New M6500 Discussion Thread

mannyA · Jan 27, 2010

Bokeh said: ↑

Just off an hour long conference call with several Dell managers and engineers.

The Samsung LTN170CT08-D01 is made to Dell's specs. It is the only panel being shipped. It is a native 8 bit panel. There is no dithering, HiFRC, or magic sauce to get to 8 bits.

The issues I am seeing are most likely coming from the software side.

In fact, you could tell that the people involved put a lot of thought and effort into the hardware that makes up the M6500. You can also hear how much pride they put into their work.

I just talked to 5 people from Dell that are committed to helping me (and others that have purchased the machine) out in any way that they can to get the most out of the M6500. They were patient and answered all of my questions. They were not condescending when filling me in on things that I did not already know or understand completely. They restored a lot of my faith in Dell as a company.

You know, we pull all of the data that we can from a lot of sources online, and sometimes we get it right and sometimes we get it wrong. I thought that just because the basic Samsung LTN170CT was a 6 bit panel, that the variant in the M6500 must also be 6 bits, but I was wrong. I am glad that Dell gave me the correct information and I want to pass it on so that others don't make the same mistake in the future when they are looking for info on this Samsung panel.
Click to expand...

Bokeh

Oh really show me. don't tell me!!! LTN170CT08-D01

buddy, are you doing the old back pedal?

c2c2c2 · Jan 27, 2010

Bokeh said: ↑

Just a quick picture for those with the M6500.

Its a pic of a hummingbird that I took. The background is mostly neutral greens that are very much thrown into bokeh by the shallow depth of field. Look at the red flowers in front. You should be able to see the difference between the red in the shade and the red in the sun.

The flowers in the sun seem to me to get too bright and lose their detail. This is the detail that I can see on my other displays and want to also see on the M6500.

Here is the pic...
Click to expand...

Beautiful picture - very well done!

AdamHLG · Jan 27, 2010

Bokeh,

Thanks for the information. Out of curiosity did they say anything about the sRGB and aRGB mode display irregularities, i.e, is a patch forthcoming?

keithsnell · Jan 27, 2010

Bokeh said: ↑

Just a quick picture for those with the M6500.

Its a pic of a hummingbird that I took. The background is mostly neutral greens that are very much thrown into bokeh by the shallow depth of field. Look at the red flowers in front. You should be able to see the difference between the red in the shade and the red in the sun.

The flowers in the sun seem to me to get too bright and lose their detail. This is the detail that I can see on my other displays and want to also see on the M6500.

Here is the pic...
Click to expand...

First, thanks for the update on your discussions with Dell. That puts to rest much of the speculation. By the way, that same panel is produced for HP for their Dreamcolor display and for Lenovo for their upcoming w700 replacement (that's the one I almost held out for, since the built in (custom filtered) color calibrator would have been nice.)

I can't really get a sense for the color in your image because it is saved as a bmp image without an embedded color space. That means the colors will be wildly different depending on which three of my monitors I view it on. The only way to keep consistent color across displays is to embed a color space tag in the file, and open it in a color managed/color aware application. We can't do that with the file you posted.

mannyA · Jan 27, 2010

Bokeh said: ↑

The flowers in the sun seem to me to get too bright and lose their detail. This is the detail that I can see on my other displays and want to also see on the M6500.

Here is the pic...
Click to expand...

Bokeh,

Dont wimp out on me. We what the truth.

mannyA · Jan 27, 2010

Bokeh know,

Bokeh said: ↑

!! - See my post later on in the thread. Much of the information that I posted below is incorrect. The Samsung LTN170CT08-D01 is in fact an 8 bit panel that is made to Dell's specs.

I would not go that far. The RGBLED backlighting does in fact give us the Adobe color gamut. So that part of the marketing is correct. Looking over the individual M6400 and M6500 pages, there is no mention of color depth, only color gamut.

BUT, when you click on the "Help me choose" link when choosing a display on the M6400 and M6500, you get this:

"Amazing color gamut and color depth: Premier color supported Dell PrecisionTM laptops offer over 100% color gamut with true 24-bit color depth which supports over 16.7 million color palettes. The concentrated Red, Green and Blue LED lights generates true deep black in high contrast."

Which means that Dell is promising "true" 24bit (8bit + 8bit + 8bit) on their Precision laptops with RGBLED backlights. This is where they messed up. The color is either true 24 bit or simulated 24 bit.

The only panel that gives true 24 bit color is the LG. I know it used to come with the M6400, not sure about the M6500.
Click to expand...

Bokeh,

You are back pedaling?

This is what you said before, that’s cold

Bokeh said: ↑

I would not go that far. The RGBLED backlighting does in fact give us the Adobe color gamut. So that part of the marketing is correct. Looking over the individual M6400 and M6500 pages, there is no mention of color depth, only color gamut.

BUT, when you click on the "Help me choose" link when choosing a display on the M6400 and M6500, you get this:

"Amazing color gamut and color depth: Premier color supported Dell PrecisionTM laptops offer over 100% color gamut with true 24-bit color depth which supports over 16.7 million color palettes. The concentrated Red, Green and Blue LED lights generates true deep black in high contrast."

Which means that Dell is promising "true" 24bit (8bit + 8bit + 8bit) on their Precision laptops with RGBLED backlights. This is where they messed up. The color is either true 24 bit or simulated 24 bit.

The only panel that gives true 24 bit color is the LG. I know it used to come with the M6400, not sure about the M6500.
Click to expand...

mitchellboy · Jan 27, 2010

Bokeh said: ↑

Just off an hour long ...The issues I am seeing are most likely coming from the software side...
Click to expand...

Bokeh, You use Nvidia card and I use ATI card, but both of us got the same issues. Which software caused this problem? Graphic card driver? Dont tell me it is Windows 7

Bokeh · Jan 27, 2010

keithsnell said: ↑

First, thanks for the update on your discussions with Dell. That puts to rest much of the speculation. By the way, that same panel is produced for HP for their Dreamcolor display and for Lenovo for their upcoming w700 replacement (that's the one I almost held out for, since the built in (custom filtered) color calibrator would have been nice.)

I can't really get a sense for the color in your image because it is saved as a bmp image without an embedded color space. That means the colors will be wildly different depending on which three of my monitors I view it on. The only way to keep consistent color across displays is to embed a color space tag in the file, and open it in a color managed/color aware application. We can't do that with the file you posted.
Click to expand...

Weird, should have saved in jpg with color space embedded. Will double check it.

mannyA · Jan 27, 2010

Bokeh said: ↑

Just off an hour long conference call with several Dell managers and engineers.

The Samsung LTN170CT08-D01 is made to Dell's specs. It is the only panel being shipped. It is a native 8 bit panel. There is no dithering, HiFRC, or magic sauce to get to 8 bits.

The issues I am seeing are most likely coming from the software side.

In fact, you could tell that the people involved put a lot of thought and effort into the hardware that makes up the M6500. You can also hear how much pride they put into their work.

I just talked to 5 people from Dell that are committed to helping me (and others that have purchased the machine) out in any way that they can to get the most out of the M6500. They were patient and answered all of my questions. They were not condescending when filling me in on things that I did not already know or understand completely. They restored a lot of my faith in Dell as a company.

You know, we pull all of the data that we can from a lot of sources online, and sometimes we get it right and sometimes we get it wrong. I thought that just because the basic Samsung LTN170CT was a 6 bit panel, that the variant in the M6500 must also be 6 bits, but I was wrong. I am glad that Dell gave me the correct information and I want to pass it on so that others don't make the same mistake in the future when they are looking for info on this Samsung panel.
Click to expand...

Bokeh,

google this part number: LTN170CT08-D01 you will get nothing, except this thread.

and know you are saying There is no dithering, HiFRC, or magic sauce to get to 8 bits.

when you know that Twisted nematic (TN) panels represent colors using only 6bits per color, instead of 8bits
thus is not able to display the 16.7 million color shades (24-bit truecolor). with out using Frame Rate Control (FRC).

come on Bokeh what's going on, dude give it up.

I want you to prove me wrong that would be a good thing.

Bokeh · Jan 27, 2010

mannyA said: ↑

Bokeh know,

Bokeh,

You are back pedaling?

This is what you said before, thats cold
Click to expand...

I am just relaying new information. Right now it looks like I made wrong assumptions before. In the next couple of weeks I will be working to fully understand what is going on with the panel and colors.

Do you work for IBM/lenovo?

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mannyA Notebook Evangelist

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Maybe a next generation Precision (xx70?) pre-release discussion thread?

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