turbo(Unless you plan on doing heavy tasks).

 

Yes, absolutely.

 

Hmmm... maybe I think due to first use of Windows 10? I mean.. during first few days of use.. Windows 10 is doing or finishing something in the background related to telemetry or Windows Update or something.. who knows.. as long as you are satisfied

although 10~15 W is still high but I will show you mine.. I took 2 screenshots on random occasions while on battery use..




although I use some equalizer EPO for music which force my timer resolution to 1 but maybe I get those results because I debloated heavily on my windows 10? mine usually between 4~7 W on 40% ~ 50% screen brightness on battery.
I guess without using this equalizer I may get lower watts

Edit:-This one right now

 

Before you start fiddeling with undervolt...

If you have put up ThrottleStop to start with task scheduler I would add in the command below (If you not already have done it). See... If you can not log into Windows due you used too low voltage it will be a lot easier for you to come into Windows safe mode and remove the TS INI file in the TS folder. Next time you boot up into Windows ThrottleStop it will start up all over again with clean default settings.

Or you can use one of the 4 profiles as startup with stock voltage for testing purposes.

Win10/8.1 'F8' Boot options 'Safe Mode' & 'Disable driver Signing'
cmd (Admin)
bcdedit /set {default} bootmenupolicy legacy

 

You need to Turn ON TS for it to work. Uncheck Speedstep and check off Speedshift. I reckon you have a MUX switch to switch between Intel and Nvidia. Set undervolt values using Intel GPU for judging stable undervolt values because when you change to Nvidia you might need a little less voltage for iGPU.
With C10 you can get 0.3W on pkg power. I didn't get my hands on Xeon M chips so I can't say for sure if my steps can guide you.

 

@Vasudev Are Alienware 6700hq locked to C6 only? or it can go and reach C10?

 

Dell has locked to C6 or C7(very rare) states because Intel CPU docs suggest that going higher than C6/C7 can lockup the entire PC and might not recover from than state forcing user to hard reset or power off the PC. Intel also asked OEMs to include BIOS patches as well.
That's why only some OEMs like Lenovo,HP or MSI allow C8.

 

Thank you for that info..

 

Re: 2 different offset voltages, I noticed my i7-7700HQ is capable of running -250mv offsets no problem at load. The instant load drops, system freezes. I think this is either because the voltage is too low for for the lower clock multis. I can probably test this if I had enough time to restart my computer a few times.

But because I can't just use offsets under the highest multis, I have to settle for the -125mv that my machine appears to be stable at. It's still great. Just not maximumgreat.

Regarding the more relevant part, I've been using Throttlestop since version i think 3-or-4-something. I was a kid when I first found this stuff. Now I'm 30 and TS is still the default tool for me to use. To me the extent of support and continuous iteration on this project over so many years with no financial expectation is mind-boggling. It is what is most amazing about DIY and what is tragic about it.

I think a partial solution to this issue might come from the software development world. I noticed there is no public github or similar repository for the ThrottleStop code and its versions. I don't know if you have TS under any kind of software license, but I'm sure there has to be some kind of public license out there that can fit the user-driven narrative of this tool while allowing you to implement some kind of necessary revenue-generating strategy to improve the tool.

ThrottleStop may end up living a long time if it met these needs:
- revenues for unclewebb's time and the very real costs of the CPU/laptop inventory needed just to have the actual platforms to test with on hand
- a public repo that the forum community is conditioned to work with, with support for ticketing, checking out code, potentially joining in with actual code commits
- a public wiki where the community can contribute some of the decade-hidden info forgotten between all the threads (btw, NBR, as awesome as it is, is still a property completely separate from TS, and if anything ever happens with NBR, the TS knowledge may be lost)
- a premium option, perhaps, for people like me who have reached a point in life where i'm no longer completely incapable of paying for the tools I use. I could do $15/month, maybe even $50 (i wouldn't like $50, but I could see myself spending it - some of the machines I use are literally crippled without throttlestop, and there's not really a better all-around option out there). A fixed price is also an option.

In short, I think TS needs some infrastructure for the long-term. As it is, if @unclewebb decides that a decade of work on this is enough, there's nobody that has any moral ground to complain, imo.

I could help with some of the above, I think - it would probably take a while, but I can definitely point some fingers in the right direction.

 

Should I undervolt the iGPU considering that it's already very low-power?

 

Thought you guys might be interested:



This is the Pentium G4560, a 54W (probably a binned and overclocked and overvolted 6500U or 7500U, I've never seen it use more than 30W even with AIDA64 CPU plus iGPU) Desktop LGA1151 Kaby-lake chip, from the computer I built for my parents. I never bothered to optimize it until today when I played around the BIOS and realised most of the power saving settings were disable. So I enabled them.

Despite being hard-limited to C2, and having a 1.9% C0% rate, it's idling at 0.4W. Constantly. Not like mine, where it'll idle at 0.4W for 4 seconds and on the 5th second it jumps to 0.7W. This is a desktop chip on an fully-fledged (Well, integrated graphics) ATX custom built PC. From 2016. I didn't spend hours trying to optimize it like I have done on my previous laptops, yet the CPU idles at a lower power consumption than any laptop I've seen.

Shake my head.

 

My recommendation would be to have them split up between families of CPUs - U/Y, HQ/HK, K, Most generations are exactly the same within each other.

I've been thinking of writing a guide for 4th+ gen U CPUs for some time, but my priority has always to reduce power consumption, whilst most people here seem to have HQ/HK and want to maximise performance. I think that my guide would just get ignored by some newbs and pushed to the bottom by newer questions asked by those who can't be arsed to use the search button.

Happens to all forums :/

 

ThrottleStop 8.70 - PremaMod Edition
September 9, 2018

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1lCqWxTC6du6Q2sbBWHh9BV3CEMFGWcRv



New Features
- improved WinRing0 security and memory access by Sam Haskins.
- ability to disable and lock the memory mapped turbo power limits.
- added IccMax adjustment.
- fixed FIVR voltage names for Skylake and newer CPUs.
- regular system tray CPU temperature updates in Stop Data mode.
- single click system tray icons and new Logo Min option.
- smaller Turbo Power Limits window.

@Prema thought it would be interesting to have a version without a title bar. To exit you can use a right menu option or even easier, use the ESC key on your keyboard while TS is active. To Minimize, you can also use a menu option or left click on the Prema logo. This was kind of annoying at first but now after using it for a while, I like it. If you do not like this feature, disable the Logo Min feature in the Options window. Next version will have an ugly title bar if I get enough negative feedback.

Sam Haskins sent me some code recently which fixes a security vulnerability in the WinRing0 driver. He also wrote some code so ThrottleStop can finally access the secondary turbo power limits that are located in memory. This experimental feature will disable and lock the power limit register. Using ThrottleStop and especially this new feature is at your own risk. Disabling power limits can result in significant increases in power consumption and heat. You could also permanently damage your battery if you do this while running on battery power.

To use this feature, you need to download and install the RwDrv.sys file into your ThrottleStop folder. There is a download link located in the ThrottleStop folder as well as a download link and instructions within the program itself. I have tried to contact the author to ask for his approval to include this driver with ThrottleStop but so far I have not heard back from him. Best to play it safe and keep this file separate from the main ThrottleStop download until I have his approval.

IccMax adjustment does not need too much explanation. Increasing IccMax may help with some types of EDP throttling.

Hopefully the voltage names are now correct for the newer CPUs. Programming without access to the full Intel documentation is never perfect.

The Turbo Power Limits window has had some information removed from it. I am making room for a long time request, per profile power limits. Some of the terminology has been changed so Intel XTU users will not have to scratch their heads too much when changing to TS.

I do not own or have access to any recent laptops so your feedback is definitely needed. Include lots of pictures.

Edit - I almost forgot. Contact me if you have an older desktop or laptop with an unlocked 2nd or 3rd Gen Extreme or K series CPU. I included a hidden feature that might help with overclocking.

 

That's great. Thanks unclewebb.

I tested it and it seems to be no problem. Beautiful and amazing. What's the great job! Thanks again.

Just some minor things I would like to mention,
1) About the "Disable and Lock Turbo Power Limits", I do not know there is program or flow limitation or not, why not put this option in "TPL" Window? I think it is better for other users to know what it is.
2) Could you add a feature that remember the window position(or last position it opened) so the TS will always display in the same desired position?
3) Does the border of the window disappear as the previous one? In my view, it is pretty cool without the border.

Thanks.

BTW, you signature is not yet updated.

 

TS 8.70 is still a secret. It would be great to see some success stories first.

1) The Disable & Lock feature came to me very recently so I stuck it where I had an open spot available. Just finished doing some house cleaning in the TPL window so if this new feature is a keeper, putting it in there would be a good idea.

2) I will look into doing this for the next version.

3) Border adjustments are on the things to do list too. User feedback is always appreciated and will make TS better.

 

Thanks for the continuous development.

Personally, I'm not a fan of the click to minimize, a window without the title bar looks odd. I guess I could get used to it though.


The grey buttons look a bit meh as well, though maybe that was intentional. Suddenly I can't remember what colour those buttons were back in 8.6 lol.



Since you have the RW-Driver, can you add something to change the power limit installed in FED159A0? I remember you saying that TS does not have access to the things that XTU had and I'm not sure if that's related to the new driver. Also, I'm curious as to where TS sets the Turbo Boost Power Limits - they certainly have an effect if I set it lower than FED159A0.

Development has certainly gone far and I'm grateful for your hard work - looking at old TS screenshots always gives me nostalgia from back in the days when I was such a noob.

 

This version is not going to be for everyone. Prema wanted to give this a try so now he can. After I get some feedback, I am sure there will be a TechPowerUp version with a title bar or at least an option to toggle the title bar on and off.

If you want to give the new Disable and Lock feature a try, exit RWEverything, check this new box in the FIVR window, press OK and then start up RWEverything and have a look at the power limit register. Might be a surprise in there.

Me too! I had no idea that TS would still be in active development in 2018. It was an afternoon project and I thought it would be enough to encourage all manufacturers to get their acts together and start producing laptops that actually worked properly. I was young and foolish back then.

 

Hmmm... Mixed feelings about this. On one hand it'll be a great and easy feature to disable power limit throttling, but I don't know if that's safe. I would still appreciate a button to specifically set a power limit e.g. 25W. Disabling it entirely could be dangerous for some poorly-engineered laptops. I've seen my 8250U use 50W under a prime95 + Furmark test on the GPU and iGPU - for a Dell XPS, that means instant 99C and throttling lol.

I've been needing to create a script for this for a long time. I'll need to dive through the documentation again lol.

 

Oh i see, get it, thanks unclewebb.

 

I like it. Works nice with my i9-7960X. I would like to see the title bar and no gray windows border, but functionality is great as always, bro.

 

Unclewebb, what is "VR Faults" and "VR efficiency mode"?

It says "VR Faults" is "Enabled" but unchecked. (same with efficiency).
Thank you for the new TS.

 

Well I've the same issue and PM'ed uncleweb on how to get used to new TS.
In one word, TS 8.7 is great for overclockers and bad news for noobs.

 

Those are settings I normally disable in the BIOS. My Asus desktop boards have it and so did my Clevos with @Prema BIOS. Those settings do what their name implies. They override VR fault protection and "efficiency" limitations that hinder performance. You can toggle them enabled/disabled by adding/removing the check mark and hitting the button to apply changes.

 

Hi Fox, thank you.
The checkbox doesn't do anything. If I check and apply, as soon as I exit the FIVR window its back where it started It seems non functional here.

That Clevo 9900K simply cannot get here fast enough

 

You're welcome, bro. It sounds like maybe your BIOS does not support that and perhaps ThrottleStop cannot override it if it is locked.

 

I asked Prema, how about a TS version without a title bar and he said, "Definitely without title-bar!" He's the boss on this version but no worries, a week or two from now there will be another TS version, with a title bar or perhaps a title bar that can be toggled on or off to keep everyone happy.

@Johnksss had a newer CPU and wanted to know why the VR Faults and VR Efficiency Mode options were grayed out. When both of these are Enabled on my 4th Gen laptop, I can clear those boxes, push Apply and both of these will change to Disabled. When I check both options and hit Apply again, VR Efficiency Mode goes back to Enabled but VR Faults remains Disabled until after I reboot.

On the newer 7th & 8th Gen CPUs, the bios might enable these by default and the ability to disable them after booting up could be gone. I decided that there is no reason to leave these options grayed out. What control you have over these is probably up to your CPU or the bios.

Without a title bar and minimize gadget available, a user needs a quick and easy way to minimize TS. When this option is Enabled, a single click on the Prema logo will minimize TS. It took a while to warm up to this option but now I love it. Instead of having to go up and click on a small gadget in the title bar, now I have a huge area that I can click on to minimize TS. Give it a try. After a week you might not miss the missing title bar.

This might happen very soon for TS insiders like yourself. Check your message box later today. I will see what I can do. TS 8.70.1

I am sure that will make Team Prema very happy!

I had mixed feelings about adding this new feature to TS too. In the wrong hands, it could be dangerous but TS is already full of features that could be dangerous in the wrong hands. This feature is about taking CPU control away from manufacturers and giving control back to consumers. They are the ones that are spending their hard earned money on new technology that in some situations, is not living up to the marketing hype due to overly aggressive throttling schemes.

This feature only disables the power limits in the memory section. Once these limits are disabled, you can still use TS to set some appropriate power limits. You can also use the new per profile IccMax feature to keep a lid on your CPU and prevent it from becoming the next Chernobyl.

I hope you do not mean the TS documentation. The guy that writes that stuff quit this project a long time ago.

 

Awesome, thank you.

Yes, indeed. Not sure why it would not always make everyone happy to have more usable features that can be enabled/disabled based on individual user preference. But, I know there can be examples where the OEM/ODM Nazis have taken the liberty of locking ranges and registers to castrate their junkbooks. Shameful stuff.

 

Great news and looking forward to your new version. Thanks.

 

Even after enabling lock turbo power limit option, my laptop still hits power limit throttling (pl2 and edp others) while running benchmark tools like tsbench and cinebench. I increased pl1 and pl2 to 70, increased iccmax for cpu core , but nothing seems to work Is there any other way to overcome this limit? I have acer nitro 5 with i7 8750h and 1050ti with 135w adapter, currently running -150mv on core and cache and -100 on igpu n system agent. Thanks in advance.

 

I love the 'no title bar' actually. Very nice and makes it look a lot better. I'm happy. But I know some people are not happy.

MSI has the "FED159A0" power limits already set to infinite or 0. Locking these or unlocking doesn't do anything on these systems (although you can make lower power limits to create more throttling . The PECI power limits are unfortunately the ones which control everything on MSI throttlebooks @Papusan @Mr. Fox If the Embedded Controller likes the "envelope" your system is working under (e.g. >30% battery level, under maximum AC power allowance for the video card that is installed (seriously), you can draw as much power via the MSR / Bios overrides until the (Zener Diodes) trip the laptop and it shuts off. If you bypass some restriction MSI has set for your system, the PECI kicks in and limits your CPU to 45W by force, or sometimes cuts the multiplier down to 800 mhz (if the video card is drawing way too much power; e.g. TDP modded gtx 1070's, or stock 1080's).

On battery power, all bios power limits are overridden and forced back to 45W TDP with the overrides "Ignored". BD Prochot also gets flagged if too much power is drawn. If BD Prochot is disabled or the GPU is using too much power on battery power (this only happens if you are using a TDP mod and changed the "Extreme" power limit rails in the out of date Pascal bios editor), the EC trips the laptop for exceeding battery limit.

(there is a way to disable battery power monitoring via the EC RAM registers in RW Everything, but this is DANGEROUS And can destroy the battery).

 

@Falkentyne

Just depends on the board it's loaded on. Not all options will work and more importantly....Not all options represent the right setting for the voltage displayed.

Example.... The system agent and analog voltages are reversed for some boards. And on other systems the system agent is the uncore voltage.

 

ThrottleStop 8.70.1
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1BASFT8ZyCpgXnLs2Zi_tvGvfQA-Q_GkO

- added title bars.
- less gray buttons.
- thinner boarders.

 

All excellent reasons to boycott MSI trashbooks. They use cancer firmware to castrate their products, even with the 16L13 with a desktop CPU.